Replacing outdated tile flooring? (Phoenix, Tucson: rental, new house, buyer)

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by ManApplet

Real tile is forever. What kinda nut would rip it out?

Arizona nuts. If it ain't grey, take it away. Gray on gray and some more gray is trendy now and Zonies gotta be trendy in their homes, spending 10, 20, 30K to make it so ripping out good tile to "upgrade" to gray. I think we are so nuts because of all the new homes built here. There are new homes on display like auto showrooms here and people pick up on the decorating trends and just have to have them.

[AZ Manager]

Originally Posted by AndroidAZ

LVP is a newer flooring product, so it might not be as common as engineered wood or tile flooring in many existing homes, but it is fast becoming the flooring of choice due to the ease of install, removal, and durability.

If you count 1970s as newer... It's 50 year old tech getting an extremely minor resurgence because it is very cheap and looks kind of like wood.

As someone else mentioned it has a plastic sheen to it because it is coated in several layers of clear plastic to give it it's durability. Were talking about a flooring product that is typically less than a quarter inch thick and flexible. It's only saving grace is it normally is floated, vs sheet vynl being glued down, so you won't see every foundation crack under it.

LVP looks horrible on stairs, against carpets and any other type of flooring (because of how thin it is), and sounds like you are walking on plastic when wearing shoes (like how most laminate flooring sounds).

[DetroitN8V]

Originally Posted by AndroidAZ

You haven't been looking real hard then.

I've seen it in $1mm+ homes, that have had multiple offers and gone above asking after sale.

I spoke with the seller of one such home, who said they put in real hardwood floors in a previous home, gorgeous to look at. When they sold it, the buyers ripped out the hardwood after taking possession, to put in tile flooring anyway. Total waste of money.

They said they would only do LVP from now on out.

LVP is a newer flooring product, so it might not be as common as engineered wood or tile flooring in many existing homes, but it is fast becoming the flooring of choice due to the ease of install, removal, and durability.

I had gorgeous engineered wood in a house, and it became scratched so easily. Given we were living in it and use the floor frequently, I was not about to put life on hold and move everything out and refinish the flooring every few years to renew it. So real wood flooring for commonly used areas are a big disadvantage, in my opinion.

If I was looking for a $1mm+ house, the flooring is the least of my concerns, compared to location, amenities, and other factors. However, if it had outdated tile or a color I didn't like (creme or gold colored tile), it would be a huge concern as the demolition and replacement of flooring would be a big project. If it had laminate or carpet, that would be extremely easy to replace and remove.

The thinking that LVP is "cheap" or not used in high end homes is becoming dated, in my opinion.

Again, I'd love to see some listings of high end homes that have vinyl floors. Natural materials have their downsides for sure. Cost and maintenance, but those likely aren't of concern to higher dollar buyers. AZ Manager's post above is spot on.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by AZ Manager

If you count 1970s as newer... It's 50 year old tech getting an extremely minor resurgence because it is very cheap and looks kind of like wood.

As someone else mentioned it has a plastic sheen to it because it is coated in several layers of clear plastic to give it it's durability. Were talking about a flooring product that is typically less than a quarter inch thick and flexible. It's only saving grace is it normally is floated, vs sheet vynl being glued down, so you won't see every foundation crack under it.

LVP looks horrible on stairs, against carpets and any other type of flooring (because of how thin it is), and sounds like you are walking on plastic when wearing shoes (like how most laminate flooring sounds).

Your information seems dated. New high end LVP is about 1/4-3/8 inch thick with a rigid substrate composed of wood-plastic composite (google WPC flooring) or powdered stone-plastic composite (SPC). It is stiff as a board, has a built in foam base and does not transmit under surface irregularities. It is much like pergo but waterproof. It has the same aluminum oxide coatings as Pergo or engineered hardwood but does not need to be shiny. The vinyl is typically textured to match the print so you can "feel" the grain or the stone. Finishes range from matte to semi-glossy. Some of it is wood patterns, but stone pattern tiles are also available.

I have no idea how it might affect resale, but if one is considering Pergo then I think a long look at the WPC vinyl options is certainly in order. It seems superior in many ways to laminates. It's easy removal offering a blank slate to a prospective buyer is certainly more of a plus than dated tile.

[AndroidAZ]

Originally Posted by DetroitN8V

Again, I'd love to see some listings of high end homes that have vinyl floors. Natural materials have their downsides for sure. Cost and maintenance, but those likely aren't of concern to higher dollar buyers. AZ Manager's post above is spot on.

It seems you and AZ Manager are a bit off regarding LVP. I have been looking at active listings for the last few years and even bought a few homes during that time, and LVP has always been a neutral or added bonus for homes, than any type of detraction.

High dollar buyers aren't concerned with cost, but they are concerned with maintenance. Not many people have time to redo flooring every few years to deal with scratches and water damage. Having to move everything out of the way to deal with floor demolition, all of the dust, etc., is no fun regardless of your price range. LVP addresses those issues easily. Plus it's cheap, so it's easy to take out and replace if the buyers get tired of the flooring.

[DetroitN8V]

Originally Posted by AndroidAZ

It seems you and AZ Manager are a bit off regarding LVP. I have been looking at active listings for the last few years and even bought a few homes during that time, and LVP has always been a neutral or added bonus for homes, than any type of detraction.

High dollar buyers aren't concerned with cost, but they are concerned with maintenance. Not many people have time to redo flooring every few years to deal with scratches and water damage. Having to move everything out of the way to deal with floor demolition, all of the dust, etc., is no fun regardless of your price range. LVP addresses those issues easily. Plus it's cheap, so it's easy to take out and replace if the buyers get tired of the flooring.

Send me a listing or three if you come across them. Still interested in seeing vinyl flooring in a high end home. It doesn’t compute for me, “luxury” aside.

[AZ Manager]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

Your information seems dated. New high end LVP is about 1/4-3/8 inch thick with a rigid substrate composed of wood-plastic composite (google WPC flooring) or powdered stone-plastic composite (SPC). It is stiff as a board, has a built in foam base and does not transmit under surface irregularities. It is much like pergo but waterproof. It has the same aluminum oxide coatings as Pergo or engineered hardwood but does not need to be shiny. The vinyl is typically textured to match the print so you can "feel" the grain or the stone. Finishes range from matte to semi-glossy. Some of it is wood patterns, but stone pattern tiles are also available.

I have no idea how it might affect resale, but if one is considering Pergo then I think a long look at the WPC vinyl options is certainly in order. It seems superior in many ways to laminates. It's easy removal offering a blank slate to a prospective buyer is certainly more of a plus than dated tile.

I refloor 2-4 houses a year and they always try and talk me into this cheap flooring, my info isn't dated. Most LVP sold today is 5mm thick (0.2 inches) including the nearly paper thin pad layer; even at 1/4" wood isn't very stiff.

[Sno0909]

Originally Posted by DetroitN8V

Send me a listing or three if you come across them. Still interested in seeing vinyl flooring in a high end home. It doesn’t compute for me, “luxury” aside.

All listed as vinyl in the MLS. Can't actually confirm this, but not sure why someone would advertise it as vinyl if that wasn't the case.

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1.../8244206_zpid/

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1...6815502_zpid/?

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/5...7830702_zpid/?

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1...2824269_zpid/?

[DetroitN8V]

Originally Posted by Sno0909

All listed as vinyl in the MLS. Can't actually confirm this, but not sure why someone would advertise it as vinyl if that wasn't the case.

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1.../8244206_zpid/

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1...6815502_zpid/?

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/5...7830702_zpid/?

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1...2824269_zpid/?

Interesting. That first house is nice.

These are horrific:





In the first pic you can see that nasty, cheap looking sheen. It looks so similar to laminate, which screams tacky to me.

Real wood. Just no substitute.

[ilovetofu]

Originally Posted by DetroitN8V

In the first pic you can see that nasty, cheap looking sheen. It looks so similar to laminate, which screams tacky to me.

That sheen will fade over time if you don't like it.

https://findanyanswer.com/how-do-you...vinyl-flooring

Vinyl floors are sealed by the manufacturer with a low-gloss, no-wax sealant that gives it shine and luster. After two years, this glow fades even if you use a proper cleaning regimen on your floors.