Deutschtown Gateway Project (Pittsburgh, Butler, McDonald: how much, houses, neighborhoods)

[BrianTH]

So this sounds cool:

Deutschtown Gateway Project to enliven East Ohio Street, historic renovations and infill development

The Deutschtown Gateway Project, which is currently underway, includes restorations of several Victorian storefronts on East Ohio Street. . . . Phase I of the Deutschtown Gateway Project is the complete restoration a Victorian-era commercial building's facade at 632 East Ohio Street. . . . Among other improvements, colored art glass windows, hidden for decades behind an earlier remodeling, will soon be restored. . . . At 620-628 East Ohio Street, a combination restoration and infill construction project will add updated retail space to the block, whose buildings are mostly vacant. . . . HDDC is also planning renovate several other buildings it owns, including 431, 433, and 502 East Ohio Street.

Some more details:

http://www.pittsburghnorthside.com/L...bid=36&mid=420

[FreightTrainRunning]

Some more info on the project from the Northside Chronicle and some interesting background on the Grace Period building from John Canning (Northside's unofficial historian). As John points out, that didn't used to be a gateway area, it was the middle of E. Ohio St. until 279 bulldozed the other half of it.

[BrianTH]

Cool bit of history, and obviously a bummer about how I-279 blew up the neighborhood. Long-term I think it would be great to convert some of I-279/65 into a boulevard, and maybe reconfigure the I-579/28/279 interchange so that you could deck-park over the highway through most of Deutschtown.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by GeneW

Some more info on the project from the Northside Chronicle and some interesting background on the Grace Period building from John Canning (Northside's unofficial historian). As John points out, that didn't used to be a gateway area, it was the middle of E. Ohio St. until 279 bulldozed the other half of it.

Last I checked, there were still a handful of buildings on the first block past the highway. Google satellite view says five, but I'm pretty sure one or two more are gone now. I have my doubts that any but the ARC House building will survive the decade.

I really wish the city would recognize that, due to the highway, there are now two neighborhoods with very different trajectories. I actually think hiving East and West Deutschtown would be a win-win for both, as it would make West's redevelopment more clear, as well as show how much help East really needs. I can't think of any other neighborhood with such a dramatic split in Pittsburgh today.

If East Deutschtown ever makes a comeback, however, it will have to have its own commercial strip. Personally, I think Chestnut Street is one of the most picturesque in Pittsburgh, and I could easily see a commercial area there (some of the buildings even used to have storefronts). I may just be partial because it's one of the few brick-lined streets with trolley tracks intact I know if in Pittsburgh however.

[Lobick]

Originally Posted by eschaton

If East Deutschtown ever makes a comeback, however, it will have to have its own commercial strip. Personally, I think Chestnut Street is one of the most picturesque in Pittsburgh, and I could easily see a commercial area there (some of the buildings even used to have storefronts). I may just be partial because it's one of the few brick-lined streets with trolley tracks intact I know if in Pittsburgh however.

Chestnut is great but I think far too narrow to be a modern commercial district. Really, It's just two cars wide with no parking on either side. I think it would have to be some kind of combo of Troy Hill Rd and the one block of East Ohio, maybe using Penn Brewery as an anchor on the one end.

This is a long way off though I'm afraid. I think the residential component throughout the East Deutchtown area has to come first though, filling in the "missing teeth" and rehabbing some of the existing housing.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Lobick

Chestnut is great but I think far too narrow to be a modern commercial district. Really, It's just two cars wide with no parking on either side.

I was thinking more along the lines of a pedestrian shopping district. Obviously you can't have streetside parking there, but the five blocks are only a fifth of a mile and take around four minutes to walk. There's two entirely (and probably four soon) empty city blocks over by Madison Avenue for parking anyway, which is more than close enough considering how short the blocks are there.

Originally Posted by Lobick

I think it would have to be some kind of combo of Troy Hill Rd and the one block of East Ohio, maybe using Penn Brewery as an anchor on the one end.

I can't see a successful commercial district forming where one side of the road is undevelopable. I even see this in Lawrenceville, where there is a gap on the blocks facing the cemetery (between 47th and 51st) where there are few commercial businesses and a lot of houses directly fronting on Butler.

Originally Posted by Lobick

This is a long way off though I'm afraid. I think the residential component throughout the East Deutchtown area has to come first though, filling in the "missing teeth" and rehabbing some of the existing housing.

Maybe, maybe not. I'd argue Lawrenceville was an area where the commercial began developing (outside of Main/Fisk) before there was any residential interest. I'd also say the same is true for Garfield.

Admittedly, in those cases you're dealing with commercial areas along major roads which people are going to be traveling regardless. Areas like Bryant Street or Western Avenue, in contrast, have struggled due to few non-locals having any reason to travel them unless they're already planning to visit a business there, even though the neighborhoods as a whole are pretty thoroughly gentrified now.

[Lobick]

Originally Posted by eschaton

I was thinking more along the lines of a pedestrian shopping district. Obviously you can't have streetside parking there, but the five blocks are only a fifth of a mile and take around four minutes to walk. There's two entirely (and probably four soon) empty city blocks over by Madison Avenue for parking anyway, which is more than close enough considering how short the blocks are there.

It's an uncomfortable block to walk. Anytime I'm in the area with my dog or especially a stroller, I attempt to minimize my time on Chestnut. There's a great deal of traffic, acting as it does as a conduit to Spring Garden and also the route from North Ave to the 16th street bridge.

Just my opinion but a heavily trafficked narrow street with narrow sidewalks and without the buffer of a parking lane would have an uphill battle to becoming a viable pedestrian shopping district.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Admittedly, in those cases you're dealing with commercial areas along major roads which people are going to be traveling regardless.

I think that is enough of a difference, combined with the general difficulties of brick-and-mortar retail these days, to suggest that East Deustschtown will in fact need to experience a residential influx before it can have a commercial renaissance.