Denver to Phoenix? Am I nuts? (Scottsdale, Tempe: to live in, vs., moving)
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I'm not educated on avoiding snakes when hiking. I've never been bitten, thank God. Don't they usually give you fair warning before striking though?
The ones I've seen usually stay still, or try to get away. Most people that are bitten try to handle the snake. Young men + alcohol + a female present = showing off + a potential snakebite, the way I had it explained to me at the Phoenix Herpetological Society (North Scottsdale, worth a visit).
I think they're beautiful, and no more frightening than a ground squirrel or a rabbit. Sometimes in a guide book it will say that this or that species is aggressive, but I'm not sure I agree with that word. I think defensive is a better word. If they're trapped, they might coil up and hold their ground, but is that aggressive? Aggressive in my book is coming after you. I've never seen that. Just leave them alone, and nothing happens.
I hike at night sometimes without a light, and I've almost stepped on them a few times. That's probably not too smart. I have good eyes, but I started to use a light to get out at the end of last summer. When you surprise them, you get what I call a "serious rattle". You know what it means. Nobody has to explain. They also have kind of "meh rattle", when you see each other from five feet away or so.
One thing I have noticed is that they will show up anywhere. You do not have to be deep in the mountain parks. There might be one on the sidewalk as soon as you step out of your car in the parking lot. So just look and listen (especially) from the beginning of your hike until the end, and you'll be fine.
They're generally not out at dusk in the middle of summer, from what I've seen. By dawn, yes. I was counting last summer and stopped when I got to 10+. They just kept coming. All the ones I saw were speckled, except for one tiger. No diamondbacks, despite a big sign where I hike saying that diamondbacks are the most frequently encountered species.
Weird. I see far more at dusk than dawn when I hike. THe last one I found was a red phase tiger rattler right on the middle of the trail at the base of Twobit Peak. I mean literally right in the middle of the trail. And she was a big'un! Probably close to 3.5" diameter and 4' long.
The ones I've seen usually stay still, or try to get away. Most people that are bitten try to handle the snake. Young men + alcohol + a female present = showing off + a potential snakebite, the way I had it explained to me at the Phoenix Herpetological Society (North Scottsdale, worth a visit).
I think they're beautiful, and no more frightening than a ground squirrel or a rabbit. Sometimes in a guide book it will say that this or that species is aggressive, but I'm not sure I agree with that word. I think defensive is a better word. If they're trapped, they might coil up and hold their ground, but is that aggressive? Aggressive in my book is coming after you. I've never seen that. Just leave them alone, and nothing happens.
I hike at night sometimes without a light, and I've almost stepped on them a few times. That's probably not too smart. I have good eyes, but I started to use a light to get out at the end of last summer. When you surprise them, you get what I call a "serious rattle". You know what it means. Nobody has to explain. They also have kind of "meh rattle", when you see each other from five feet away or so.
One thing I have noticed is that they will show up anywhere. You do not have to be deep in the mountain parks. There might be one on the sidewalk as soon as you step out of your car in the parking lot. So just look and listen (especially) from the beginning of your hike until the end, and you'll be fine.
A most excellent post. Spot on.
Rattlesnakes pose no threats to humans as long as you dont mess with them. Ive snapped some photos of rattlesnakes, then sat down by them not even 5' away, and they dont so much as even move at all. They just sit there, looking around w/o a care in the world.
Weird. I see far more at dusk than dawn when I hike. THe last one I found was a red phase tiger rattler right on the middle of the trail at the base of Twobit Peak. I mean literally right in the middle of the trail. And she was a big'un! Probably close to 3.5" diameter and 4' long.
I think it depends on the time of year.
Rattlesnakes have a temperature preference that trumps a time of day (low-light) preference, as I understand it. They are cold-blooded, so they have to regulate their temperature before anything.
So, given a day that does not vary in temperature, 80 degrees for 24 straight hours, they would probably choose low-light conditions, dawn, dusk, or at night, to give themselves an advantage hunting. In April, given ideal temperature conditions at dusk but too cool temperatures at dawn, you see them at dusk. In the middle of summer, where it's too hot at dusk for them, you see them at night or at dawn, when it's cooler. In winter, when it's too cold for them, you don't see them at all or you see them in the middle of the day, sunning themselves.
All of this is compounded by local conditions (one side of the mountain is sunnier and hotter than the other, etc.) and the condition of the animal itself. If a snake is really hungry, for example, it might be seen at a time or place where it is normally not. So there are no certainties. In the end, rattlesnakes are like any other wild animal. You kind of know where to look for them, but they surprise you too.
One thing I think people miss about rattlesnakes is that they're just not out and about nearly as much as warm-blooded animals. A bird, for example, has to eat a ton of food every day, and flies around everywhere. A rattlesnake catches a ground squirrel and then holes up for the next one to two weeks, digesting. There are a lot of rattlesnakes in the mountain parks, but most of the time they aren't doing anything.
That sounds like a nice (and big? I didn't know tigers got that big...) tiger rattlesnake you saw!
Rattlesnakes pose no threats to humans as long as you dont mess with them. Ive snapped some photos of rattlesnakes, then sat down by them not even 5' away, and they dont so much as even move at all. They just sit there, looking around w/o a care in the world.
Thanks, Big Cats.
I've done the same, and sometimes the snakes have gone back to poking around at the roots of bushes and stuff, looking for food. Very cool to watch.
Does the name "Big Cats" have anything to do with pumas and jaguars? I'm waiting for somebody to tell me how to find the jaguar in the Santa Rita mountains.
I realize the likelihood of that happening is like 0.00000001 percent, but hey, it's worth a shot!
I've done the same, and sometimes the snakes have gone back to poking around at the roots of bushes and stuff, looking for food. Very cool to watch.
Does the name "Big Cats" have anything to do with pumas and jaguars? I'm waiting for somebody to tell me how to find the jaguar in the Santa Rita mountains.
I realize the likelihood of that happening is like 0.00000001 percent, but hey, it's worth a shot!
No worries.
Yes, my handle/user name stems from my love for big cats. Tigers, lions, jaguars, pumas, leopards, mountain lions (so many nicknames lol), etc. I love em all. As for finding the elusive AZ jaguar, I have no clue. I dont actively look for them, and hope not to ever cross paths with one of these big kitties. lol
Here is the red phase tiger rattler (Crotalus tigris) that was on the trail in the PHX Mountains Preserve. I scooted it off the trail, it took a defensive posture, but didnt rattle at all.
For some reason it wouldnt let me upload two images, so here's the diamondback (Crotalus atrox) that was right off the Cholla Trail on Camelback early this summer. Caught a mom and son throwing rocks at it. I scolded them.
For some reason it wouldnt let me upload two images, so here's the diamondback (Crotalus atrox) that was right off the Cholla Trail on Camelback early this summer. Caught a mom and son throwing rocks at it. I scolded them.
I've learned not to show rattlesnakes to other people for this reason. Sounds like your mom and son got their first. You would be surprised how oblivious some people are. I could be staring at a rattlesnake just off the trail, and all anyone would have to do is follow my line of sight to see it, and they're just clueless. I used to say, "Look! There's a rattlesnake!" No more.
If I do run across a rattlesnake that other people see, I pray for it when I get home. Seriously. The things that people do to wildlife for no reason. And I bet some of the people killing snakes are the same ones that complain about rats and rabbits and things that the snakes eat.
I've got a couple of pictures I'll post. I don't like having to link to them. I'd rather just post them in the thread. Your top one I would call a speckled rattlesnake, but I'm not an expert. I do have a couple of degrees in biology, so I know about animals in general, but snake identification is not my specialty. I see snakes that color and species a lot on North Mountain and Shaw Butte. I'll try to get some of my own pictures up.
I've learned not to show rattlesnakes to other people for this reason. Sounds like your mom and son got their first. You would be surprised how oblivious some people are. I could be staring at a rattlesnake just off the trail, and all anyone would have to do is follow my line of sight to see it, and they're just clueless. I used to say, "Look! There's a rattlesnake!" No more.
If I do run across a rattlesnake that other people see, I pray for it when I get home. Seriously. The things that people do to wildlife for no reason. And I bet some of the people killing snakes are the same ones that complain about rats and rabbits and things that the snakes eat.
I've got a couple of pictures I'll post. I don't like having to link to them. I'd rather just post them in the thread. Your top one I would call a speckled rattlesnake, but I'm not an expert. I do have a couple of degrees in biology, so I know about animals in general, but snake identification is not my specialty. I see snakes that color and species a lot on North Mountain and Shaw Butte. I'll try to get some of my own pictures up.
To clarify, it wasnt my mom and son, they know better than to harm animals, especially snakes. This was a Hispanic woman and son, whom Ive never met before. I was warned about the snake by a passerby who was ascending the trail, so I hurried down to get to the snake to see it, and thats when I saw them hurling rocks at it. I wasnt a happy camper.
As for the ID on the first photo, I could be wrong. It might be a speckled, Ill have to look a bit closer. Ive seen speckled rattlers, and their pattern is different. Of course there are different phases, etc, that Ill have to look into more.
I also share a dislike towards people who harm snakes, then complain about being overrun with mice and rats. Rattlers eat an average of 8-10 lbs of rodents annually. Take just one snake out of the equation and you have dozens of nasty mice running around unchecked, spreading disease, damaging homes, destroying crops, etc. You reap what you sow, you boneheads! Leave the snakes alone, theyre NOT out to harm you!!!!
To clarify, it wasnt my mom and son, they know better than to harm animals, especially snakes. This was a Hispanic woman and son, whom Ive never met before. I was warned about the snake by a passerby who was ascending the trail, so I hurried down to get to the snake to see it, and thats when I saw them hurling rocks at it. I wasnt a happy camper.
As for the ID on the first photo, I could be wrong. It might be a speckled, Ill have to look a bit closer. Ive seen speckled rattlers, and their pattern is different. Of course there are different phases, etc, that Ill have to look into more.
I also share a dislike towards people who harm snakes, then complain about being overrun with mice and rats. Rattlers eat an average of 8-10 lbs of rodents annually. Take just one snake out of the equation and you have dozens of nasty mice running around unchecked, spreading disease, damaging homes, destroying crops, etc. You reap what you sow, you boneheads! Leave the snakes alone, theyre NOT out to harm you!!!!
I look forward to your photos.
Just to clarify, I meant "your mom and son" as in "the mom and son that you saw." I understood you! Best
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