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Old 02-06-2012, 12:02 PM
 
1,677 posts, read 1,668,459 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Themselves ya think?
More need to wrap their brains around that^
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:04 PM
 
20,724 posts, read 19,367,499 times
Reputation: 8288
The middle class tends to make goods and services. Rich people don't tend to just sell goods and services. While they often are involved producing goods and services, they are also heavily involved in access charges to existing values like ground rents.

Crown family buys suburban office buildings - News - Crain's Chicago Business

Volatility suits them and is a big no product money maker.
“You’re seeing more high-net-worth investors and family offices seeking the bottom of the real estate market,” says Kenneth Szady, an executive director with the capital markets group of Cushman & Wakefield Inc., who wasn’t involved in the transaction. “These are longer-term investors, very comfortable with the fundamentals of Chicago. They’ll weather the storm for a brighter day.”
While the buildings are worth something, vast sums are in the unimproved land.


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7 million is an access charge as is all the ground beneath all the real estate in the country.

* access charges
* not products and services
*paid out from the goods and services of the middle class who pay the wealthy access fees
* feudalistic
* extractive
* job killing
* wealth transering
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:21 PM
 
Location: London
1,068 posts, read 2,022,158 times
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If the majority of the country are working in a climate of wage deflation as wages are stifled by corporate desires to have the working man subsidise inflation busting pay hikes that they really don't need then that is less disposable income for an economy.

It also means more of a drain for the economy as the increased revenue in reasonable wages in relation to living costs disappears in a vaccuum that not only takes with one hand but takes with the other as corporations forfeit on their obligation to pay a decent wage knowing that the state will step in and plug the disparity between low wages and the need to pay the rent/living costs/medicare etc.....

The financial sector also forfeits any responsibility to store funds in reserve, preferring to pass the buck onto the taxpayer. Communism for the few, capitalism, a downward spiral of wage deflation and poverty for everyone else as the profits are privatised and the debts socialised.

In effect, the role that taxes were designed for (i.e to fund infrastructure, roads, schools and hospitals etc...) is forgotten as Governments funded by the corporate sector put up the smokescreen that taxes aren't really meant for public services at all but are instead to be stored in a huge vault to be dipped into by the private sector whenever they like, relinquishing them of any duty to be responsible or legislate for the failures of their self-serving and risk free actions.

They talk a tough game but then it's easy to when the game is rigged in your favour. However things turn out for the financial sector one thing is certain. It's easy to take so called 'risks' when you're taking them in the knowledge that any risks that fail will be absorbed by the taxpayer and that win or lose, you will be rewarded.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:22 PM
 
1,677 posts, read 1,668,459 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus View Post
Perhaps. Perhaps the demand is greater than I think it is.

The situation is a lot like the Henry Ford quote: “If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.” What I'd be selling is something that is:

a. Specific to each firm, requiring rather detailed knowledge of how a firm operates, and the data "byproducts" it generates.
b. Something that people don't know can be done at all, and therefore have a hard time paying for.

Eliminate the bold from your thinking or forget the idea.

You seem to have the ability to think creatively so think about creative, non-traditional ways to accomplish your goal.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:27 PM
 
20,724 posts, read 19,367,499 times
Reputation: 8288
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear&Whiskey View Post
If the majority of the country are working in a climate of wage deflation as wages are stifled by corporate desires to have the working man subsidise inflation busting pay hikes that they really don't need then that is less disposable income for an economy.

It also means more of a drain for the economy as the increased revenue in reasonable wages in relation to living costs disappears in a vaccuum that not only takes with one hand but takes with the other as corporations forfeit on their obligation to pay a decent wage knowing that the state will step in and plug the disparity between low wages and the need to pay the rent/living costs/medicare etc.....

The financial sector also forfeits any responsibility to store funds in reserve, preferring to pass the buck onto the taxpayer. Communism for the few, capitalism, a downward spiral of wage deflation and poverty for everyone else as the profits are privatised and the debts socialised.

In effect, the role that taxes were designed for (i.e to fund infrastructure, roads, schools and hospitals etc...) is forgotten as Governments funded by the corporate sector put up the smokescreen that taxes aren't really meant for public services at all but are instead to be stored in a huge vault to be dipped into by the private sector whenever they like, relinquishing them of any duty to be responsible or legislate for the failures of their self-serving and risk free actions.

They talk a tough game but then it's easy to when the game is rigged in your favour. However things turn out for the financial sector one thing is certain. It's easy to be tough when win or lose, you will be rewarded.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:31 PM
 
3,457 posts, read 3,623,334 times
Reputation: 1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by scarlet_ohara View Post
Eliminate the bold from your thinking or forget the idea.
Well, my goal is to eliminate it as a problem, rather than just stop thinking about it.

Really, I need capital for my product-based idea, which is why it's not going to happen. What'll happen is, I'll probably build a firm based on my skill set (service-based idea), and then make some money, and then deploy that capital toward my second idea. (if it is still there.)
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:33 PM
 
3,457 posts, read 3,623,334 times
Reputation: 1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear&Whiskey View Post
If the majority of the country are working in a climate of wage deflation as wages are stifled by corporate desires to have the working man subsidise inflation busting pay hikes that they really don't need then that is less disposable income for an economy.

It also means more of a drain for the economy as the increased revenue in reasonable wages in relation to living costs disappears in a vaccuum that not only takes with one hand but takes with the other as corporations forfeit on their obligation to pay a decent wage knowing that the state will step in and plug the disparity between low wages and the need to pay the rent/living costs/medicare etc.....

The financial sector also forfeits any responsibility to store funds in reserve, preferring to pass the buck onto the taxpayer. Communism for the few, capitalism, a downward spiral of wage deflation and poverty for everyone else as the profits are privatised and the debts socialised.

In effect, the role that taxes were designed for (i.e to fund infrastructure, roads, schools and hospitals etc...) is forgotten as Governments funded by the corporate sector put up the smokescreen that taxes aren't really meant for public services at all but are instead to be stored in a huge vault to be dipped into by the private sector whenever they like, relinquishing them of any duty to be responsible or legislate for the failures of their self-serving and risk free actions.

They talk a tough game but then it's easy to when the game is rigged in your favour. However things turn out for the financial sector one thing is certain. It's easy to take so called 'risks' when you're taking them in the knowledge that any risks that fail will be absorbed by the taxpayer and that win or lose, you will be rewarded.
This sums the macroeconomic situation up quite well.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:55 PM
 
15,092 posts, read 8,634,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chromekitty View Post
What a silly question. It matters not how much money you hold, if you have no one that can and will purchase your products or utilize the service(s) you offer, then in reality you hold nothing. Without the consumers, nothing will work. If there is no demand, there is no need for supply. If there is no nned to supply there is no need for the "money".

It really is simple.
Fruitful business relies on one of two basic principles relative to supply and demand ... which boils down to providing what is "Needed" or satisfying "Desires". There are few things that people actually have to have other than food, clothing, shelter and basic transportation ... with much of what they purchase being based on fulfilling some "desire". Desire is more often created by the supplier rather than having it appear spontaneously from the consumer, and then addressed by supply. That's called advertising and marketing. That creates the "demand" for the product you are trying to sell, and failure or lack of such marketing and advertising is the primary reason why businesses don't succeed. You can have a great product or service, but if no one knows about it or your company, you are going to struggle to achieve any measure of success.

As for "wealthy" people creating jobs ... that is absolutely a true statement. Poor people create nothing but poverty, and degradation. And everyone would be well served to stop bashing successful people ... it's a totally unproductive, poverty driven mindset. Celebrate success ... the more success others have, the more likely you too will become successful!! Success breeds success .... the more successful others are, the greater the chances you have of sharing in that success.

One of the things that is common between the ultra wealthy and the struggling poor is that they both are consumed by the desire for more and more money, and hate seeing others becoming successful because they believe that somehow takes money away from them. The ultra wealthy operate from a mentality of insatiable greed, while the poor operate from the mindset of pure jealousy. Both mindsets are reflective of scarcity. There's an old adage that says "the only people who think more about money than the very rich, are the very poor", and this is true. There is plenty of money and prosperity to be attained ... plenty enough for everyone to live comfortably.

The real area that we should all be concerned with economically is not worrying about those who are successful ... that's a good thing, and we should all embrace that. What we need to eliminate is corruption and cronyism and market manipulation which stacks the deck in favor of the few greedy. They are the ones who stifle competition, and the upward mobility and chance for success of everyone .... preventing people from achieving success who have good ideas and great things to offer.

Our system as it exists today has become dominated by such types. They are the monopolies and monopoly men who detest competition and act to kill competition in any form that it appears. This is what has to be stopped ... not success, but fraudulently attained success through fixing the system to serve only the few.

For everyone else ... we need to joyously celebrate success, and those successful people who provide the fine things that we all want and need, because their success ultimately predicts ours.

The very best way to make more money for yourself is to find a way to make more money for others! If you can make more money for them, they will in turn do whatever they can to help you be successful!

Just ask yourself ... if you wanted to open a business ... where would be the best place ... an inner city area dominated by poverty and crime .. or a wealthy community with lots of people with lots of money to spend? If you have any sense, you'll pick the wealthy community. So, with that said, why would anyone want to hate wealthy people? We need MORE wealthy people, not less of them. What we need less of is poor people. And the best way to do that is not to make wealthy people less wealthy ... we need to make less wealthy people MORE wealthy.
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Old 02-06-2012, 02:12 PM
 
4,127 posts, read 5,068,024 times
Reputation: 1621
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus View Post
If the idea is any good, then it behooves them to just steal it, rather than invest with me. So no, that's not a viable option for one of my ideas.<snip>

Generally speaking, venture capitalists are not interested in stealing your work, they just want to throw money at you and have you throw more money back at them. If you just sit on it, someone else will beat you to it. I don't want to rain on your parade but starting a business is a huge risk. If you're not willing to take risks, you're going nowhere.

The bottom line is that risk is part of the game and you'll never get rich working for someone else. Hell, you probably won't get rich working for yourself though you'll work 16 hour days 7 days a week with 1/2 day Sundays once a month.... but.... it's worth it.
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Old 02-06-2012, 02:25 PM
 
4,042 posts, read 3,529,230 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chromekitty View Post
What actually creates jobs, Hanauer says, is not "rich people" or "entrepreneurs," but the economic ecosystem in which companies are created. The entrepreneur and initial investors provide the "seed" that eventually leads to job-creation, but it is ultimately the company's customers that provide the demand necessary to support jobs. Without healthy customers, Hanauer says, entrepreneurs and investors can't create any sustainable jobs, so the idea that rich people create jobs is misguided.


THE BIG LIE:
I've got news for this dude. It is that many rich people sit at desks that they, themselves purchased and they hire those of us that wish to be employed by them. When we look at our first paycheck at those jobs we often see the signature of the guy that sits at the big desk that hired us in the first place.

Yes, our world and economy "are all relative." That said....most middle class folks have never funded a payroll.

However, I've got personal associates that are much richer than I am, and they have launched new business that was totally, personally funded by them.

"The rich do create jobs," in fact quite often.

It is not a lie.
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