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This has been discussed several times. Some people have the perception that because of what race you are, you may have less viability in the job market. People often look at racism as the force that seems to hold someone from achieving prosperity in the job market. However one must look at what racism is, and see if it could possibly hold someone back.
Racism is the belief that a particular race is superior to another. So even if racism were a reality in America, I don't think it would limit someone's economic mobility. How is this possible? Well, people often use racism to mean a caste system, which undoubtedly does not exist in the USA. There is no central caste system in the USA, and there are no clear examples of a functioning caste system in America. In general a person's ability to get hired often depends soley on a company's wilingness to hire you. So even if America were racist, at the end of the day the decision for you to work a particular job comes down to a hiring decision of only a few people. There is no rule forbidding the hiring of someone based on race in the USA. So there is no legal discrimination in the USA. With that said, from a pure probabilistic standpoint, it seems that applying for work seems to reduce the chance of discrimination.
With that said, can we accurately say that the perception of racism can really limit what someone can do economically. This doesn't appear to be the case. It seems that you can beat this by pure numbers. And the real barrier is qualifying for a job, but there are many avenues someone can take to qualify for work.
So it appears that disadvantages within themselves can be overcome by continuing to play the game. It seems the only way to really lose is to not play at all. Opinions?
This has been discussed several times. Some people have the perception that because of what race you are, you may have less viability in the job market. People often look at racism as the force that seems to hold someone from achieving prosperity in the job market. However one must look at what racism is, and see if it could possibly hold someone back.
Racism is the belief that a particular race is superior to another. So even if racism were a reality in America, I don't think it would limit someone's economic mobility. How is this possible? Well, people often use racism to mean a caste system, which undoubtedly does not exist in the USA. There is no central caste system in the USA, and there are no clear examples of a functioning caste system in America. In general a person's ability to get hired often depends soley on a company's wilingness to hire you. So even if America were racist, at the end of the day the decision for you to work a particular job comes down to a hiring decision of only a few people. There is no rule forbidding the hiring of someone based on race in the USA. So there is no legal discrimination in the USA. With that said, from a pure probabilistic standpoint, it seems that applying for work seems to reduce the chance of discrimination.
With that said, can we accurately say that the perception of racism can really limit what someone can do economically. This doesn't appear to be the case. It seems that you can beat this by pure numbers. And the real barrier is qualifying for a job, but there are many avenues someone can take to qualify for work.
So it appears that disadvantages within themselves can be overcome by continuing to play the game. It seems the only way to really lose is to not play at all. Opinions?
Are we talking about individuals within a race? Or are we talking about averages and probabilities?
Lets pretend you needed to hire an engineer. And you had five black women, and five Asian men to choose from. And for whatever reason, you knew absolutely nothing else about them other than their race and gender. And thus you were forced to "gamble" by hiring either all five black women, or all five Asian men. Which would you put your money on?
I would put my money on the Asian men without any thought whatsoever.
Would I always be right? No. But I would be right most of the time.
This is how "discrimination" and "prejudice" work in the real world. I think most people want to "judge people based on their character". But in many cases, it is impossible to know someones character when a decision must be made. And even worse, many times people present themselves to be different than what they actually are. Making it even harder to make sound judgements. And so you must rely on whatever information you have available to you. And sometimes that information isn't clear evidence. It is rather just "odds".
In the same way, a college degree is no guarantee of competence. If you knew absolutely nothing else about two people, than the fact that one has a college degree and that one doesn't. You will assume that the person with the college degree is probably smarter, more mature, more reliable, more capable, a faster learner, etc. But do you know for certain? Absolutely not.
I see nothing wrong with discrimination. Discrimination is normal. Everyone discriminates, for practically every reason imaginable. Age, sex, education, IQ, race, appearance/attractiveness, accent, religion, language, weight, etc. I get tired of people telling me that some forms of discrimination are good, and some are bad. Trying to tell me how to think. Punishing me for not thinking the way others believe I should think.
I get tired of fighting about. Lets just agree on one thing. People are different. And if people are different, you cannot expect all outcomes to be exactly equal.
I say, just stop worrying about it. Lets stop even talking about it. For what does it even matter? Who benefits? For us to be talking about it, someone must hope to benefit. I say, just leave people alone.
The most effective way of being wealthy is picking the correct parents. Make certain they are in the moneyed class and can provide an good education in the elite schools as well as lots of contacts with the proper people. It is most effective to start at the top.
Do not pick poor parents, particularly single mothers, of any minority race. That is a near guarantee of a life of frustration and near or actual poverty.
Uh picking by "race" can go in some weird directions. I'm talking about a bunch of educated Black Africans in the pool; they are many times are "tossed in" with the anglo whites when it comes to decision time, NOT other Black people.
This has been discussed several times. Some people have the perception that because of what race you are, you may have less viability in the job market. People often look at racism as the force that seems to hold someone from achieving prosperity in the job market. However one must look at what racism is, and see if it could possibly hold someone back.
Racism is the belief that a particular race is superior to another. So even if racism were a reality in America, I don't think it would limit someone's economic mobility. How is this possible? Well, people often use racism to mean a caste system, which undoubtedly does not exist in the USA. There is no central caste system in the USA, and there are no clear examples of a functioning caste system in America. In general a person's ability to get hired often depends soley on a company's wilingness to hire you. So even if America were racist, at the end of the day the decision for you to work a particular job comes down to a hiring decision of only a few people. There is no rule forbidding the hiring of someone based on race in the USA. So there is no legal discrimination in the USA. With that said, from a pure probabilistic standpoint, it seems that applying for work seems to reduce the chance of discrimination.
With that said, can we accurately say that the perception of racism can really limit what someone can do economically. This doesn't appear to be the case. It seems that you can beat this by pure numbers. And the real barrier is qualifying for a job, but there are many avenues someone can take to qualify for work.
So it appears that disadvantages within themselves can be overcome by continuing to play the game. It seems the only way to really lose is to not play at all. Opinions?
Well....if one frames the argument or question in such a way that defines racism impact as a binary state, like life or death, then the argument or question is invalid from the start. In other words, if one defines racism as only being an issue if it completely prevents the progress of another race, without exception, it sets the bar of racism so high, erroneously, that its easy to argue that racism does not exist and or is not an impediment.
That is not how racism works. Racism is less like a binary light "switch" that is either on or off, but more like a light "dimmer" that has a spectrum of light that exist between the absolutes of on or off. In other words, instead of racism holding one back completely, economically, it could just stunt ones growth economically based upon the degree of racism turned on, relative to those who are not the targets of racism.
Well....if one frames the argument or question in such a way that defines racism impact as a binary state, like life or death, then the argument or question is invalid from the start. In other words, if one defines racism as only being an issue if it completely prevents the progress of another race, without exception, it sets the bar of racism so high, erroneously, that its easy to argue that racism does not exist and or is not an impediment.
That is not how racism works. Racism is less like a binary light "switch" that is either on or off, but more like a light "dimmer" that has a spectrum of light that exist between the absolutes of on or off. In other words, instead of racism holding one back completely, economically, it could just stunt ones growth economically based upon the degree of racism turned on, relative to those who are not the targets of racism.
They key here is that that the road to economic prosperity is gainful employment. So one can look at it like this, since it is not an imperative for companies to discriminate against people based on race, they can hire anyone they choose. With this in mind the dynamics at play is how racist or not racist an individual hiring manager at a company will be. It seems like you can't really argue that if someone applies for more jobs, their probability of getting hired increase. It seems it's mainly a game of numbers.
Let's say 1 out of every 4 hiring managers are racist, but there are 300 jobs advertising for your position. That means that roughly 72 out of 300 jobs will automatically deny you due to your race. But this also mean 228 jobs could possibly hiring you based on merits alone. So it seems that the amount of jobs you apply for would naturally cancel out the idea of racism being a barrier to economic mobility.
Of course there is the idea of how many people apply for 300 jobs, but it seems like if you apply for jobs in the next city over with the same statistics, then based on each surrounding you apply for you will up your chances of getting hired by 25%.
As a result, even with the presence of racism, it seems like racism can't beat math. So mathematically racism can't hinder anyone.
They key here is that that the road to economic prosperity is gainful employment. So one can look at it like this, since it is not an imperative for companies to discriminate against people based on race, they can hire anyone they choose. With this in mind the dynamics at play is how racist or not racist an individual hiring manager at a company will be. It seems like you can't really argue that if someone applies for more jobs, their probability of getting hired increase. It seems it's mainly a game of numbers.
Let's say 1 out of every 4 hiring managers are racist, but there are 300 jobs advertising for your position. That means that roughly 72 out of 300 jobs will automatically deny you due to your race. But this also mean 228 jobs could possibly hiring you based on merits alone. So it seems that the amount of jobs you apply for would naturally cancel out the idea of racism being a barrier to economic mobility.
Of course there is the idea of how many people apply for 300 jobs, but it seems like if you apply for jobs in the next city over with the same statistics, then based on each surrounding you apply for you will up your chances of getting hired by 25%.
As a result, even with the presence of racism, it seems like racism can't beat math. So mathematically racism can't hinder anyone.
it just puts you at a 25 percent disadvantage vs whites using your math which is a big disadvantage. yet when we talk about getting rid of that advantage for whites, whites whine and say they are the most discriminated group.
Statistics, how people feel, et al are meaningless. As a black man, the fact of the matter is simple: Racism is alive and well in the country. I don't care where you live, what field you are in, what education level you have. If you are black, you are already starting off with the deck stacked against you.
Now, it can also go in your favor. I know one of the MAJOR reasons I was hired for my job is the fact I am black. The first day on my job, I was taken outside and asked, "You are black aren't you?" I am a light complected black male. So, in my case, it was a positive and helped me.
HOWEVER, in the vast majority of circumstances, it is not a positive and is a negative. It is just a fact of life.
Simply put, my race has never hindered me to my knowledge.
Did i lose out on a few breaks because i'm black? Maybe, but so what. Win some and you lose some. I didn't know about it and even if i did i couldn't prove it so why raise my blood pressure?
Did i get a few breaks BECAUSE i'm black? Maybe so, but i don't feel guilty about it if i did. Everyone uses whatever advantages they have to get what they want. No one in the history of the world has ever turned down an opportunity because they thought they were getting an unfair advantage. All guilt can and will be easily assuaged and quickly dismissed by the recipient of such a break.
it just puts you at a 25 percent disadvantage vs whites using your math which is a big disadvantage. yet when we talk about getting rid of that advantage for whites, whites whine and say they are the most discriminated group.
People tend to say that out of frustration because white men are the only group it is socially and some cases legally okay to discriminate against. They are also the only group who when they are discriminated against they aren't sympathized with. Such as what your post is doing.
You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs. But what you shouldn't do is expect the eggs that got broken to be happy about it. You shouldn't expect those white firefighters who got denied their promotions because the black applicants failed the test not to complain. You shouldn't expect a white student who gets denied entrance to the college of his choice because affirmative action took minority students instead not to complain. You shouldn't expect the white entrepreneur who didn't get a small business loan because because minority applicants get priority not to complain. You shouldn't expect the white business owner whose low bid for a contract got rejected because a minority business owner bid against him not to complain. You shouldn't expect the white person who just got finished seeing Paula Dean get fired for saying the N word and then hears Charlie Rangel talking about white crackers on the radio not to complain.
Every person has their own experience. While whites as a population in America may not suffer from discrimination as much as minorities do, when an individual white person does get discriminated against that white person suffers just as much as a black person would who was on the receiving end of the same discrimination. If their concerns weren't ridiculed and ignored, then there probably wouldn't be as much of an angry backlash from them as there is.
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