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Egypt is determining their own course, not the US. They have a choice between the MB and a military junta at the present, we will see if there are legitimate elections in the ear future.
Morsi's days were numbered when he drafted a constitution based on Islam. The wise course of action would have been moderation and a more inclusive government, in the end poverty was increasing and he was unpopular.
Countries don't change in a few years and democracy is never pretty, it took us a hundred years.
Egypt is determining their own course, not the US. They have a choice between the MB and a military junta at the present, we will see if there are legitimate elections in the ear future.
Morsi's days were numbered when he drafted a constitution based on Islam. The wise course of action would have been moderation and a more inclusive government, in the end poverty was increasing and he was unpopular.
Countries don't change in a few years and democracy is never pretty, it took us a hundred years.
They have a long way to go. The Ultraconservative MB is fighting a losing battle I think. There are too many free thinking Egyptians.
I'm almost rolling on the floor laughing now, although this situation over there isn't comical at all.
The MB is a terrorist organization? OMG, who is in charge over there now? Ummmm, peachy keen flower giving liberals? you can't be serious?
SMH. WOW, if you don't know that the MB is a terrorist organization you need a lot of learning to do. Start with it's formation 80 years ago. You really believe that the MB that Obama is arming with weapons fighting in Syria isn't one of the terrorist organizations that is looking to take control should Assad be ousted? Do you see Hamas and Al Qaeda, spinoffs of the MB, as a non-violent organization? Are you familiar with Al Gama'a al Islamiyya, the de facto "military" of the MB? Why do you think the MB layed dormant in Egypt for years until 2011? Do you know that Al Qaeda is a spinoff of the MB. OBL was aligned with the MB but OBL thought that the MB was a bit too extreme in wanting to create an Islamic world, while OBL wanted to confine it to the ME/Muslim countries.
Are you familiar with non-violent jihad? The MB took a pledge for "non-violence" in order be recognized as a legitimate organization. What better way to imbed yourself into countries, especially Western countries and continue with the non-violent jihad that was declared.
I'll let you do more homework on the MB. If you can prove me wrong, please do so.
Apparently Obama thinks it's OK for civilians to attack government property, attack police stations and slaughter 46 police officers and dismember 3 bodies. If that were to happen in the US I think Obama might call it "work place violence" or do you think he would be capable of uttering the words "acts of terrorism"?? What if Catholics started burning down Jewish synagogues? Would Obama call that "difference of religion"?
Seems the military is in charge. Not the MB and not Obama.
SMH. WOW, if you don't know that the MB is a terrorist organization you need a lot of learning to do. Start with it's formation 80 years ago. You really believe that the MB that Obama is arming with weapons fighting in Syria isn't one of the terrorist organizations that is looking to take control should Assad be ousted? Do you see Hamas and Al Qaeda, spinoffs of the MB, as a non-violent organization? Are you familiar with Al Gama'a al Islamiyya, the de facto "military" of the MB? Why do you think the MB layed dormant in Egypt for years until 2011? Do you know that Al Qaeda is a spinoff of the MB. OBL was aligned with the MB but OBL thought that the MB was a bit too extreme in wanting to create an Islamic world, while OBL wanted to confine it to the ME/Muslim countries.
Are you familiar with non-violent jihad? The MB took a pledge for "non-violence" in order be recognized as a legitimate organization. What better way to imbed yourself into countries, especially Western countries and continue with the non-violent jihad that was declared.
I'll let you do more homework on the MB. If you can prove me wrong, please do so.
Apparently Obama thinks it's OK for civilians to attack government property, attack police stations and slaughter 46 police officers and dismember 3 bodies. If that were to happen in the US I think Obama might call it "work place violence" or do you think he would be capable of uttering the words "acts of terrorism"?? What if Catholics started burning down Jewish synagogues? Would Obama call that "difference of religion"?
Seems the military is in charge. Not the MB and not Obama.
Let me ask you, what do you call a regime that casually mobilizes their military to go out and kill it's citizens? Terrorists, maybe?
So, you basically back the present administration is Egypt now, good for you.
Please keep me laughing, you're very entertaining.
Let me ask you, what do you call a regime that casually mobilizes their military to go out and kill it's citizens? Terrorists, maybe?
So, you basically back the present administration is Egypt now, good for you.
Please keep me laughing, you're very entertaining.
I noticed that you failed to support your "argument" or to prove me wrong.
"Casually" mobilizes with the intent to kill?? You really haven't been paying attention have you? The military is actively protecting government buildings and facilities, while positioning itself behind the security forces, which are the police, that are fighting the MB. You seem to be like Obama - you can only see what you want to see. Condemn the military but fail to condemn the MB for the attacks and deaths of Christians and burning churches and homes of Christians.
I bet you find it horrifying that children as young as 8 years old are sold off to marriage to a 65 year old pedophile in Yemen, but wouldn't find it horrifying that a 13 year old could be sold off to the same kind of man if Morsi had his way. How do you feel about the "freedoms" and "civil rights" in Pakistan and Afghanistan? Do you understand that if the rebels in Syria oust Assad it is their intent to purify Syria, which would mean the expulsion of Christians, or worse the death of Christians. 2 million Christians have fled Syria for fear of death, and the differences between Shia and Sunni would continue.
When Morsi made his inauguration speech on his first day as President, he demanded the US return the Blind Sheikh to Egypt and made a promise to his supporters that he would free the Blind Sheikh. I do hope you know who the Blind Sheikh is and what he did and how he is connected to the MB. After that speech Obama was asked if Egypt was an ally or not. Obama's response was something to the effect: At this point I can't say. We will have to wait and see. What does that tell you?
Egypt didn't live under extreme Sharia law, and that's the direction Morsi wanted to take. What do you call a president that dismisses in total the constitution in place and writes his own constitution that awarded himself new powers and was very contentious with regard to human rights and civil rights limitations/violations, especially towards women, because the constitution that was in place prior to becoming president allowed too many freedoms and gave too many protections and civil rights to the people. Sounds like a dictator.
I would say I find you "entertaining" but that would be a lie. I do find it sad when someone speaks on a subject when they lack the knowledge or the intelligence to support what they think they know.
And you basically support a government that is a democracy within the confines of the US, yet in reality are no less a terrorist organization when it comes to killing thousands of innocent people in the ME and turns a blind eye to countries that violate civil and human rights (Pakistian, China) when it serves their purpose.
Since you really have absolutely nothing to say, there is no need to continue this one-sided discussion.
Last edited by softblueyz; 08-19-2013 at 03:42 AM..
Pull all military support and sign a mutual defense treaty with Israel.
Problem solved. OPEC raises oil prices? Not likely to happen because Saudi Arabia is on the side of the military in Egypt. If we pull back our support, the military is going to crack down, and it'll go back to a pre-Mubarrack ousting government. A martial law, military lead dictatorship basically.
And even if the price of oil goes up, Republicans should love that, means we can drill more at home, more new jobs.
Screw Israel.
Stop stealing Palestinian land and building on it.
Maybe then we'll talk.
No need to provide any support for any reason.
Pull back all of our support, monetary and military, and let everyone fend for themselves.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo
Look...
US foreign policy doesn't control what happens in Egypt. Nor should it. No one outside of Egypt should be pulling the strings. That said, I think you're right about not cutting off the military support. We pull ours, someone else (China?) moves in to fill the gap. What little influence we have on events over there will come through the aid program.
Cutting it off at this point would be dumb. And that's RWNJ territory.
I'm sorry, while I agree that US policy shouldn't control what happens in other countries, it does.
Example: many countries could not get aid if they discussed birth control or use of condoms to thwart HIV.
We need to bail out the US at this time.
We need to take care of our citizens by providing a minimum of food and shelter and medical and education for US citizens.
Once we accomplish that, then we can look outward again.
Until then, let someone else rush in with their checkbook.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech
Foreign aid is $40 billion a year. Of that, much is aide to buy American made goods. Bases are paid from the DoD's budget and serve U.S. interests.
US interests are frequently not US citizen's interests.
They're big business, defense business.
That money doesn't line anyone's pockets but the corporate raiders that we allow to redistributre our money.
DoDs budget comes from tax revenue - our money.
I'd rather support people than corporate entities and weapon manufacturers.
Use US money to support the US - not line corrupt countries and military defense contractors.
Last edited by chielgirl; 08-19-2013 at 04:01 AM..
Actually his terminal illness sealed is fate. People think US controls everything in every country in the planet, but sometimes we just let people elect their own leaders, and sometimes there are violent power struggles that we can no little about. US is quite irrelevant in what is going on in Egypt, and that's a good thing. As for human rights, it's silly to pick a side in a fight where both sides violate human rights.
And sometimes we plant who we want in a position; sometimes we overthrow other governments with democratically elected officials.
We're only in it for ourselves, whateverthehell that means.
This is typical of democrats with their short term memory and failure to comprehend.
Where did I say Obama "created the current turmoil" in Egypt? I guess you aren't aware of Obama's fingers in Egypt for the past 5 years.
This is what you said:
Quote:
What Obama didn't know, his advisors made up for it. Apparently they weren't very well informed seeing as how things have played out for Obama in the Middle East. That's what happens when you know nothing and rely on people who are inexperienced and don't know very much them selves.
Yes, you did say that Obama had a hand in the middle east.
Quote:
Originally Posted by softblueyz
In your opinion.
I asked my husband about that and he said it's a fact that you are wrong.
And your husband's opinion differs.
Are we supposed to be impressed that there's a differing opinion?
I noticed that you failed to support your "argument" or to prove me wrong.
"Casually" mobilizes with the intent to kill?? You really haven't been paying attention have you? The military is actively protecting government buildings and facilities, while positioning itself behind the security forces, which are the police, that are fighting the MB. You seem to be like Obama - you can only see what you want to see. Condemn the military but fail to condemn the MB for the attacks and deaths of Christians and burning churches and homes of Christians.
I bet you find it horrifying that children as young as 8 years old are sold off to marriage to a 65 year old pedophile in Yemen, but wouldn't find it horrifying that a 13 year old could be sold off to the same kind of man if Morsi had his way. How do you feel about the "freedoms" and "civil rights" in Pakistan and Afghanistan? Do you understand that if the rebels in Syria oust Assad it is their intent to purify Syria, which would mean the expulsion of Christians, or worse the death of Christians. 2 million Christians have fled Syria for fear of death, and the differences between Shia and Sunni would continue.
When Morsi made his inauguration speech on his first day as President, he demanded the US return the Blind Sheikh to Egypt and made a promise to his supporters that he would free the Blind Sheikh. I do hope you know who the Blind Sheikh is and what he did and how he is connected to the MB. After that speech Obama was asked if Egypt was an ally or not. Obama's response was something to the effect: At this point I can't say. We will have to wait and see. What does that tell you?
Egypt didn't live under extreme Sharia law, and that's the direction Morsi wanted to take. What do you call a president that dismisses in total the constitution in place and writes his own constitution that awarded himself new powers and was very contentious with regard to human rights and civil rights limitations/violations, especially towards women, because the constitution that was in place prior to becoming president allowed too many freedoms and gave too many protections and civil rights to the people. Sounds like a dictator.
I would say I find you "entertaining" but that would be a lie. I do find it sad when someone speaks on a subject when they lack the knowledge or the intelligence to support what they think they know.
And you basically support a government that is a democracy within the confines of the US, yet in reality are no less a terrorist organization when it comes to killing thousands of innocent people in the ME and turns a blind eye to countries that violate civil and human rights (Pakistian, China) when it serves their purpose.
Since you really have absolutely nothing to say, there is no need to continue this one-sided discussion.
such a drivel, wtf are you talking about?
So the MB is a terrorist organization but the military killing it's own citizens is not, gotcha!
I'm sure glad people such as yourself aren't running this country or it's military..... oh, we had to kill civilians because they were destroying our government installations because they wanted human rights
talk about clueless tools.
Let me ask you something, is there anything you don't blame Obama for?
read this
Last edited by CaseyB; 08-19-2013 at 06:58 AM..
Reason: Off topic
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you can't be serious?
Wonder why Obama ordered that? 
