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Old 11-05-2011, 08:06 PM
 
1,568 posts, read 1,553,377 times
Reputation: 414

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
Take it from working people like you??? You identify with the 1%??!! Just because you have some kind of "job" to get up and go to you are getting all superior?? Please stop and take a breath. The Big 3 were uncompetitive because wages were 52% of revenue. Do you really imagine the bulk of that was the ~$30/hr paid to line workers or was it the $40M/yr (plus!!) paid to the CEO and the proportionate salaries paid to the rest of the Executive Branch? And, no, people won't be "willing" to take $14/hr for work that until very recently paid twice that. But they will and that does not at all mean that that is a fair wage. Henry Ford housed his workers and fed them too! Does Ford II house and feed his worker? Given the realities of inflation and the triplicate and quintuplicate mulitplication of the cost of most of Americans basic expenses should wages be moving downward in America???? Even in China wages move upward! They move upward in every single besotted piece of the world called a country except the United States (and the United Kingdom). You've got no empathy for UAW members because you obviously don't work in auto manufacture or have loved ones that do (neither do I btw which might be instructive but probably won't be) but you should. Things got to this sorry state because Americans only watch their own backs.

H
Who says you can live where you want and make what you want?

Where on this planet does that exist?
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:11 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,855 posts, read 11,942,488 times
Reputation: 10028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Kim View Post
The beauty of this country is that you can leave a state that has handed you a crap sandwich and start over someplace else, but stay in the USA.

Not too many countries can say that.
There are states and there are states. Talk is cheap. The vast majority of Americans live where they were born. The vast majority of humans live where they were born. America is not going to turn into some kind of Bedouin desert with bands of roving Americans living in the town with the current lowest unemployment. Do we really need to descend to this level of silliness in debate? And... do I really need to 'go there': when the jobless start migrating to North Dakota and Wyoming and Montana and start applying for jobs are you going to tell me with a straight face that the color of their skin or their ethnicity (their gender!) isn't going to work against them in most cases? FAIL

H
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:12 PM
 
29,981 posts, read 42,965,286 times
Reputation: 12828
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Kim View Post
Who says you can live where you want and make what you want?

Where on this planet does that exist?
In the fantasy of utopian Socialists and communists who believe forced unionization Communist Style worldwide in exchange for the freedoms and liberties affirmed by our Consitution is a preferable economy and rule of law.
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:13 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,855 posts, read 11,942,488 times
Reputation: 10028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Kim View Post
Who says you can live where you want and make what you want?

Where on this planet does that exist?
It existed right here in this very country until the signing of NAFTA

H
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:13 PM
 
29,981 posts, read 42,965,286 times
Reputation: 12828
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
There are states and there are states. Talk is cheap. The vast majority of Americans live where they were born. The vast majority of humans live where they were born. America is not going to turn into some kind of Bedouin desert with bands of roving Americans living in the town with the current lowest unemployment. Do we really need to descend to this level of silliness in debate? And... do I really need to 'go there': when the jobless start migrating to North Dakota and Wyoming and Montana and start applying for jobs are you going to tell me with a straight face that the color of their skin or their ethnicity (their gender!) isn't going to work against them in most cases? FAIL

H
North Dakota has the lowest UE rate in the country thanks to their restructuring of corporate taxes and the oil boom. People whom are willing to work should go there. A huge construction boom too trying to keep pace with the needs of the new work force.
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:17 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma
608 posts, read 924,373 times
Reputation: 415
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
There are states and there are states. Talk is cheap. The vast majority of Americans live where they were born. The vast majority of humans live where they were born. America is not going to turn into some kind of Bedouin desert with bands of roving Americans living in the town with the current lowest unemployment. Do we really need to descend to this level of silliness in debate? And... do I really need to 'go there': when the jobless start migrating to North Dakota and Wyoming and Montana and start applying for jobs are you going to tell me with a straight face that the color of their skin or their ethnicity (their gender!) isn't going to work against them in most cases? FAIL

H
How did race enter into your so far baseless rant? BTW, skin color doesn't matter in the oil industry, skill and desire to learn determine one's fate here. On a historical note, your ancestors likely came to Oregon (or somewhere else in the USA) due to better opportunity, so moving around to find a better job isn't unusual. Anymore questions?
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:18 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,855 posts, read 11,942,488 times
Reputation: 10028
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal View Post
In the fantasy of utopian Socialists and communists who believe forced unionization Communist Style worldwide in exchange for the freedoms and liberties affirmed by our Consitution is a preferable economy and rule of law.
Our Constitution never affirmed Corporate Personhood. You've got maybe 10 years to enjoy what is left of Democratic Capitalism. I don't know what will replace it but it has reached its zenith with the 1%. Three hundred million plus people are not going to do without basic needs while a 1% ruling class hoard national treasure.

H
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:18 PM
 
1,568 posts, read 1,553,377 times
Reputation: 414
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
It existed right here in this very country until the signing of NAFTA

H
What does NAFTA have to do with better jobs in North Dakota than in California?
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:25 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,855 posts, read 11,942,488 times
Reputation: 10028
Quote:
Originally Posted by catfishing View Post
How did race enter into your so far baseless rant? BTW, skin color doesn't matter in the oil industry, skill and desire to learn determine one's fate here. On a historical note, your ancestors likely came to Oregon (or somewhere else in the USA) due to better opportunity, so moving around to find a better job isn't unusual. Anymore questions?
Race matters in every industry. Especially well paying ones. No one is accepting applications from over 50y.o. hopefuls with no prior experience in the industry. No one. Even the military cuts off at 42yo and that is higher than previously. People move around this country to find better intrinsics, not to find work. A better job is one thing, a job? A job should be available any old where a person happens to be. You can argue otherwise and point to reality as a basis but... who says that the current reality is right? Or haven't you realized yet that that is what the whole OWS thing is about?

H
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:26 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,855 posts, read 11,942,488 times
Reputation: 10028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Kim View Post
What does NAFTA have to do with better jobs in North Dakota than in California?
If you live in North Dakota you will soon find out.

H
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