Historic designation rejected for Civic Arena (Pittsburgh, Warren: credit, new home, buy)

[bradjl2009]

Historic designation rejected for Civic Arena

The city Historic Review Commission refused to designate the Civic Arena a city historic structure today, a setback for those seeking to save the old building.

The panel voted 6-0 to reject the building's nomination, reversing an earlier decision to designate the arena as a historic structure.

Sadly, this fight isn't over though as the city planning commission and council will get to vote on this too. I wish people would just move along and allow the thing to be torn down and let us get some good development in that area.

[BrianTH]

Just an aside: the article makes it sound like the Commission is reversing itself, but as I understand the process, to get a temporary stay of demolition to allow further proceedings requires a much lower standard than to get the ultimate designation, which makes sense. So they got the temporary stay but not the ultimate designation, which is really two different decisions.

Anyway, I'd be quite surprised if City Planning or City Council reached a different conclusion.

[MathmanMathman]

I don't understand how its historical status could be rejected. It is a significant structure in architectural circles. I think the commission chose to turn a blind eye to the facts and reject it.

Housing, offices, and shops? There is plenty in Pittsburgh still to redevelop and Pittsburgh is short on office space and needs more? The arena is different as it offers a unique structure to redevelop and can anchor surrounding development. I'll bet they replace it with the mundane rather than the interesting.

I'd do what they did for the new David Lawrence, put up a cash prize for an international competition among architects for the best idea for the arena reuse. The retractable dome offers all kinds of possibilities.

[gg]

Originally Posted by MathmanMathman

I don't understand how its historical status could be rejected. It is a significant structure in architectural circles. I think the commission chose to turn a blind eye to the facts and reject it.

Housing, offices, and shops? There is plenty in Pittsburgh still to redevelop and Pittsburgh is short on office space and needs more? The arena is different as it offers a unique structure to redevelop and can anchor surrounding development. I'll bet they replace it with the mundane rather than the interesting.

I'd do what they did for the new David Lawrence, put up a cash prize for an international competition among architects for the best idea for the arena reuse. The retractable dome offers all kinds of possibilities.

I agree with you that there is tons of land to develop and that doesn't need to be some boring office space instead of that cool place, but all the talk is useless unless you have piles of money. The writing is already on the wall and it is coming down. No NBA team going to play there or anything else. No great concert venues nothing. It will be a parking lot and some boring buildings. Just the way it is. The money wants it gone and that is what is going to happen. No way to stop it, unless you have tons of money. Anyone know Warren Buffett?

[BrianTH]

Ultimately the City Code just says Council may designate structures as historic. The City Code with respect to the role of the HRC is a little more opaque, but it says the HRC "shall make recommendations to City Council relative to the appropriateness of such proposed designations eligible [under the definitions and criteria in the Code]". So it appears it isn't just a question of whether the structure is eligible under the Code, but also whether the HRC thinks such a designation is "appropriate" (whatever that means). In short, there is no real entitlement to designation under the Code--it is ultimately a discretionary matter.

I disagree that we can afford to ignore the inherent value of this site. Downtown and Oakland ARE short on office, residential, and retail/entertainment space, and more generally, the question is whether you want this sort of new development going on in sites like this in the next 10-20 years, or somewhere out in the sprawlburbs.

For a large number of reasons--fostering productivity, conserving energy, protecting the environment, reducing infrastructure costs and traffic congestion, improving public health and safety, and so on--we should prefer new development be in sites like this whenever possible. That is a high stakes public policy issue, and shouldn't just be shoved aside as a money issue.

[Geeo]

I'll miss the sight of the arena, but the land needs to be put to more productive use. There really is no viable re-use for it, sadly. I wish there was some ingenious plaan that woould blow the socks off everybody and the funding to do it, but there isn't. A more high-density development will really energize that part of town and bring it alive.

[kjtocool]

I agree with h_curtis, if it stays it's going to be a wasted space. I don't believe it holds any value to the city by remaining, and thing it holds the area back with it's mere presence. Was nice in it's day, now it needs to go.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by MathmanMathman

I'd do what they did for the new David Lawrence, put up a cash prize for an international competition among architects for the best idea for the arena reuse. The retractable dome offers all kinds of possibilities.

Incidentally, I think this is failing to give the people who have been trying to come up with a reuse plan enough credit. They have had years now, they even had a contest which attracted a lot of interest and proposals, and have come up with a variety of very creative and professionally-presented visions.

Those visions also all stink on ice (pardon the pun). The fact is they really did try, and put a lot into it, and their failure suggests it just isn't reasonable to expect anyone one else to do better.

I think it is also telling that to my knowledge, there has never been a successful, high-value reuse of an arena like this as anything but an events center, any where or any time in history. Which makes sense--this is an incredibly specialized sort of building, which incorporates a lot of elements you would never consider for any other sort of building. So if you are not using it as intended, it probably won't work well at all.

[slamont61]

Gotta face facts, there is no viable use for the Arena as is. Pretty and unique as it is, it must go. The city does not need it in any way shape or form as is, it needs to be a part of the recycling process so that progress can occur.

Give the people time to take some pictures and then bam, the wreck'in ball.

[gg]

If anyone is superstitious, I would have to say, things aren't looking very good for the Penguins in their new home. I don't buy into that kind of thing, but so far, not so good. Some people may say the mojo is lost with the new home.