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Old 04-19-2014, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia Area
1,720 posts, read 1,316,554 times
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Peer Reviewed Journal says that the US is an Oligarchy, not a Representative Republic.

In other news it's spring outside.
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:38 PM
 
9,763 posts, read 10,528,561 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilnewbie View Post
I think it is ironic, a pure democracy is one where everyone has a right to an opinion... what happens when the democracy creates a majority rule where the rights of the minority is trampled upon? A tyranny by majority? I love democracy but at the same time, I abhor anyone trampling the rights of others... for instance, it is not right or just to steal from my neighbor who makes more than I simply because there is more of me... so the balance between the tyranny by majority or a tyranny from oligarchs? Is there any difference? Let me know when anyone has good to say other than "Waah! Me!"....
Your opinion that taxation is theft is not held by most people, nor the Constitution. It seems you're the one crying "Waah, my opinion!"
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:09 PM
 
7,359 posts, read 5,463,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
Your opinion that taxation is theft is not held by most people, nor the Constitution. It seems you're the one crying "Waah, my opinion!"
Yes, it is held by the constitution. The constitution expressly prohibits the federal government from taxing one person more than another person. That is why when the progressives wanted the federal income tax they had to pass an amendment to do it. They had to draw up an amendment to specifically exempt the new tax they wanted from the restrictions contained within the constitution. That is what the person you replied to was talking about - not taxation itself, but the unequal taxation where one person's money is confiscated and used purely to benefit another person who does not pay.
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:18 PM
 
20,187 posts, read 23,858,535 times
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Some people can't figure out that tyranny by a group large or small is STILL tyranny...
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:26 PM
 
Location: San Jose, CA
310 posts, read 256,349 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J746NEW View Post
I think an excellent and recent example of how policy is drawn up for the wealthy elite is Obamacare

Obamacare was touted as something for the poor and lower class via propaganda but looking at who is at the top of the list when it comes to lobbyists show the reality of the situation. In a time when the common mans wages are stagnating and the price of everything keeps rising thanks to money printing to bail out the banksters, Big Pharma and Insurance do not want to take a paycut and want everyone to pitch in to bail them out as well..for eternity. The cost of healthcare is not even on the radar of the elite, but just who is going to pay for it.
This is what I have been saying all along, this is not for us but for those pumping money into Washington. Same thing with all of the business regulations, they aren't to do anything for us, but rather to keep the competition down and help out these lobbying corporations. People say we need more regulations to keep corporations from running wild, however the regulations ARE the corporations doing exactly that. And this is also why I hate when people bash American "capitalism" because we are not and have not been a capitalist nation, at least not in a long time.
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Old 04-19-2014, 06:13 PM
 
34,279 posts, read 19,375,883 times
Reputation: 17261
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2 View Post
Yes, it is held by the constitution. The constitution expressly prohibits the federal government from taxing one person more than another person. That is why when the progressives wanted the federal income tax they had to pass an amendment to do it. They had to draw up an amendment to specifically exempt the new tax they wanted from the restrictions contained within the constitution. That is what the person you replied to was talking about - not taxation itself, but the unequal taxation where one person's money is confiscated and used purely to benefit another person who does not pay.


Ahh yes the people who believe "in a perfect world with perfect knowledge" it would work the way they see it as being appropriate.

Reality, its not a perfect world, we do our best, and the tax system as it exists has met with approval from all three branches, and the vast majority of your fellow Americans. Cope.

In fact as the original article indicates we need to find ways to weaken our oligarchy.....hmmmm
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Old 04-19-2014, 06:40 PM
 
8,483 posts, read 6,933,885 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J746NEW View Post
It bears worth repeating that we are supposed to practice Indirect Democracy in this country through Democratically Elected Representatives to represent “We the People” of this country, in accordance with the Constitution.

This is Just to hammer home the point to those that state we are a Republic.
We are no more a pure Republic than we are a pure Democracy.
The Republic of China 1912-1949 did not have democratically elected Representatives for example.

A better term coined by Jonathan Locke from 1632-1704 is a Constitutional Democratic Republic.

What Is a Constitutional Democratic Republic Government?



The paper in question is to be published in the peer reviewed academic journal, Perspectives on Politics from Princeton.

https://www.commondreams.org/view/2014/04/14







Just think, we escaped from Monarch England to get away from the heavy handed elite only to have the same situation happen again.


I think an excellent and recent example of how policy is drawn up for the wealthy elite is Obamacare

Obamacare was touted as something for the poor and lower class via propaganda but looking at who is at the top of the list when it comes to lobbyists show the reality of the situation. In a time when the common mans wages are stagnating and the price of everything keeps rising thanks to money printing to bail out the banksters, Big Pharma and Insurance do not want to take a paycut and want everyone to pitch in to bail them out as well..for eternity. The cost of healthcare is not even on the radar of the elite, but just who is going to pay for it.

Lobbying Spending Database | OpenSecrets

Pharmaceuticals/Health Products $2,795,596,315
Insurance $1,964,085,236

Electric Utilities $1,836,267,571
Business Associations $1,599,841,724
Computers/Internet $1,539,193,215
Oil & Gas $1,520,091,017
Misc Manufacturing & Distributing $1,279,589,508
Education $1,278,209,819
TV/Movies/Music $1,198,351,376
Hospitals/Nursing Homes $1,185,577,186
Securities & Investment $1,117,167,652
Civil Servants/Public Officials $1,107,964,625
Real Estate $1,085,527,543
Health Professionals $1,062,105,067
Air Transport $999,244,120
Misc Issues $848,711,383
Automotive $806,876,749
Telephone Utilities $781,182,298
Telecom Services & Equipment $772,337,196
Health Services/HMOs $738,746,421


Some questions come to mind for the defenders of our Oligarchy


How do those that support the constitution wherein we are supposed to be a representative republic for all people of this country reconcile the ability of corporations and banks to infringe on others rights to be heard when money= freedom of speech?


Why do some people think that those in the pursuit of wealth and power no matter the cost make good candidates for government positions, by giving them access to other people’s money?




http://i.imgur.com/NK7DDMc.png
Can add this one to the zurich study. Good post.

This documentary is an interesting discussion on larger social systems. Certainly, one may not necessarily agree with certain biases that may be presented, but it is a useful discussion on the bigger picture and the systems that are part of this.

Four Horsemen - Feature Documentary - Official Version - YouTube
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Old 04-19-2014, 07:02 PM
 
8,104 posts, read 3,961,090 times
Reputation: 3070
Thanks for the video CD.
I was contemplating on what to watch tonight and you have done just that.
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Old 04-19-2014, 07:15 PM
 
11,086 posts, read 8,545,982 times
Reputation: 6392
We have a government by, for and of the billionaires, some foreign, some domestic.

They use the leeches for votes.
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Old 04-19-2014, 09:08 PM
 
14,022 posts, read 15,028,594 times
Reputation: 10466
As opposed to those days of the Jeffersonian Republic where a grand total of 10-15% of a states population had the right to vote
The Modern era (1965-present) is the most democratic America has ever been,
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