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Old 01-11-2015, 04:40 PM
 
41,110 posts, read 25,740,361 times
Reputation: 13868

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Park View Post

Personally, I am not married because I haven't the right one yet; but I own a lovely home - it's a three story 120 year old Victorian with six bedrooms, three fireplaces, and almost all the original woodwork, stained glass windows, pocket doors, etc.
I don't like Victorians but good for you if that is what makes you happy but am I supposed to be impressed? Especially paying taxes and upkeep on more than you need. Congratulations you have a big liability.

Now tell me that you have a Victorian, mortgage free, debt free including your car, maybe rent out a room, low tax area, a small business, you spend less than you make, a nice emergency fund, contributing max to your 401k, and other investments working toward making your money work for you to produce a cash flow with the goal of replacing your w2 income with cash flow from investments, I'd be more impressed.
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Old 01-11-2015, 04:43 PM
 
Location: A Nation Possessed
25,754 posts, read 18,818,821 times
Reputation: 22600
Quote:
Originally Posted by petch751 View Post
What do you get when you give them your business and labor, you get a product, a service, or a paycheck. What do you get when you give liberals your soul? Hope of change?
Yes, and this is why, although I don't really consider myself a conservative per se, I certainly lean that way when I'm trying to decide who I hire to have control over me. My business (as in free market exchange) is voluntary. Government regulation and taxation is not (unless one likes jail).
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Old 01-11-2015, 04:46 PM
 
Location: Central Ohio
10,834 posts, read 14,938,291 times
Reputation: 16587
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisC View Post
The problem I see with (much of) liberalism as practiced in our modern day is that its practitioners (in many cases) stand for tyranny, and worse yet, either don't understand that or are unwilling to admit it. They truly believe (at least many do) that they stand for freedom, yet it simply does not show in their policies. It really matters little what you say. It's what you do that counts.
I find that many have a warped view of what freedom is because they've never seen tyranny up close and personal.

To the OWS crowd the idea of freedom was freedom from want that you had certain basic rights.

The right to free medical care.

The right to a good paying job providing a "living wage".

The right to decent housing because nobody should go homeless. Having a place to live is a basic human right.

Hunger. A basic right in this country is nobody should ever go hungry. Food is a basic human right.

If you could word it in a certain way I would like to see the results of a poll asking what the typical millennial would give up for "things".

Would you forever trade your right to vote for a guaranteed minimum income equal to the median income ($55,000 minimum) of all workers in the United States?

In addition to the guaranteed income we would provide free quality health care for you and your family for life along with free cell phones with unlimited calling, texting and data. With the cell phone would come free internet and cable television.

Travel is a right and with this right you would be issued a $20,000 voucher towards the car of your choice every three years with a pre-loaded charge card good for 2,000 gallons of gasoline or 60,000 miles.

For these government provided goods and services, at no cost to you, you agree to give up your right to possess firearms, vote or protest. Do you agree to give these freedoms up?

I believe the answer would be frightening.

Quote:
I'd have no problem at all with liberalism if it were practiced on a voluntary basis. But it's not. When it is practiced at all, it is damn well mandated for all. I have a feeling it would be more of a fringe cult if that were not the case. Which, honestly, would be fine by me. I'd harbor no ill will if it were not for those who insist I do things their way--if it were not for those who insist that I be a part of their collective and get all bent out of shape if I have a mind of my own and "cost them." Well, guess what? I didn't ask to be part of your Utopia.

I honestly don't see that attitude on the conservative side. Yeah, there may be those who "look down on me" (and there ARE on the other side as well), but who gives a damn. As long as I am free to do my own thing, I don't care what anyone thinks. It's just that I don't like being pushed. And, in my experience, liberals are quite pushy. Conservatives want my business and labor, Liberals want my soul. And both of them want my money. You'll get none of any from me if I can help it. Or at least as little as possible.
The problem with liberalism is it takes your money to do it.
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Old 01-11-2015, 04:50 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by Temp43k View Post
That 'deficieny' would be your perception, perhaps deficient in itself. It's not your place to define the condition of another person, liberal or conservative, and especially not deficient.

??? Under the conservative principles of "personal responsibility" and "American opportunity" there is a clear implicatin that those who do not "succeed" in this country are deficient in some way(s).
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Old 01-11-2015, 04:53 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicet4 View Post
I find that many have a warped view of what freedom is because they've never seen tyranny up close and personal.

To the OWS crowd the idea of freedom was freedom from want that you had certain basic rights.

The right to free medical care.

The right to a good paying job providing a "living wage".

The right to decent housing because nobody should go homeless. Having a place to live is a basic human right.

Hunger. A basic right in this country is nobody should ever go hungry. Food is a basic human right.

If you could word it in a certain way I would like to see the results of a poll asking what the typical millennial would give up for "things".

Would you forever trade your right to vote for a guaranteed minimum income equal to the median income ($55,000 minimum) of all workers in the United States?

In addition to the guaranteed income we would provide free quality health care for you and your family for life along with free cell phones with unlimited calling, texting and data. With the cell phone would come free internet and cable television.

Travel is a right and with this right you would be issued a $20,000 voucher towards the car of your choice every three years with a pre-loaded charge card good for 2,000 gallons of gasoline or 60,000 miles.

For these government provided goods and services, at no cost to you, you agree to give up your right to possess firearms, vote or protest. Do you agree to give these freedoms up?

I believe the answer would be frightening.



The problem with liberalism is it takes your money to do it.

Regressive taxes are a conservaative's way of using poor people/s money to do it.
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Old 01-11-2015, 04:55 PM
 
41,110 posts, read 25,740,361 times
Reputation: 13868
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
??? Under the conservative principles of "personal responsibility" and "American opportunity" there is a clear implicatin that those who do not "succeed" in this country are deficient in some way(s).
No, there is the belief that some don't even try. Example, Democrats complain that it's too hard to get a voter ID. If they can't do something so basic, a one time deal, how in the hell are we supposed to believe you can achieve anything. No freemkt, it's Democrat politicians and liberal media who are telling the world people are deficient. Then you go out and parrot it.
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Old 01-11-2015, 04:59 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisC View Post
Is there something in conservative thought that forbids being poor?

The conservtive principles of "personal responsibility" and "American opportunity" create an inplication that a poor person is deficient i.e. if they were not somehow deficient, they would not be poor in this country.
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Old 01-11-2015, 05:01 PM
 
41,110 posts, read 25,740,361 times
Reputation: 13868
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Regressive taxes are a conservaative's way of using poor people/s money to do it.
aahh there's that tax word again. Think about how government imposes that tax. Also ask why the tax code is so complicated (72,000 pages) that you couldn't possibly understand it. Why is it so complicated that the rich hire pros to advise and do their taxes unless of course you are a 1040EZ / W2 worker which means government is fleecing you too.

Knowledge is power (personal responsibility to make and learn how to handle money). Lack of knowledge... well you're living it. Instead of demanding the government take less you demand to get paid more which of course you pay taxes on the pay increase. Government is greedy.
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Old 01-11-2015, 05:03 PM
 
9,470 posts, read 6,971,219 times
Reputation: 2177
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
What happens to conservatives who are poor? If they do not become liberals, do they acknowledge that they are deficient? Do they hate themselves for their deficiency?
Why don't you grow up a little so you understand what you're talking about.
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Old 01-11-2015, 05:04 PM
 
Location: A Nation Possessed
25,754 posts, read 18,818,821 times
Reputation: 22600
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicet4 View Post
If you could word it in a certain way I would like to see the results of a poll asking what the typical millennial would give up for "things".

Would you forever trade your right to vote for a guaranteed minimum income equal to the median income ($55,000 minimum) of all workers in the United States?

In addition to the guaranteed income we would provide free quality health care for you and your family for life along with free cell phones with unlimited calling, texting and data. With the cell phone would come free internet and cable television.

Travel is a right and with this right you would be issued a $20,000 voucher towards the car of your choice every three years with a pre-loaded charge card good for 2,000 gallons of gasoline or 60,000 miles.

For these government provided goods and services, at no cost to you, you agree to give up your right to possess firearms, vote or protest. Do you agree to give these freedoms up?

I believe the answer would be frightening.
Oh yes, it would be not only frightening, but downright depressing.

For me the answer to all these would be a resounding no. I'd honestly rather die in the gutter somewhere.
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