What do all of you locals think of the rail system in Phoenix? (Glendale: homes, buses)

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by Stjoan

I think a better more active bus system would be helpful to the area. I have heard that it is sparse and not many routes like in other cities. Is this true?

Starting this April, hours of bus service in Phoenix will match light rail service. Over the past two years, frequency of service has been increased, and on some crosstown routes (Camelback, Indian School, Thomas, & Indian School) service frequency is actually higher during peak hours than on light rail. There have been a few routes added and more are planned. Bus service within Phoenix boundaries has definitely improved in the year-and-a-half since the city's voters opted for better transit.

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by exit2lef

Bus service within Phoenix boundaries has definitely improved in the year-and-a-half since the city's voters opted for better transit.

Part of the transit tax was slated to speed up light rail construction as well as increase bus service. There has been a lot of squawking over the fact that any extension of light rail (particularly to the west side) won't be completed for at least another decade. All I know is that something needs to be done ASAP with that I10 median which is nothing but a wide ugly slab of dirt. My preference would be HOT lanes, but the plan is for light rail to go in the median. One would hope (and expect) additional light rail lines would be constructed and finished well before 10 or 15 years from now with the extra funding.

Speaking of bus service, one thing I've always wondered is why there aren't regular bus routes on some of the busy half thoroughfares in the midtown area such as Osborn or 3rd Street. I haven't ridden the buses in a long time, but I'm curious to know if service was ever added on these streets, or if it ever will be. If not, what a shame.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Part of the transit tax was slated to speed up light rail construction as well as increase bus service. There has been a lot of squawking over the fact that any extension of light rail (particularly to the west side) won't be completed for at least another decade. All I know is that something needs to be done ASAP with that I10 median which is nothing but a wide ugly slab of dirt. My preference would be HOT lanes, but the plan is for light rail to go in the median. One would hope (and expect) additional light rail lines would be constructed and finished well before 10 or 15 years from now with the extra funding.

Speaking of bus service, one thing I've always wondered is why there aren't regular bus routes on some of the busy half thoroughfares in the midtown area such as Osborn or 3rd Street. I haven't ridden the buses in a long time, but I'm curious to know if service was ever added on these streets, or if it ever will be. If not, what a shame.

Right now, the plan is for light rail in the I-10 median and BRT (bus rapid transit) on Thomas. I think Valley Metro should flip the modes, putting light rail on Thomas and BRT in the I-10 median. Thomas runs through the heart of Maryvale and would be a good candidate for light rail with stops every mile or half mile to serve neighborhoods. The I-10 median, on the other hand, has little nearby density or potential for development. It would be better served by express buses running in dedicated lanes or HOT lanes.

The collector streets that run halfway through arterials are generally pretty quiet with one lane of automotive traffic in each direction, bike lanes, and low density. The two big exceptions are Missouri and Osborn. Those might be worthwhile candidates for bus service someday. In terms of north-south service, 15th Avenue and 12th Street are two collectors that already have their own bus routes, so there is some precedent for bus lines on collector streets.

EDIT: Also, Roosevelt and Roeser are two east-west collectors that already have bus service.

[Renegade007]

Originally Posted by exit2lef

Right now, the plan is for light rail in the I-10 median and BRT (bus rapid transit) on Thomas. I think Valley Metro should flip the modes, putting light rail on Thomas and BRT in the I-10 median. Thomas runs through the heart of Maryvale and would be a good candidate for light rail with stops every mile or half mile to serve neighborhoods. The I-10 median, on the other hand, has little nearby density or potential for development. It would be better served by express buses running in dedicated lanes or HOT lanes.

The collector streets that run halfway through arterials are generally pretty quiet with one lane of automotive traffic in each direction, bike lanes, and low density. The two big exceptions are Missouri and Osborn. Those might be worthwhile candidates for bus service someday. In terms of north-south service, 15th Avenue and 12th Street are two collectors that already have their own bus routes, so there is some precedent for bus lines on collector streets.

EDIT: Also, Roosevelt and Roeser are two east-west collectors that already have bus service.

You'll never see light rail anywhere near the heart of Maryvale. There's too much of an, umm, undesirable element there.

[Stjoan]

Wow. Thanks for the responses everyone.

[FirebirdCamaro1220]

Originally Posted by Renegade007

You'll never see light rail anywhere near the heart of Maryvale. There's too much of an, umm, undesirable element there.

That didn't stop Metro Rail from putting the Blue Line in South Central and Compton

I should also mention that Maryvale is the most densely populated part of the city as well as the entire Valley, and public transit thrives on density.

[Java Jolt]

Originally Posted by FirebirdCamaro1220

That didn't stop Metro Rail from putting the Blue Line in South Central and Compton

I should also mention that Maryvale is the most densely populated part of the city as well as the entire Valley, and public transit thrives on density.

Maryvale is the most densely populated part of Phoenix? I never knew that, it doesn't seem like it would be.

That's even more of a reason to expand light rail westward, it would be used in Maryvale and it would provide an alternative form of commuting for people in the west-southwest valley.

[FirebirdCamaro1220]

Originally Posted by Java Jolt

Maryvale is the most densely populated part of Phoenix? I never knew that, it doesn't seem like it would be.

That's even more of a reason to expand light rail westward, it would be used in Maryvale and it would provide an alternative form of commuting for people in the west-southwest valley.

Yes it is. The most densely populated zip code in the whole state 85033, covers the area between 59th Ave to the east, Thomas Rd to the south, 83rd Ave to the west and Camelback Rd to the north. Density for the zip is 8,900 ppsm. And several census tracts in Maryvale have between 10k and 15k ppsm.

Also, should add that the 29 Bus (Thomas Rd) has more ridership than any other busline in Greater Phoenix

Ironically, I live in the second densest zip code in AZ 85015, which covers Glendale Ave on the north, 15th Ave on the east, Thomas Rd on the south, and I-17 on the west.

[Prickly Pear]

Originally Posted by exit2lef

Right now, the plan is for light rail in the I-10 median and BRT (bus rapid transit) on Thomas. I think Valley Metro should flip the modes, putting light rail on Thomas and BRT in the I-10 median. Thomas runs through the heart of Maryvale and would be a good candidate for light rail with stops every mile or half mile to serve neighborhoods. The I-10 median, on the other hand, has little nearby density or potential for development. It would be better served by express buses running in dedicated lanes or HOT lanes.

The collector streets that run halfway through arterials are generally pretty quiet with one lane of automotive traffic in each direction, bike lanes, and low density. The two big exceptions are Missouri and Osborn. Those might be worthwhile candidates for bus service someday. In terms of north-south service, 15th Avenue and 12th Street are two collectors that already have their own bus routes, so there is some precedent for bus lines on collector streets.

EDIT: Also, Roosevelt and Roeser are two east-west collectors that already have bus service.

I am going to have to disagree with you here.

Since buses will eventually need service, odds are they will get off this dedicated road and use an exit ramp, meaning their dedicated lanes won't be entirely closed off.

I do believe considering how bad the I-10 is in West Valley, people would try to sneak their cars into that lane.

I would prefer commuter rail rather than light rail overall for the I-10. Frankly I do believe the light rail is also a terrible idea, right there anyway. Light rail would be great on like Grand Avenue, and commuter rail along the I-10, that would be fantastic. I say this because there is a lot of business along Grand Avenue that is PEDESTRIAN friendly, meaning you don't have to walk over one of the widest freeways in our metro, and then odds are drive somewhere (due to the commercial shops in this area being with large parking lots, being next to a freeway and all it's car friendly) to get to some place. Grand also runs through Downtown Glendale which is a great little place to visit, and would take West Valley residents into Downtown. Grand is pretty wide in some parts, it starts getting wide around the I-10 but in DT itself it's pretty small. Maybe it could connect to the Capitol (go south rather than continue to follow Grand at this point) or something to dodge that two-lane part of Grand.

Commuter rail could extend as far as Buckeye (and expanded west if necessary in the future) with relative ease, and connect to a light rail stop somewhere closer to Downtown. We could make stops rather minimal, start at Buckeye, put one say around Tolleson, and then one in DT. Put in large parking garages (that charge) for the stops. I do believe this commuter rail could then extend into Tucson, maybe go further east past the I-10 to like Chandler/Gilbert area and then make it's way down and rejoin the railroad tracks along the I-10. This is something we will need in the future if Southern Arizona continues to grow, and it will, so we should be wise and put heavy rail tracks in there anyway since they aren't compatible with light rail tracks.

[cjseliga]

Originally Posted by Prickly Pear

I would prefer commuter rail rather than light rail overall for the I-10. Frankly I do believe the light rail is also a terrible idea, right there anyway.

At least in that stretch, the light rail will "fly" down the track and not have to worry about red lights and slowing up, so that section should be much quicker than any of the current sections of the Metro.