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Old 10-24-2012, 05:45 PM
 
Location: In the Redwoods
30,358 posts, read 51,950,786 times
Reputation: 23781

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Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
Your language obscures the fact that your solution to a "forced pregnancy" is to kill another human being.
Fetuses aren't human beings yet, at least not in the scientific sense... and if the choice is between forcing a LIVING human to endure pregnancies against her will, versus terminating a life that hasn't even begun, I personally think the already-living person's rights should prevail.
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Old 10-24-2012, 05:50 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,607,531 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arus View Post
So. I dont need your list. Only the really rich can afford to go through private adoption agencies.
Pro-life attorneys and organizations often facilitate adoptions free of charge, or at extremely low fees. County adoption services are also very affordable. Just last week I was informed on an e-mail list about a premature baby saved from abortion and adopted privately - no cost. In my church community, there is a waiting family for every child saved from abortion that comes to our attention.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arus View Post
There are millions of children in the foster care system that go unwanted their entire lives.
"Millions", eh? I'll keep this in mind next time you lecture me about the facts. There are only around 400,000 children in foster care in the United States, and many of these are facilitated by religious organizations. Around 25% are eventually adopted out. Older children who age out of foster care are another problem. It makes absolutely no sense to claim that abortion solves this problem better than early adoption.

The fact is that pro-lifers are doing plenty when it comes to caring for "unwanted" children, and would be doing much more if government restrictions didn't get in the way (e.g. preventing adoption due to bedroom limits and other petty issues; unjust mandates that shut down Catholic adoption services in three states).
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Old 10-24-2012, 05:55 PM
 
Location: 500 miles from home
33,942 posts, read 22,532,112 times
Reputation: 25816
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
No it hasn't. Abortion as an issue is a no-win for both parties. Roe v. Wade has been challenged and turned down over 30 times by the Supreme Court over those 30 years you mentioned. It's a legally settled issue, despite the anti-abortion efforts, and will remain settled.

That means it will always hang around, of course, just like creationism, but the issue's times as a hot-button topic are gone. They peaked long before the 2008 election. That's why there has been nothing on it this time from either side.
Well, that SHOULD be true. But then some dumb Republican starts making comments like 'legitimate rape'. That gets headline attention and ~ here we are again!

And the whole Paul Ryan transvaginal ultrasound thing - anyone see that?

It makes women nervous. And these issues are important to women - so the talking heads are right on this one.
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Old 10-24-2012, 05:57 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,607,531 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by gizmo980 View Post
Fetuses aren't human beings yet, at least not in the scientific sense...
Yes, they are, especially in the scientific sense. Fetus simply means "offspring".
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:04 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 6,272,509 times
Reputation: 1837
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
Yes, they are, especially in the scientific sense. Fetus simply means "offspring".
No in the scientific sense (and the legal sense), until it can breathe air, no its not. all it is is the potential to be a living human being.
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:08 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 6,272,509 times
Reputation: 1837
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
Pro-life attorneys and organizations often facilitate adoptions free of charge, or at extremely low fees.
Who is going to pay for the girl's prenatal care? Are you? Are these lawyers?
Who is going to pay for her pregnancy? Are you? Are these lawyers?
Who is going to pay for any medical ailments that occur during the pregnancy and the life altering issues after her pregnancy? Are you? Are these lawyers.

Are you going to pay for any medical ailments that occur after pregnancy? Psychological issues?

Again you ARE STILL ADVOCATING FOR SLAVERY of women!
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:15 PM
 
Location: In the Redwoods
30,358 posts, read 51,950,786 times
Reputation: 23781
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
The fact is that pro-lifers are doing plenty when it comes to caring for "unwanted" children, and would be doing much more if government restrictions didn't get in the way (e.g. preventing adoption due to bedroom limits and other petty issues; unjust mandates that shut down Catholic adoption services in three states).
You know what else would help? If these Catholic groups and conservative state leaders would support allowing homosexuals to adopt... maybe then they'd stop going international, and start adopting more babies locally.
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:19 PM
 
Location: In the Redwoods
30,358 posts, read 51,950,786 times
Reputation: 23781
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
Yes, they are, especially in the scientific sense. Fetus simply means "offspring".
Until it can live & breathe on its own (which is way past the point where abortion is legal), it is not a human life yet... we may see it as such, and I would agree, but legally & scientifically it is not a living human yet.
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:21 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,607,531 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arus View Post
Who is going to pay for the girl's prenatal care? Are you? Are these lawyers?
Who is going to pay for her pregnancy? Are you? Are these lawyers?
Who is going to pay for any medical ailments that occur during the pregnancy and the life altering issues after her pregnancy? Are you? Are these lawyers.

Are you going to pay for any medical ailments that occur after pregnancy? Psychological issues?

Again you ARE STILL ADVOCATING FOR SLAVERY of women!
Pregnant women and teens who need help with these things can find financial and other assistance at one of several hundred maternity homes in the United States, such as Bayard House in Delaware operated by Catholic Charities.

"Bayard House provides 24-hour residential care to at-risk pregnant minors and women by providing:


· Individualized case management services to ensure each resident achieves secure housing, nutritious meals, and emotional support

· Access to pre-natal healthcare, birthing classes, and counseling

· Parenting and independent-living workshops

· Information and referral services for those at-risk for low birth weight babies, child abuse, neglect, teen pregnancy and lack of pre-natal care

· After-Care programming and support which includes transportation to medical appointments, referrals for housing, employment assistance, continued social services, emotional support, and home visits."
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:25 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,607,531 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by gizmo980 View Post
You know what else would help? If these Catholic groups and conservative state leaders would support allowing homosexuals to adopt... maybe then they'd stop going international, and start adopting more babies locally.
On the contrary, by requiring these organizations to violate their religious beliefs and adopt out to homosexuals, the government has actually deprived children of families by forcing these agencies to close.
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