Three confirmed dead in Washington Blvd flooding. (Pittsburgh: to live in, store)

[Impala26]

Well, is the debate about the van's electronic locks failing just because the family inside couldn't hit the "unlock" button, or is it that because the van's locks were EXCLUSIVELY electronic and could not be opened manually by pulling the knob on each door? There are several model cars where the latter is the case because the lock knob will depress into the door so that it cannot be lifted manually. If this were the case, then the family DEFINITELY has a fair case.

[Craziaskowboi]

Originally Posted by Impala26

Well, is the debate about the van's electronic locks failing just because the family inside couldn't hit the "unlock" button, or is it that because the van's locks were EXCLUSIVELY electronic and could not be opened manually by pulling the knob on each door? There are several model cars where the latter is the case because the lock knob will depress into the door so that it cannot be lifted manually. If this were the case, then the family DEFINITELY has a fair case.

Pulling the interior door latch should automatically unlock and open the door. There's no need to pull the lock knob.

Of course, if the driver had the child protection locks turned on for the sliding doors in the back, then the only way they could be opened would be from the outside. But that's standard for any automaker.

[Hopes]

Myth Busters. Everything we ever wanted to know about getting out of a car in water situations.

MythBusters Episode 72: Underwater Car

You can't open the door until the entire interior is filled with water. You can't open the windows electronically OR manually. You should abandon the car before it is completely submerged in water. If your car is submerged completely under water before you can get out, you wait until the car fills with water and you open the door or break the glass with one of those glass breakers greg posted. Waiting until the car fills with water is the most risky, IMO, compared to abandoning the car ASAP before it becomes submerged.

[ML North]

Originally Posted by Hopes

Myth Busters. Everything we ever wanted to know about getting out of a car in water situations.

MythBusters Episode 72: Underwater Car

You can't open the door until the entire interior is filled with water. You can't open the windows electronically OR manually. You should abandon the car before it is completely submerged in water. If your car is submerged completely under water before you can get out, you wait until the car fills with water and you open the door or break the glass with one of those glass breakers greg posted. Waiting until the car fills with water is the most risky, IMO, compared to abandoning the car ASAP before it becomes submerged.

Well, you can actually open a car door when the water level inside the door is equal to the water level outside the door, at which point the hydrostatic forces acting on the inside and outside of the door are equal. Obviously, when a car is entirely submerged that will occur when the interior is entirely full.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by ML North

Well, you can actually open a car door when the water level inside the door is equal to the water level outside the door, at which point the hydrostatic forces acting on the inside and outside of the door are equal. Obviously, when a car is entirely submerged that will occur when the interior is entirely full.

That's covered in the Myth Buster's link. I wouldn't wait around to see how far it goes.

I'm all for getting out through the window while the going is good.

[greg42]

Originally Posted by Impala26

Well, is the debate about the van's electronic locks failing just because the family inside couldn't hit the "unlock" button, or is it that because the van's locks were EXCLUSIVELY electronic and could not be opened manually by pulling the knob on each door? There are several model cars where the latter is the case because the lock knob will depress into the door so that it cannot be lifted manually. If this were the case, then the family DEFINITELY has a fair case.

LOL Lock knob? How many cars still have lock knobs? Mine does, but it's 13 years old. They move sideways, not up and down (common to Hondas for many many years). So IF I had the presence of mind, in my car, I could unlock my doors manually. Forget going into the door, what is even the point of those if you can't unlock them manually? I think more cars than not don't have any non-electronic method of locking and unlocking the doors. I don't think there's a case there; that is commonplace these days and the car shouldn't be expected to be waterproof when submerged any more than it should be expected to fly through the air.

Originally Posted by Gnutella

Pulling the interior door latch should automatically unlock and open the door. There's no need to pull the lock knob.

On some vehicles. This is by no means universal. It's why I drive with my doors unlocked and why I truly despise the systems that automatically lock them when I shift into gear or at a certain speed. The door handle opening the door even when locked (on the front doors at least) has been common to Fords for a long time but it isn't common on most others.

Besides, I thought it was the windows in question rather than the door locks.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by greg42

On some vehicles. This is by no means universal. It's why I drive with my doors unlocked and why I truly despise the systems that automatically lock them when I shift into gear or at a certain speed. The door handle opening the door even when locked (on the front doors at least) has been common to Fords for a long time but it isn't common on most others.

This is so true. It's not universal. I hate that my car automatically locks when I shift it into gear. Some cars have manual ways to unlock/open the door and some don't. It's freaky. I often lock my keys in my car because it sometimes automatically locks after I get out of it for a brief moment. I'm almost tempted to buy a car that is manual next time.

Originally Posted by greg42

Besides, I thought it was the windows in question rather than the door locks.

Yep, that's it.

Chrysler Group LLC, which manufactured the Griffiths' minivan, is another defendant. Attorney Alan Perer said Chrysler is being sued because the electric windows didn't work once submerged and the water pressure kept the victims from opening the doors to escape.

Read more: Fatal flooding in 2011 on Washington Boulevard brings suit against many - Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

[greg42]

Originally Posted by Hopes

I'm almost tempted to buy a car that is manual next time. .

Getting manually locks (and windows) is essentially impossible for all but a few types: a few really base economy cars (the cheapest little cars, not the base model of a larger sedan), base fleet-type pickups or something old. You may still find a few with manual knobs or levers in addition to the power control, but I think that has mostly faded. And usually you can find a way to disable the automatic locking on shifting into gear. On some cars that is officially selectable at the dealer. On others, it is more of a hack.

And, get this: I may have remembered it wrong, but I want to say a rental car I had a couple years ago, Chevy Cobalt, had "manual" locks, but it still locked 'em all when you shifted into gear! In other words, the lock motors are present and they deleted a couple of switches on the door.

[Hopes]

I hope the lawsuit produces positive change in the auto industry. All manufacturers should make cars people can escape from when stuck in water.

Attorney Perer said Chrysler is being sued because the electric windows on the Griffiths' Town and County minivan didn't work once submerged and the water pressure kept the victims from opening the doors to escape

Perer said in addition to unspecified monetary damages, he'd like to see the auto maker include in its owner's manual instructions for drivers who become submerged and if electric windows can't be made foolproof under water, maybe other safety equipment could be included.

"When this kind of vehicle is caught in a serious flood, getting out of it can be difficult or impossible," Perer said. "It becomes a trap and it will take lives. Here it killed a mother and her young children."

2011 Pittsburgh Floods Prompt Lawsuits from 2 Families

[Kippy]

The flood gates failed to operate properly today.

Washington Boulevard floodgates currently not working | WPXI