Recent house hunters, how negotiable are sellers currently? (Phoenix, Scottsdale: foreclosure, appliances)

[DetroitN8V]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

If you are in a job interview and you insult the employer, he isn't going to make a business decision. You may be the best candidate but he is going to pass on you. He will take it personal and not hire you. It isn't always about taking the emotions out of it. If there are multiple offers on the home, the seller can chose. If it's priced fairly, 10% off is an insult. Hell, 5% off is as well. If you run into a seller like me, I will make darn sure you don't get the house. I know I am not alone. In my mind independent of the insult, I imagine a PITA. Wanting to play games with trying to leverage small things you want fixed later on etc. Perception will win out. If I have other offers, why bother with you? Got cash? Maybe then I can understand a lower 5% offer. At 20% down, that's all too common.

You bring up points about people that are pricing their property over market. If it is 20% over market, then offer 20% less. But if it is a really nice property and you know it is priced fair, it WILL go for around asking. Maybe even a little more. So why play games trying to get a better deal just in case you think you are leaving money on the table.

If I was in the head of your real estate agent, he is telling you to go close to asking on fairly priced properties. Why? Because he doesn't want to play games. And you "only" have 20% down.

I'm not sure why you keep insinuating that I'm playing games. Again, I asked a hypothetical question to get a feel for the market. 10% off was purely arbitrary. You've made it clear that my agent is shooting it straight with me in telling me multiple offers are very common and prices aren't very negotiable. Thank you for confirming this. After knowing this, I would have to be a fool to expect that an offer significantly below the list price would be accepted. I'm still not sure how many of these deals will close when there aren't comps to support the recently increased values but I suppose time will tell.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by DetroitN8V

The house next to the lot we were looking at sold for $490K. They're not as expensive because they're in the north pole! The base price was $415K or so, plus they're giving a $30k incentive which more than covers the lot. We want to be able to put 20% down so sadly $500k is the max for us.

Thanks, patience is not my strong suit so this is never a fun process for me!

LOL, I know how that goes. But you have to work on it. I hate to think back on all the money I have lost both buying and selling because I was too impatient to wait for the right offer.

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by DetroitN8V

I'm not sure why you keep insinuating that I'm playing games.

I'm not saying you are playing games. I am talking about a perception. If someone offers me below market, I have a perception about that person. It may be completely wrong. But perception becomes reality in my mind for this transaction. That's all. If I am not in the drivers seat (a buyers market), that's a different story.

Re: comps. If it wasn't for cash buyers, appreciation would be well below market. So conservative appraisal values have/are dictating what properties sell for. That's why sellers think "cash is king". They will take less for a guaranteed deal. But often times CASH is actually your best deal (even if it is less because things won't appraise). That's why 20% down isn't attractive if you are competing with cash. A year ago in the Valley, 40% of the deals were cash. That's your competition.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

I'm not saying you are playing games. I am talking about a perception. If someone offers me below market, I have a perception about that person. It may be completely wrong. But perception becomes reality in my mind for this transaction. That's all. If I am not in the drivers seat (a buyers market), that's a different story.

Re: comps. If it wasn't for cash buyers, appreciation would be well below market. So conservative appraisal values have/are dictating what properties sell for. That's why sellers think "cash is king". They will take less for a guaranteed deal. But often times CASH is actually your best deal (even if it is less because things won't appraise). That's why 20% down isn't attractive if you are competing with cash. A year ago in the Valley, 40% of the deals were cash. That's your competition.

I've never seen a house that did not have at least a couple points of "pad" in the price. Even in a seller's market, a smart seller knows a buyer has to have the "perception" that they got a deal. 10% off is probably too much to expect and it might just result in no counter at all. I would try 5 myself and be willing to settle near 2% off or a deal on closing/accepting some of the problems that an inspector invents without a fuss.

Of course, if you are in love with the house and must have it then in housing as in life you are finished and you better just ante up.

[DetroitN8V]

I wonder if cash buyers are as prevalent as they were at the bottom of the market. With prices that have gone back up, buyers need to be in it for the long haul so I would have to assume a lot of investors have gone elsewhere.

[youthinkso]

Cash is still prevalent. There is a lot of foreign money in the valley that isn't tied to the local economy.

Arizona RE still runs full page ads in Canada.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by youthinkso

Cash is still prevalent. There is a lot of foreign money in the valley that isn't tied to the local economy.

I agree. Pretty much everything that has come up for sale in my neighborhood has been bought by Canadians for cash of late. And they are paying top dollar. It's gonna be a ghost town come summer.

[youthinkso]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

I agree. Pretty much everything that has come up for sale in my neighborhood has been bought by Canadians for cash of late. And they are paying top dollar. It's gonna be a ghost town come summer.

ahh you going to miss all those noisy drunks with the Molson Muscles aren't you

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by youthinkso

ahh you going to miss all those noisy drunks with the Molson Muscles aren't you

They're behaving now. But even when they get rowdy, I am thrilled at the idea that they will be leaving for the summer. I have one across the street from me too. I met them and they are nice people.

It's funny. The houses go up for sale and then for sale sign comes down. Next you see contractor after contractor going in and hauling out the old and putting in the new. Then the house sits vacant for months. Finally in January, the owners show up out of the blue. They are off to the golf course by day and the restaurants by night. They seem to have an endless source of money. I would not want to be competing with them for a house I like. I wonder when they leave? March, April?

[bluegrey]

Originally Posted by bluegrey

I saw somebody in Gold Canyon drop their ask from 459K to 420K. About 3400 square feet on 2.25 acres. It once was a 750K home.

I just checked....they dropped the price again. Now at 395K. It is 3470 sf, on 1.25 acres (2.25 was typo). I'm sure they would have liked to have been "insulted" with an offer 10% below what their Realtor told them to list it for (459K).

My townhouse condo was listed for 78K, I paid 22K (in late 2009). It's a different market now. The sheep are in formation, but that doesn't mean a BPO is worth the paper it is written on.