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Hello! Almost two years ago, our family moved to a western PA suburb far east of downtown that is supposed to be affluent and a bit snooty. We love our pricey property but I have been super disappointed in the school and the residents. I am seriously considering moving to another location, perhaps north of Pittsburgh, because I am so unhappy with the people here. BUT, I need feedback if what I am experiencing here is normal for western PA or is it contained to this area? I do LOVE downtown Pittsburgh. I love the art scene, the restaurants, the sports, the culture, the activities, the parks, the views. LOVELOVELOVE living near so much to see and do. But, here's my experiences:
1. Our school district is deemed one of the better school districts (in the top 15 of 105 according to the biz journal ratings). However, I have found the district to be a year behind the public schools where my children attended prior to the move, lots of restrictions and limitations relative to parents being in the classroom versus helping with fundraisers where they seem to be welcome, meaningless rules out the kazoo. There are crazy charges such as an activity fee that must be paid for the child to be in athletics, parking fees (from what I can tell, they make about $20,000/year from students parking on school property - is that normal????). Yet the buildings have had nothing done to them in probably 20-30 years. Only three elementary schools and the playgrounds are in terrible disrepair (in addition to being wholly inadequate for the number of children meant to play on it) and children play on the street despite a huge amount of acreage around the school. If you walk in the back of the school (which has been around probably at least 30 years) it looks like a house was built and the owners didn't have enough money for landscaping - hardly any sidewalks, no landscaping, overgrown areas and bare areas with drainage problems. The most disturbing to me is how NOT progressive the district and administrators are. I feel like everyone just wants everything to stay the same with no forward progress. Any suggestion to change anything is met with anger and stubbornness about that not being how it's done. To me this is the complete opposite of how an educational institution should be. Is this normal for this area? No money spent on upgrades, stuck in the past (I swear this area stopped progressing in the 80s!!! Perhaps it's from an economic recession resulting from the steel mills closing??). I think some of the rules do come from the State such as requiring an IQ of 130 for a child to be considered gifted. My children went from being gifted in our area to not being gifted based upon one test given to them here despite their scores putting them at higher than 95% of the population. But, here rules are rules! No bending or looking at other circumstances or outside the rigid box!!
2. People are extremely loyal to others in their neighborhood and treat anyone not in their neighborhood as an outsider. They are jealous of anyone trying to friend their neighbors. I cannot tell you how many times I have met a nice person that I felt a connection with only to interact with her neighbors and have them be downright mean to me (a woman in her 40s making fun of how I am painting at a charity event all because her neighbor seemed to like me?? Women ignoring me when I talk to them at a child's party??). I have never experienced this in my life. Yet it has happened THREE times here with all different neighborhoods. Neighbors seem to regularly congregate to drink also. I feel like I am surrounded by grown-ups trying to relive their college days and drinking and getting together with others all the time instead of parenting and spending time just with their family. Don't even get me started with how obsessed everyone is with where you went on vacation. Apparently your worth in their eyes is tied into the answer to that question!
3. Most of the people I meet are self-centered, their children seem to be an extension of themselves but otherwise the parent's life is what is important. Working moms brag about trips out of town and seem to judge others based upon their occupation (why is it deemed good that you spend MORE time away from your children and family???). Children are meant to excel in sports so parents can brag about them. Moms like to be active in the PTO but don't do a lot of actual time in the classrooms. Many of the homeroom parents don't attend the parties and arrange it via email with volunteers. Working moms seem to dominate the school and like to show up, do the minimum (such as bring a drink to the class party then leave early), and pat themselves on the back for being involved. People like to brag how they are too busy to actually be there.
4. The woman are super sensitive to public opinion of you. You can have a great relationship with them but if someone starts bad mouthing you then they pull away. I've had this happen a couple times. Three times I have had horrible situations with mothers which resulted in our children not playing together any more. This has never happened to me ever in 15 years and it has happened three times here in less than 2 years. One mom used me to get into the classroom as I was homeroom mom. Once she was in and made connections and made a new friend for her child, she stopped inviting my child over and stopped letting him play with my child. This was absolutely devastating to me and my child. Another mother freaked out on me because I apparently was not paying enough attention to her. First she tried to make me jealous with other moms who would cheer on all their children but not other children present (including my child) at an activity then when I called her on it she she and her friend started yelling in my face. I am in my 40s and felt like I was being bullied in high school. My child watched this as she and her friend ambushed us in the parking lot after the activity. Another mom decided she was popular as her young child was being invited to playdates (narcissists often think their child is an extension of them) and was competing with me to see who had the most friends for her child. I did not like her so was not a friend but maintained contact for our children. When I stopped going to the activity our children were in together, she texted how her child missed mine and let's get them together so I tried to arrange a time but she wouldn't commit and said she would get back with me and never did. Another one down. Don't get me wrong; my children have many other friends they play with but these three that turned sour are devastating as I've never had this happen prior to moving here and it breaks my heart to see my children so hurt. What am I supposed to do when a child wants one of those children to come over but the parent who did let it happen all of a sudden refuses?? Then there's other moms who hear people talking about these situations (from the other parent's viewpoint) and despite us having a great relationship, stop associating with me. I know it's good riddance but when the majority of people are like this, it makes it very hard to not be hurt. I have even noticed a couple situations where the husband has obviously been told the relationship between their child and mine is coming to an end and they seem noticeably uncomfortable as the men here seem normal and sane and not narcissistic and want to do what's right by their child. I'm so tired of dealing with this! We are talking about elementary school children!! Is this the same everywhere in western PA??
5. The children seem overly aggressive. Whereas where we moved from might have 1-2 aggressive children per class, here the majority are aggressive. The aggressive and outspoken attention hogs are rewarded for their behavior by teachers, coaches and others (I seriously think they never discipline children like this). I feel the behavior of these children are bullying but teachers dismissed my concerns. The children seem self-centered also, obsessed at a young age with expensive belongings and how they look. Children who are old enough to know better come to our house and talk about the friends coming to their house the next day despite never inviting my child to their house. The quiet, well behaved children are ignored and treated as stupid. Additionally one of my children told me that here the children form cliques in elementary school and if you are not in their clique then they are mean to you. Whereas where we lived before, all elementary school children were friendly to each other whether you were best friends or not. Are cliques at a young age with aggressive and cruel children normal for western PA??
So please help me! Is this normal for other areas of western PA??? I want to escape this area so badly!!! Unfortunately we do have a unique property that we LOVE which makes it so hard to leave. But I am super interested to know what is Pine Richland district like? North Allegheny? Cranberry Township area? Mars district? Is there anywhere with kind, friendly people who welcome everyone and believe in being inclusive to everyone (not just neighbors?)? Is there anywhere that has a real community feel? One where the children, their school, their playgrounds (absolutely no nice playgrounds in this area AT ALL) take precedence. Where kindness is more important than sports (even kindness IN sports). Thanks for your help!!!
Neighbors seem to regularly congregate to drink also. I feel like I am surrounded by grown-ups trying to relive their college days and drinking and getting together with others all the time instead of parenting and spending time just with their family.
I'm not about to talk to people sober unless I'm being paid.
1. Funding for public schools in PA won't be changing any time soon. This is a blue state where the teacher's union dominates. The money is spent on administration, teachers, and athletic fields. As far as your kid not being gifted, don't take it so personally.
2. Western PA is extremely cliquish, especially with people who grew up together. Yes, there are big drinkers. I've found a lot of friends who are very active and drink little. You have to search them out but they are there.
3. This is the US today. Every kid is special. As far as the materialistic stuff, that happens in every East Coast city I have lived in.
I never understood the whole homeroom mom thing. I have friends who are stay at home moms throughout the country and they have the same complaints about parents not showing up to volunteer during school. First, most people work at least 40 hours a week then they have to come home and supervise hours of homework. Second, what are teachers doing if they are getting additional FREE help from parents during the day? We never had this when I was growing up. We had teachers. That is it. I don't have any volunteers helping me at work. Sounds like more waste of my tax dollars.
4. We live in a Facebook World where everyone has to agree in order to get along. I see it here all the time on the forum. If someone doesn't want to be "friends" with you, then big deal.
5. You will find people are aggressive here. Try being a walker. It gets better the farther away you get from the city. I've found that it's about an 1 1/2 hour radius from the city before people start to relax.
6. It isn't on your list but I am adding it. The best experiences from friends and relatives throughout the US have been when they sent their kids to private religious schools. Their children really excelled.
Last edited by bluecarebear; 08-29-2016 at 05:04 AM..
Why do you think parents should be in the classroom, and in what capacity? Also, what do you think your children deserve to be in the gifted program if they are not, in fact, gifted?
I will give you my recent experience (and it is very recent). We moved here over 4 years ago. For the first three years, it was great. My kids thrived and still thrive in the school district. Like you, it is one of the top schools in the area. One son is doing great with school, the other is not a student but has thrived in other areas. They are both in high school and were in middle school when we came here.
Now, comes the other part. My husband could not find full time permanent work here. He commuted to Youngstown for 10 months until that place closed. Then he went back to school, became a CDL driver, got a local job and again, in the winter the hours were terrible (try, one day a month). So he went back to his old job in NY and I stayed here with the kids. Then their landlord in NY sold the house and he went to work in Scranton for the company he worked for in Pittsburgh. He is living in our weekend house in the Poconos (we have had that for a long while). I did find work and really like the people I work with and my job.
Outside that. I had two experiences within the last 6 months that have me questioning people here. Yes, they are very very parochial and look out for themselves. Extended family is very important and there is very little space for outsides. As an immigrant, with no extended family it gets lonely here. One experience involved someone on the school board ; their contractor dumped concrete on our property and I called her out on it. She called me on the phone and screamed, cursed, and basically was obnoxious. It was the third time someone had dumped stuff on the property. In a general mail to a group, I did not name her, or the contractor but just said that the person who dumped concrete needs to clean it up. The way she spoke to me on the phone was appauling. At the end of the conversation, she said that she was on the school board and basically how dare I call her out on something when I should have just knocked on her door and calmey ask her to remove it.
The second only happened two weeks ago. Again, it was someone that has a very public position within the community. The football team were doing a senior picture and as my son was in boot camp for army, I asked if they could photoshop him into the picture. They agreed and said it could be done with todays technology. Well, the picture came out, and no son. Again, I called them out on it, and she asked me to call her on the phone. I didn't as I was driving from Georgia but I did call her the following morning. Again, I was hit with a barrage of screaming for 15 minutes. It went on and on. I wouldn't care if my son was on a vacation, but he was in bootcamp for 10 weeks and will be serving his country next year.
Lesson here ; let the powers that be do their stuff and eventually karma will come back. It is a shame that these two public people can behave in such a way. They feel that they are immune to bad behavior and can treat people whatever way they want.
I also have found that they do drink together. Last year, my husband and I went to the local golf club as usual after football. The only other people there were a group of about 10 parents. They live close to us. Do you think one of them would have asked us to join them ; not one. Now, our kids are all on the same team together so I would have thought they would like to get to know the neighbours, or the parents but no. They just are not welcoming at all.
I will be moving in two years when my youngest finishes school.
I'd be curious to know what school district the OP is in now so that I don't suggest it to any newcomers.
She dropped enough clues I'm pretty sure I know, but she avoided naming names so I won't guess out loud. Go back and reread and if you know the eastern suburbs, it can be only one.
Wow, you guys make it sound like people in affluent suburbs are snooty, cliquish, and sometimes exhibit entitled behavior. My entire worldview is shaken.
Anyway, who knows what's going on? I don't interact a lot with people from the eastern suburbs and virtually never with anybody who would describe themselves as a "bliss finder". I don't really know what you're supposed to say to either group.
She dropped enough clues I'm pretty sure I know, but she avoided naming names so I won't guess out loud. Go back and reread and if you know the eastern suburbs, it can be only one.
I didn't catch many hints excecept that top 15 one which is all you need, shes either in Franklin, or clueless to the fact that shes in an average school district.
after that, its PT Norwin, Latrobe right.. and i seriously doubt, except a housing plan or 2 in each of them, anyone would consider them affluent.
Anyway yeah moving north you will have better school districts but if you expect the cliques or snobbery to STOP by moving to pine richland or fox chapel you will be severely disappointed.
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