Are Medicare and Social Security Unconstitutional? (legal, Obama, election, elect)

[Winter_Sucks]

Rick Perry says that Medicare and Social Security are unconstitutional. Is he right?

[rw47]

Yes, they are. On a federal level at least.

[Winter_Sucks]

Originally Posted by SamBarrow

Yes, they are. On a federal level at least.

Then why have they not been ruled unconstitutional?

[rw47]

Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks

Then why have they not been ruled unconstitutional?

It's a matter of interpretation. The way they got social security through for example was with the general welfare clause.

[Winter_Sucks]

Originally Posted by SamBarrow

It's a matter of interpretation. The way they got social security through for example was with the general welfare clause.

So is Rick Perry going to run on the platform of abolishing Social Security and Medicare?

[rw47]

Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks

So is Rick Perry going to run on the platform of abolishing Social Security and Medicare?

I highly doubt it. The vast majority of people do not want them abolished.

[ALackOfCreativity]

Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks

Then why have they not been ruled unconstitutional?

The supreme court post court-packing crisis, and into the Warren court, made a ton of rulings that weren't constitutional.

However, so many decades into the future they have become de-facto part of constitutional law because moderate judges don't, as a rule, want to turn back decades of jurisprudential precedent regardless of whether or not the rulings were made correctly at the time, while many liberal judges still take a damn-the-constitution (this is the subtext to appointing judges with "empathy" -- it really means those who value their desired results over the letter of the law) attitude to legal rulings.

Throwing ~70 years of legal precedent over the bridge is a really big deal even if you don't like the results and even if the original cases were clearly decided in a manner that was against how they should from a legal standpoint because the judges were deciding cases based on their politics. It would throw the entire legal system into chaos.

[Mircea]

Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks

Rick Perry says that Medicare and Social Security are unconstitutional. Is he right?

I believe he is.

Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks

Then why have they not been ruled unconstitutional?

It has to be challenged, and more than that, it has to be challenged correctly.

Child Support and Alimony are also unconstitutional, but no one has yet mounted a proper legal challenge for violations of the 5th, 6th, 7th and 8th Amendments.

If you wanted to challenge Social Security and Medicare, you'd have to do it under the 9th and 10th Amendments.

Given that Obamacare has been ruled unconstitutional, you could make a case for Medicare, using the same basic argument.

[Winter_Sucks]

Originally Posted by SamBarrow

I highly doubt it. The vast majority of people do not want them abolished.

If he makes it out the primary with the nomination then he is DOA in the general election. As a Democrat, I hope he actually wins the nomination.

[mackinac81]

Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks

So is Rick Perry going to run on the platform of abolishing Social Security and Medicare?

Well if he really thinks they're unconstitutional then he should run on that. I'd love to see how that would go over with the electorate.