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No, it's not all the Blacks yet the Black population skews the stats. Many of them are dependent of welfare (for instance famous welfare mothers) and like it this way. They are not eager to move up the ladder, connections or not...
Guess I shouldnt point out that whites are majority of people on welfare.
You have to be used to this by now. The anecdotal, "Well, this one person did it, so EVERYONE can do it".
Like somebody once said, it's like throwing a bottle of hooch into a railcar with 10 vagrants and letting them fight over it. Sure, theoretically, each and every hobo has a chance of getting drunk that night, but in reality, only one will.
No it doesn't prove it is typical but it does prove it is possible. Like I said before, none of the industrialized countries have to deal with social issues like a huge uneducated and disfranchised Black population or wave of illegal uneducated immigrants from LatAm and other poor countries. Just the Blacks with their widespread dependence on welfare and lack of drive to advance are skewing the stats. No, America is still the land of opportunity: show me more countries where children of poor immigrants become attorney and senators!
First time in this thread and I figured I would see something like above. You do know that welfare, actual welfare payments only have about 1 million black people on the roles, if that. Also that there are 40 million black people in this country. Also 30 million black people in this country are not considered to be living in poverty. Also that in regards to single mothers, black single mothers higher education rates and income rates have steadily improved and a higher percentage of black single mothers have a high school diploma versus that of single white mothers or single hispanic mothers.
Black people do not have a widespread dependence on welfare and we certainly do not have a lack of drive to advance. Black people in this country have continued to gain in both income and education since the end of the modern civil rights era, which only ended around 45 years ago.
You do have some people who are stuck on the entitlement thought process but to say that this is "widespread" with black people is a huge falsehood.
You also failed to note that many European countries also have large amounts of minorities whose poverty mirrors that of black Americans. They also have immigration problems from Africa and other countries near them (I remember reading specifically about Italy some time ago having a large influx of illegal African immigrants also France as they will stowaway on ships leaving Africa to go to European countries or pay people to take them on the journey to Europe similar to what happens in South American countries to get here to the USA).
You also failed to note that many European countries also have large amounts of minorities whose poverty mirrors that of black Americans. They also have immigration problems from Africa and other countries near them.
Or if you listen a white British person enough, they will rail against Pakistanis and Indians like Arizonans go off about Mexicans, same thing with Japan on Koreans, etc etc.
I wonder if anyone ever told him that London and Paris are two of the most cosmopolitan metros in the world.....
It sounds like people in that article live to work. I sure as he'll don't live to work. If someone wanted to hold me to the standard of not taking a vacation and working weekends for 8 years I would laugh in their face.
These people live in a free country that protects commerce with laws, police and a judicial system that adjudicates disputes. There are public roads, canals and an air system that allows them to safely send and receive materials. There is a public education system that educated them and their employees. There is a public/private power and energy system that is highly reliable. There is a communication network. There is a regulation system that set standards that protect them and their workers, etc., etc.
Yet, these people feel they did it all by themselves (and didn't even state what they actually do) and probably sit around and complain about taxes, that supported all the systems that helped make them a success.
Bill Gates Sr. used to say this: Suppose you were given the choice of being born in America or in Ethiopia. What proportion of your eventual fortune would you be willing to give to be born in America? Given the great good fortune of getting to live and run a business in this country that has all the advantages an advanced country with a decent system provides, how can you think it’s all you? And then, how can you feel you don’t have any obligation to pay it back?
This is an excellent post describing the liberal principle of "Government is God." The sun would not come up in the morning without...Government. Natural resources would not exist without...Government. Business would not exist without...Government. There would be no such thing as education, or a power grid, without...Government. We all should go out and sacrifice our daily lives and health in order to create wealth by working or creating, but we must hand over 1/2 of what we earn to the God of Government, who is divinely entitled to half our earnings.
The slave mentality is very strong.
Here's how some of us understand the situation: the basic systems that are actually required in a civilized society are pretty minimal. These small needs are used as an excuse for people in search of power and wealth to build their little empires. Over time, we have more and more government employees overseeing more and more fiefdoms. We have today reached the point where government is so large that it is strangling the host that it feeds off of--private industry.
Our entire nation was founded--and thrived--on the principle that government should be small, and should not grow until it suffocates the economy or creates a false and doomed economy based on political favoritism and payback (the name Obama leaps to mind here). The larger government grows (and it ALWAYS grows until purposely slashed back), the less freedom and wealth the average American has. Government creates NO wealth--in fact, by Government confiscates wealth both obviously through taxes, and insidiously by printing fiat currency (whereby it transfers wealth from those who save to itself on a daily basis).
Modern government is a power system that takes the limited basics like a road system, and uses them to grow on a daily basis--confiscating more and more power and money from the individual who works to create wealth. Much of what our current government does could be eliminated entirely today, since it goes to maintaining the gigantic bulk and complexity of overgrown empire--and confiscating money at every step of existence, time period or transfer.
Our government has grown into an empire, one which wastes (or uses counterproductively, as in pointless war-mongering) $99 for every dollar it confiscates from productive people. We could still have every necessity of government if all the fat, all the corruption, and illicit use of government power was rooted out. We need another Thomas Jefferson.
Government exists to serve the people. We do NOT exist to serve it, to worship it, or to give it half of our wealth every day.
Survival is never dependent on accumulation of wealth. One can store thousands of pounds of apples or beef without owning the land the beef is on, or the trees are growing.
But if you accumulate apples that is also.... wealth, comrade. You are contradicting yourself LOL
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Profit has absolutely nothing to do with the pricing model at all. They are two completely independent concepts. Price can be established through the laws of supply and demand with out profit being a result.
What is the "pricing model" you are talking about? I have a feeling you are talking about things you have no idea about LOL.
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Why is there no market place? Who established that rule?
Soviet regime based on Marxist pseud-scientific theory. There was no free exchange of goods. No stock exchange. All prices were set by the Central Planning Bureau. You really have no clue what you are talking about here LOL
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Ok, first, communism is not a "slash" of socialism.
Who cares? Both are BS systems that hasn't proved anywhere in the world.
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Second, thats a load of crap. Even when collectivized, an industry or shop has inputs from another industry/shop, which would become costs. Even by nationalization, you would never eliminate those costs, because youd have to pay some form of wages to the worker.
You still don't get it. Prices in Soviet Union was arbitrarily set by the government. Nobody knew what is the actual cost of anything. That's why the system collapsed - because of its lack of efficiency (hard to be efficient if you can't even measure it )
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
The reason why communism has no use for the term profit, is because Marxism uses the labor value concept, which explains that "profit" in a capitalist sense, is actually stolen labor value, which should be returned to the workers.
And that's exactly one of the reasons Marxism is such a load of crap. The only concept of value is the one based on laws of supply and demand. Once you eliminate these laws, like Marxist attempted to do, values become abstract numbers and economic system becomes abstract as well.
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
What makes communism, in theory, more inefficient than capitalism? On the contrary, I would argue its more efficient, since profit motivation wouldnt consistantly stand in the way of progress.
And who said profit stands in a way of progress? I can show many examples of inventors who made millions on their inventions. LOL
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
What mechanism sets prices in communism?
You have a serious reading comprehension problem, so, I will try to explain this a different way.
It's hard to read when you are rolling on the floor laughing.
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
In the above, I have bolded a piece of your statement. Notice, how you made the distinctive qualifier "of equal length". You did not say, two pencils are equal, which could mean, led color or shade, length, thickness, body color, body material, brand name, quality or any number of things, or all of the things. You made it very clear WHAT you were comparing.
In your original statement you said "all people are not born equal". You made no definition as to the qualifier you were comparing their equivalency on.
Because based on all the available criteria we can safely say that PEOPLE ARE NOT CREATED EQUAL. Some are shorter some or heavier, some smarter and some less. Why do you have a problem with admitting that people are not created equal, my commie friend? LOL
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Well then, your statement is flat out wrong. Every single US Citizen is equal under the intent of the law. There is a given criteria right there.
No. Not every US citizen is equal. For instance to become a president you have to be a naturally born US citizen and not naturalized one. As you can see not all citizens are equal, can you???? LOL
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Wow, people are the most important piece of capitalism? Then, why exactly are they laid off or their jobs automated at every opportunity? Why do firms in capitalism not seem to care about their ability to be consumers as they are being laid off?
Because the entire society wants is an increased efficiency i.e. lower prices. People want to pay less for products not more and one of the ways to achieve that is automation. Of course people get laid off as a result but it does not mean that they can't find employment where they are actually needed.
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Oh, you mean, like Glass-Steagall, which got repealed at the request of big bank lobbyist? Or, maybe the toothless Dodd-Frank legislation which was completely gutted before it even saw the light of day?
Guess laws and regulations dont really matter when the banksters and CEOs are writing them.
Well. It's a matter of opinion. Based on the heresies you typed here I can safely assume you are not an economist so I am not sure if you really understand the implications of the mentioned above acts or can argue for or against them..
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
My argument is, the only time anything of value actually gets done is when someone who isnt motivated by profit does it.
Really? LOL Do you think research sceintists work for free?? LOL What about all the advancements in computer technology that resulted in quite a few personal fortunes?
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Why dont you actually do some research. Might open your eyes. Shell and Exxon are in possession of dozens of fuel system patents that theyve intentionally buried.
Good gas mileage and efficient cars are bad for business.
If they really burried them you would not even know about them
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
Because the world has so little arable land that people would be forced to live in the desert......oh wait, the world has 16 million square miles of agricultural land which is far more than enough for every person to farm enough to live.....
Guess I shouldnt point out that whites are majority of people on welfare.
Of course, whites are still majority in this country (59% or population) yet percentage wise there are more Blacks on welfare than whites. Same applies to Blacks living below the poverty line and Blacks in prison.
America has a serious issue and NOBODY even want to touch that in the election year or at any time. We all pretend there is no elephant in the room... Sad.
Last edited by rebel12; 06-18-2012 at 01:59 PM..
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