Let's talk Air Conditioners (Phoenix: home, to buy, contractors)

[wit-nit]

Quote: Originally Posted by DellNec Due to the extreme heat of Phoenix and the abnormally long cooling season, central A/C systems last on average about 7-10 years

If that was true the AC companies would not be warranting them for 10 years.

We had a Carrier last over 30 years and a Goettel unit last 22 years before needing replacement.

[DellNec]

It is a known fact that the extreme heat, much longer operating time/season and the blazing sun in the Phoenix area will shorten the life of components like an A/C, as well as an asphalt roof and things like a car battery, tires, etc.

"Air Conditioning systems in cooler climates can last 2 or 3 times longer than the same air conditioner in a hot climate. Increased run times and very high heat lead to system wear out and quicker failure. HVAC OpCost | Find HVAC Contractorcalculates the average operating hours for an air conditioner to be 4 times greater in our desert climate than moderate climates like Illinois or Michigan."


Repair vs. Replace | Chas Robert's Phoenix Air Conditioning Repair & Replacement

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by Zippyman

I've installed several goodmans and had no problems with them - the Copeland scroll compressor is the heart of the unit, and it's the same design in all the major brands. ....
If it makes you feel better to spend too much money, buy a fancy brand, IMHO, they're just appliances.

I 2nd Zippy's advice. Goodman is new kid on the block so they have to fight with price. You won't see them advertise on the radio or TV. They use those common off the shelf components that most others use. I put the AC and furnace in my MN house before I sold and saved a good deal of $$'s and they have a 10 year warranty.

See Goodman® Residential Gas Furnaces

[sells500]

Awesome stuff everyone, as I said I am just trying to get what everyone wants the best quality, lasting the longest without repair for the best price. One thing I just did was add additional insulation to the attic, as I am an engineer and always look from the root up, I felt this was the best first step. I feel a little better about amana/goodman now. I don't feel any a/c will last 7-10 years, unless diagnosed improperly or installed improperly more like 15-20, but everyone is entitled to their opinion. I fielded all this past my installer to see what he has to say and am waiting for a reply, thanks for the link to the site for purchasing amana/goodman it's good to have this info.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

I 2nd Zippy's advice. Goodman is new kid on the block so they have to fight with price. You won't see them advertise on the radio or TV. They use those common off the shelf components that most others use. I put the AC and furnace in my MN house before I sold and saved a good deal of $$'s and they have a 10 year warranty.

See Goodman® Residential Gas Furnaces

They may be a more recently formed company than some of the old names, but they have quickly grabbed market share. Goodman is now the largest manufacturer of residential systems in the US. There's an asterisk or two with that but the point is that they sell a LOT of AC units here and elsewhere.

[Rick Lee]

My Lennox is still going strong after 16 yrs. I keep the 2500 sq/ft, one-level house at 81 deg. in the summer. I spend about $1800 per year total with APS. I've been quoted around $7k for a new unit. I don't see how any new unit's improved efficiency would make it worthwhile to get before my current one totally dies. At current electricity prices, even if a new a/c saved $100 a month off my summer APS bills, it'd take 15-20 yrs. to pay for itself. And I'm kind of wondering how my home warranty will deal with an a/c breakdown. I know they'll want to do cheap band-aid fixes, but eventually that becomes a false economy too.

[BabsJohnson]

What you haven't figured here is the future price of an efficient unit. Just before 911 I priced a new Carrier variable speed split system. I put it off. Two years later it was 1 to 1.5K higher. Doh!

[Zippyman]

Originally Posted by DellNec

It is a known fact that the extreme heat, much longer operating time/season and the blazing sun in the Phoenix area will shorten the life of components like an A/C, as well as an asphalt roof and things like a car battery, tires, etc.

"Air Conditioning systems in cooler climates can last 2 or 3 times longer than the same air conditioner in a hot climate. Increased run times and very high heat lead to system wear out and quicker failure. HVAC OpCost | Find HVAC Contractorcalculates the average operating hours for an air conditioner to be 4 times greater in our desert climate than moderate climates like Illinois or Michigan."


Repair vs. Replace | Chas Robert's Phoenix Air Conditioning Repair & Replacement

The idea that a/c units last "two or three times longer" in northern climates is an unfounded lie. In northern climates, it's extremely common to have the indoor coil corrode due to the high humidity, and for most people, that means a system replacement. That almost never happens in the desert. I've pulled out several 20+ year old units here in the desert, so unless they're lasting 40-60 years in Michigan and Illinois, (and they aren't!) I call BS.

[tiger08]

Originally Posted by Zippyman

The top of the line Amana (18 seer, 2-stage compressor, variable speed blower + fancy-pants touch-screen thermostat) can be ordered over the net for ~$4200 in the four-ton size, a little less if you need a smaller unit. That price includes delivery to your door - according to some of the Hvac guys I've spoken with, they claim those prices are lower than the installers get here in Phoenix. Apparently, south florida is a highly-competitive market for Hvac manufacturers, so they get better pricing.

Here's where I got mine.

Heat Pumps | Air Conditioners | Gas Furnaces | Wholesale - Communicating Systems

If you were quoted $10k, know that you're paying $5800 for labor, overhead + profit.

Never buy a cooling or heating system over the net! The factory warranty is void and you will have to get warranty service through the internet comany that sold you the unit.

Example: Your a/c breaks down on a hot day. If the unit was bought locally at a supply house, any repairman can come to your house, run the serial number and warranty the work for you.

If a repairman comes and runs the serial number on the internet unit, it comes back void! You will have to pay someone to remove the part and send it to the internet company for a replacement, then you have to pay someone to come back and install the new part. Thats after you waited a few days for the new part and had no air at the same time.

If you really want to do a self install, call a few local contractors and get them to sell you a unit outright.

[Zippyman]

Originally Posted by tiger08

Never buy a cooling or heating system over the net! The factory warranty is void and you will have to get warranty service through the internet comany that sold you the unit.

Example: Your a/c breaks down on a hot day. If the unit was bought locally at a supply house, any repairman can come to your house, run the serial number and warranty the work for you.

If a repairman comes and runs the serial number on the internet unit, it comes back void! You will have to pay someone to remove the part and send it to the internet company for a replacement, then you have to pay someone to come back and install the new part. Thats after you waited a few days for the new part and had no air at the same time.

If you really want to do a self install, call a few local contractors and get them to sell you a unit outright.

Again, this is *bull*, I've bought & installed several units over the net, if you run the serial #s on the manufacturers website, they show full warranties. The local parts houses don't like internet sales because they're *gouging* Phoenix residents for these appliances, but they can't "void" warranties willy-nilly. There are some federal laws involved that preclude that kind of thing.