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The EU and the eurozone are not the same thing.
The EU can exist without the euro.
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its attempt to impliment sound fiscal policies across its member states has failed,
Oh really?
You do realise that the EU has not had the power to force member states to comply with ''sound fiscal policies''?
Hence the crisis we have now.
Let me get this straight - you are criticising the EU for not doing something that it didn't have the power to do?
So you would support the member states relinquishing control over fiscal policy to the EU?
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its undemocratic
Sorry, I didn't realise that the 27 member states were not parliamentary democracies.
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and heavily bureaucratic.
I agree. But that's hardly enough to justify saying:
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Basically it's going to collapse.
Wishful thinking really.
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The structure and control of the EU is driven by the ability to impliment monetary policy and it's over. Quit attempting bail-outs and bond purchases, it's only kicking the can further down the road.
I agree. The bailouts will cease if a major nation's banks get into trouble though. The ECB will be forced to print more euros in that scenario.
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Spain/Greece/Ireland/Portugal/Italy are FINISHED within the EU
That is ridiculous. You have no basis for that claim whatsoever. The Greeks might leave the eurozone within the next 24 months.
But there is no mechanism for ejecting any member state from the EU.
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, and will drag the entire thing down because all the EU wants to do is maintain its control,
Control what exactly?
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rather then let those countries devalue.
The ECB's main functions include maintaining price stability right across the eurozone. Not just inflating the currency to bail out the periphery.
That said, I agree that the policy responses have been haphazard and at times unhelpful - I live in one of those peripheral countries, so I know all about the impact of poor decision making - but that doesn;t mean the whole eurozone is about to break up, and especially not the entire EU.
Ideally no, there is nothing wrong with it. America has always championed European integration and for good reasons.
Pragmatically though, it is problematic. The examples are numerous.
France and the UK were very enthusiastic about going to war against Libya. Germany wanted nothing to do with it. So much for a common foreign policy.
The Euro crisis speaks volumes. How can you share a currency when some nations (Germany, Austria) are fiscally prudent while others (Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Ireland) spend like drunken sailors? So much for a common currency.
Sure, the EEC>EC>EU did much to avoid another war. So did the success of democracy in Germany, Italy, Austria, Spain, etc. Democracies do not fight other democracies.
Don't get me wrong. I am not praying for the failure of the EU. As an interested outsider, I simply think some of the goals may be unrealistic as these are still different countries rather than different states.
I agree with much of that. I'm not sure that lumping in Ireland with places like Greece is helpful though.
We have a wreckless banking sector and we are currently spending more than we collect in revenue. The first issue is more troublesome - it's harder to rectify and has had a huge impact across the economy. The second is more straightforward - and measures are already being taken to balance the budget.
Greece though, just cooked the books. I think they will have to leave the eurozone at some stage.
Back to your main point though - I agree that the fiscal situation will have to be fixed one way or the other. A common foreign policy is also another area with potential for huge disagreement - that's why I think a federal Europe is way off. There are simply too many differing perspectives and goals to accommodate in a federal union.
The loose treaty system we have is probably the maximum amount of integration possible at the present time.
I agree with much of that. I'm not sure that lumping in Ireland with places like Greece is helpful though.
We have a wreckless banking sector and we are currently spending more than we collect in revenue. The first issue is more troublesome - it's harder to rectify and has had a huge impact across the economy. The second is more straightforward - and measures are already being taken to balance the budget.
Greece though, just cooked the books. I think they will have to leave the eurozone at some stage.
Back to your main point though - I agree that the fiscal situation will have to be fixed one way or the other. A common foreign policy is also another area with potential for huge disagreement - that's why I think a federal Europe is way off. There are simply too many differing perspectives and goals to accommodate in a federal union.
The loose treaty system we have is probably the maximum amount of integration possible at the present time.
I take it you are Irish?
I am just sketching some broad strokes and thus not necessarilly equating Ireland with Greece. Its not like we are fiscal wizards over here anyway.
The EU and the eurozone are not the same thing.
The EU can exist without the euro.
Oh really?
You do realise that the EU has not had the power to force member states to comply with ''sound fiscal policies''?
Hence the crisis we have now.
Let me get this straight - you are criticising the EU for not doing something that it didn't have the power to do?
So you would support the member states relinquishing control over fiscal policy to the EU?
Sorry, I didn't realise that the 27 member states were not parliamentary democracies.
I agree. But that's hardly enough to justify saying:
Wishful thinking really.
I agree. The bailouts will cease if a major nation's banks get into trouble though. The ECB will be forced to print more euros in that scenario.
That is ridiculous. You have no basis for that claim whatsoever. The Greeks might leave the eurozone within the next 24 months.
But there is no mechanism for ejecting any member state from the EU.
Control what exactly?
The ECB's main functions include maintaining price stability right across the eurozone. Not just inflating the currency to bail out the periphery.
That said, I agree that the policy responses have been haphazard and at times unhelpful - I live in one of those peripheral countries, so I know all about the impact of poor decision making - but that doesn;t mean the whole eurozone is about to break up, and especially not the entire EU.
Look, Shane, I have no doubt that you know more about the structure of the EU than I do. What I am telling you is that outside of free trade and cooperation, it's totally laughable to attempt to think that Spain and Romania should be in the same economic framework and union as Germany and France. It is done Shane, Brussels as you know it is finished. The Eurozone and European Union are one and the same: Yes I know technically they aren't and the EU spans countries that have their own currency. The power structure of the EU is drawn by control of a currency: that currency is finished.
I still have bits and pieces a well. The Dutch Guilder bills were amazing. The Swiss Franc ones are not bad.
And I will never give up my East German Ostmarks.
I don't know if this happened to you, but it was common among us expats in Germany. We all had jars brimming with Pfennig coins. Mostly resulted from buying groceries and feeling too rushed to pay in exact change. So we would hand them huge bills and end up with tons of Pfennigs.
Uh...the Pfennig. Worthless as hell. I left Europe just before they went to the common currency.
I do agree with him on this line - "Nobody from either party will address this or even discuss this and the reason should be obvious - the banks own the politicians."
Greece will cease to function, over this weekend.
Then like Dominoes, the European union falls, eventually taking the USA with it, because of the Feds involvement in world banking and not just the USA.
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It' Over- European Union
