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Personally, I think corporations should be abolished. If someone wants to start a business, it should be as a sole proprietorship or partnership -- where the owners' personal assets are liable.
I'll tell it like it is. For those of us who are NOT rich, and who did NOT make fortunes in the 1960s and 70s when we still had a sensible economic system, this country SUCKS. It sucks for poor and middle-class people. It SUCKS. There is NO real opportunity anymore -- this is not 1955, or even 1970. The "land of opportunity" moved to Canada, Europe, Brazil and China. The "American Dream" is now the "Norwegian Dream." America is now the land of corporate despots and their paid government shills. It is a big scam -- a Ponzi scheme -- the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. If immigration to Europe or Canada wasn't so restrictive, I would be gone yesterday.
Also, for those of you determined to make this a personal attack against me and call me a loser: I went to college, was a part of extracurricular activities, competed on academic teams, lead class projects, earned a 3.46 GPA (would have been 3.7 if not for the first semester of my freshman year), moved across the country to find a job and landed employment. I run a grant writing business on the side. I'm not some welfare queen or druggie or dropout. I just think this country has nothing to offer young people who are graduating in this recession, or older people who got laid off from their jobs. I actually give a flip about someone other than myself.
I can't speak for anyone else, but in my opinion, you identify legitimate issues but are missing the real cause. It's not "Capitalism" that is operating here. This is a Plutocracy operating under various disguises ... here the disguise is "Free Market Capitalism", while in other places it is called Fascism ... or ... Communism .... or Socialism .... it's all run by the same plutocracy, and has been that way long before you were born.
We've seen glimpses of what true "free markets" can produce, and it has proven far superior to any other system ... yet, behind the scenes, the plutocracy remains in charge, and it is they who create the boom and bust cycles which could be characterized as a form of "economic/industrial farming". These manipulators are the problem, and their game is a very old one that has been operating long before you or I were born.
So even if you had the means, don't bother running off to Europe in search of economic justice and fairness ... because that is the seat of this plutocracy ... specifically, London. And you, like most, are completely unaware of the real world that exists, and have been living under a total illusion.
By the turn of the century (1900), it was estimated that the Rothschild family was worth as much as 500 Trillion Dollars ... over half of the wealth of the entire planet .... and I'd be willing to bet they've advanced well beyond that over the last 100 years. Do you realize the significance of this? Their wealth exceeds the total US National Dept by a factor of at least 30 or more times. And that 14 Trillion US debt is owed to them, all of it, odious debt that is steeped in fraud and racketeering, and should be defaulted on, while seizing the Federal Reserve and reclaiming their assets as stolen wealth. Of course, that could only happen with a legitimate government operating the US ... instead of their owned agents.
They own or share ownership of everything of any significance, including the Bank of England, the World Bank, the IMF, the Federal Reserve, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan, and anyone else of any significance. They've amassed Hundreds of Trillions of Gold which they keep in their underground vaults, all of it collected through their various banking schemes, their funding of wars (both sides) and their total domination of the worldwide financial system. They are the "Globalists", and the various entities pushing for the Global Economy ... the One World Government or NWO all work for them.
And you cannot defeat an enemy that doesn't even exist in the public's perception ... and that's precisely why they've gone to such lengths to remain invisible, hiding behind their multitudes of corporate entities who are in reality, their agents.
Now, we can sit back here and watch the clueless come out of the woodwork claiming "Conspiracy Theory!!!"
It certainly is a conspiracy, but it's a fact, not a theory. And it is well documented, though not something you are likely to see discussed on the mainstream news ..... they own that too.
Personally, I think corporations should be abolished. If someone wants to start a business, it should be as a sole proprietorship or partnership -- where the owners' personal assets are liable.
Hmmm.... can't find anything in the US Constitution about corporations.
And I don't know anybody who supports "giving a free ride to corporations..."
And yes, the primary purpose of the constitution is to protect the rights of the people and limit the powers of government... not to protect the rights of government.
Rights of the government? You could use less emotions and more rationality in your arguments. It will help. Anyway, you won’t find “corporations†in the constitution because it doesn’t deal with defining the economic framework. It deals with the authorities of the government, and the one that applies is regulating commerce.
But then, you are one of those likely to claim that government should not regulate commerce?
Oh I will, believe you me. And the "propoanda" sure buys me a lot of nice stuff, beautiful house, pool, hot tub, three trucks and more. Nice to have 250,000 "propagandas" a year coming in!!!
You should perhaps familiarize yourself with history ... start off with the "Weimar Republic", and particularly the area of "hyperinflation".
And then, when a loaf of bread costs a $1,000 almost worthless Federal Reserve Notes .... tell us all about your 250 loaves of bread per year, and how tender those trucks are when grilled properly.
Whose rights? What rights? Would that include the idea of corporate personhood, and unchecked “speech†when it comes to supplying politicians with cash?
Individuals rights, as in the Bill of Rights and constitution. Those should not carry forward to government created entities such as corporations. An entity is not a person.
I have no problem with political donations, it just needs to be transparent. The less money politicians have to dole out, the less they will receive from people looking for a handout. I don't like the idea of corporations and Unions funding elections but every band and regulation is met with loopholes and less transparency. The more open things are the better.
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Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost
And do you think such charters would be supported by free marketers? In fact, who would even dare to bring about those changes that actually existed at one point when politicians get elected on money and sponsorships, much less candidates who spend millions of their own monies to be the regulator?
How realistic would it be to expect corporate charters as they existed in the early days of this nation?
True free marketers would support it, it creates and upholds a truly free market. Crony corporatist would not support it.
Changes such as those I describe would come about quickly during a crisis era. (I believe we are in the early stages) People will turn against the monied interests as our fear level rises. Right now the money changers have done a great job keeping the bubble going. I am sure they have an exit strategy for themselves and they will cash out before the fall but they are keep us complacent.
Once the axis shifts from the privileged vs. the privileged (Union
vs. Big Biz) or (Soros vs. Koch Brothers) to one of the Union, big biz, Koch, Soros elite against the average Joe, we will see radical change.
We will either see total authoritarian top down rule, with laws and regulations to placate the frightened masses or a shift toward and truly even playing field with simple rules and a referee (government).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost
Technically true, but I meant my own definition which I assumed you would ask to explain. And Ma and Pa shops can't compete with corporate conglomerates. Think... sort of what invoked the American revolution.
Now that Beetles song is stuck in my head.
I sorry, I thought the real definition would work better....
However, I will ask you how it is you think the Ma and Pa shop (revolution if there was one) can not enter into the competition if they so desire under our current economic system, which capitalism is very much a part? Now remember, Sam Walton, use to have one, count them, one, "five and dime" store many moons ago. It was family owned and operated and if I'm not mistaken, Walmart still is, family owned, now, a corporation.
So, what made Sam Walton special that he succeeded where others like him, have supposedly failed?
Also, this is a bad thing why, exactly?
Please don't come back with what Obama says that a person can earn just too much money, because that's just wrong on so many levels it ceased to be funny a long time ago.
Last edited by Ellis Bell; 03-08-2011 at 12:14 PM..
Reason: () inserted
Individuals rights, as in the Bill of Rights and constitution. Those should not carry forward to government created entities such as corporations. An entity is not a person.
We agree on that. Where we seem to be at odds is responsibilities of the government defined beyond the bill of rights.
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I have no problem with political donations, it just needs to be transparent.
I do. Its not that corporate sponsorships are any secret. Or that politicians are shying away from "investing" their own millions.
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True free marketers would support it, it creates and upholds a truly free market. Crony corporatist would not support it.
I doubt it, but also depends on who qualifies as a true free marketeer. There are likes of Ron Paul who would generally be seen as such, but will there be support for strong government regulations from them? If anything, they propose government getting completely out of the way.
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Changes such as those I describe would come about quickly during a crisis era.
I doubt it, or during the course of humanity, we would have ample examples to see it put to practice. And even if some aspects could be, the natural self of people will show up and it will all be back to "normal".
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We will either see total authoritarian top down rule, with laws and regulations to placate the frightened masses or a shift toward and truly even playing field with simple rules and a referee (government).
If you think government only has the role of a referee and without the ability to actually regulate anything, you would be one of those free marketeers opposed to government regulating via strict charters. This contradicts with your previous support, that regulations are authoritarian. Are you sure you're up for strict regulations on corporations? Or, would that be authoritarian?
The OP wants massive and oppressive gov't regulation. He does not think the people can manipulate the market, but they ARE the market, so of course they can manipulate it.
I disagree with the regulation already occurring, it is already excessive and that is part of why jobs are being shipped overseas. The liberals, generally speaking, love to complain about that fact but then they insist on creating even more barriers to business success. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.
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