Is this your opinion of the housing market? (Phoenix, Scottsdale: sale, new home)

[MN-Born-n-Raised]

Originally Posted by DougStark

It would be nice to confirm that rich people are still flocking to CA. But considering CA's extremely high income tax on high earners, I have my doubts about your claim that big earners are still flocking there. If they (rich) have good accountants, maybe they can legally dodge the high income taxes?

CA's population is growing due to births and an influx of immigrants (legal AND illegal.) People from mid-America are sure not moving there, haha.

Assuming this article is telling the truth, Leaving California: Here's who's moving out, who's moving in. - The San Diego Union-Tribune

"Wealthier people and those from states like New York and Illinois are moving in by the droves to California while young people with less money are bailing out to states such as Texas, Arizona and Nevada, a report from the state’s Legislative Analyst’s Office revealed Wednesday." AZ is getting a lot of the Riverside, CA crowd. They must have a lot of tattoo parlors in Riverside.

Forgetting the screwy politics and congestion/traffic, the CA coast line has the country beat in landscape, culture, and weather. IMHO, it isn't remotely close! So if you are worth millions, you plug your nose and suck it up. But people live where they live for all kinds of reasons. But on average, rich people have the means to pay millions more. If you are rich and can pay the CA cost of living, CA has AZ beat in just about every single category. To be blunt, AZ winters are not my 1st choice. I'd much rather live in San Diego all year around. If I add my MN and AZ 4,000 square foot homes together, it would cost me 5-7 times more in CA for just one house. I'd do it in a heartbeat but I cannot afford that. So I do what I do. Add another zero after my net worth and I'd be contributing to the CA congestion!

Sure, we can find irrational people too. Every state still has the super rich https://www.marketwatch.com/story/he...ate-2017-06-22 for one reason or another and as an example, several wealthy people live in North Dakota. 90% of that state is butt-ugly and it is cold and windy during the winters. In most of ND, you can watch your dog run away for two days straight! Still, it is a great place to raise your family.

[asufan]

Originally Posted by DougStark

It would be nice to confirm that rich people are still flocking to CA. But considering CA's extremely high income tax on high earners, I have my doubts about your claim that big earners are still flocking there. If they (rich) have good accountants, maybe they can legally dodge the high income taxes?

CA's population is growing due to births and an influx of immigrants (legal AND illegal.) People from mid-America are sure not moving there, haha.

I don't know if there's a way for me to find any data that will satisfy your question, I can just tell you as a fact it is happening. My parents still have a house in OC that they rent out and I have a ton of friends and family there, many in my industry (real estate development). A lot of the wealthy investment is from overseas, and if you ever pop into a new home sales office, you will see marketing materials in both English and Chinese. New construction tract builders in areas like Irvine and Aliso Viejo have starting prices in the $2.5M range before accounting for upgrades, view premiums, etc.

Southern California near the coast is the climate sweet spot in the United States, it will always have significant demand. Having $5M net worth and trying to buy a nice house there doesn't move the needle when you're competing with cash offers for more than list price from overseas buyers.

I know this is merely anecdotal evidence and won't convince those that strangely put politics in the equation, but the people that are leaving aren't the uber rich.

[ndindy]

Originally Posted by DougStark

It would be nice to confirm that rich people are still flocking to CA. But considering CA's extremely high income tax on high earners, I have my doubts about your claim that big earners are still flocking there. If they (rich) have good accountants, maybe they can legally dodge the high income taxes?

CA's population is growing due to births and an influx of immigrants (legal AND illegal.) People from mid-America are sure not moving there, haha.

Living here, I can confirm that CA does very well at attracting highly educated, highly compensated people. The people who move to move to places such as AZ, NV and TX tend to be those whose incomes can't get them into the housing market.


California does have high tax rates, but only on extremely high earners. It's a progressive tax system that has minimal taxes for lower and middle income households. My husband and I made $248k in CA last year and had a state tax rate of just under 6%. I believe the top tax rate in AZ is 4.64%, but each state offers different services and lifestyles.

[fluffythewondercat]

Originally Posted by ndindy

Living here, I can confirm that CA does very well at attracting highly educated, highly compensated people. The people who move to move to places such as AZ, NV and TX tend to be those whose incomes can't get them into the housing market.

LOL.



Yes, that must be why there are literally thousands of million-dollar homes in Scottsdale. And unlike California, you actually get something quite nice for your megabuck. We just made an offer on a 5 bdrm 5 bath 5600 sq ft home on 1 acre.

[asufan]

Originally Posted by fluffythewondercat

LOL.



Yes, that must be why there are literally thousands of million-dollar homes in Scottsdale. And unlike California, you actually get something quite nice for your megabuck. We just made an offer on a 5 bdrm 5 bath 5600 sq ft home on 1 acre.

Location, location, location

[DougStark]

Yes, I freely acknowledge that foreign buyers with cash are definitely major players in CA's housing demand.

My conclusion, though, is that the days of the post-war housing boom (late 40s through the 60s) in California, where middle class familes from all over
America were relocating there in record numbers, is long gone. Everyone knows that the days of 'Dennis the Menace' and 'My Three Sons' is gone, never to return.

[newtoaz20172]

I've posted before. Wife's doctor co-worker had secured 500k in Arcadia for what I believe to be a box. Cali money came in and did an all cash purchase.

Yes, certain markets are pretty insane.

[Tall Traveler]

Originally Posted by ndindy

Living here, I can confirm that CA does very well at attracting highly educated, highly compensated people. The people who move to move to places such as AZ, NV and TX tend to be those whose incomes can't get them into the housing market.


California does have high tax rates, but only on extremely high earners. It's a progressive tax system that has minimal taxes for lower and middle income households. My husband and I made $248k in CA last year and had a state tax rate of just under 6%. I believe the top tax rate in AZ is 4.64%, but each state offers different services and lifestyles.

According to the California tax code, you're paying 9.3% on income above $108K for married filing jointly or above $54K for a single filer....maybe your net tax was 6% but that actually is quite a lot to pay.

California attracts educated high income, wealthy, and uneducated homeless and illegals....just not middle class. California's climate is the biggest draw and that will never go away.

Arizona attracts lower to upper middle class and some wealthy.

[Burkmere]

Originally Posted by Tall Traveler

According to the California tax code, you're paying 9.3% on income above $108K for married filing jointly or above $54K for a single filer....maybe your net tax was 6% but that actually is quite a lot to pay.

California attracts educated high income, wealthy, and uneducated homeless and illegals....just not middle class. California's climate is the biggest draw and that will never go away.

Arizona attracts lower to upper middle class and some wealthy.

Yes, you are right on with your comments. I was thinking exactly the same thing. I retired from CA in Oct. 2015, moved back to the Midwest, but having spent the winter in AZ along with much thinking about my future and where I want to be, etc. have decided to move permanently in October.

I "could have" stayed in CA. I can afford it. However, the Valley, and more specifically Scottsdale, has much to offer. Factoring in cost of living, retiree opportunities, etc. it seems like the better choice for me.

CA is turning into a two class state. I don't like the politics nor the horrible traffic. Pros an cons i guess, but to me it's a place to visit, but I'm outta there.

[wase4711]

lets all go there, just dont shower and do laundry the same day..

https://www.weeklystandard.com/holme...n-the-same-day