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So a group of fraternity members in a bus chanted racist slogans on a bus and someone videotaped it. What they said is wrong, but is it really that big of story that it deserves to be the lead on the NBC Nightly News. There are millions of racist college students saying things like that all the time. You can't tell people what to think no matter how hard the media tries to lead society.
Isn't there a thousand other issues and things that happened yesterday that are more important?
because the entire country presided over by a black president needs to be reminded over and over how incredibly 'racist' it was, is, and ever shall be
They were free to express themselves in any way they chose. No one has deprived them of that constitutional right. However, contrary to a popular misconception, the right to free speech does not confer freedom from the consequences of that speech. They can say whatever they want, but for speech that, for example, advocates lynching people because of their race, there will be consequences.
They are now being given the opportunity to experience the consequences of their speech. They are still free to hold and express whatever opinions they choose, but that does not mean others have to be forced to interact with them or provide them with a taxpayer-funded platform for their expressions of hate or threats of violence.
Even if one accepted that the students' song constituted a "threat" (while hateful and racist, its difficult to argue with a straight face that the students were threatening anyone), the threat wouldn't be specific enough to fall outside of First Amendment protection. Also, mere advocacy of illegal activity, no matter of repugnant, is still protected by the First Amendment. It's when people take their speech beyond mere advocacy that there is a problem.
I see nothing wrong with getting rid of people who do not jive with your ideals and represent what you think your organization should show as its face to the world.
It is one thing to express yourself freely. It is an entirely different thing to spread hate, condone violence, and act like you're proud of this situation.
^^^
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan4
I think we also need to remember the very powerful idea that if you sit in silence while people spread these kind of ideas, you are basically affirming these ideas with your consent. Silence in this case is consent. The right thing to do is to stand up and say no, we are not going to tolerate this.
Well said! I repped you, but I think that both of these posts deserve to be repeated!
You are confusing free speech with consequences resulting from the exercising of free speech. They are two different things.
These students were not arrested for exercising their free speech. It doesn't mean, however, that they will not have to face the fallout of doing so.
It's a good time for them to learn that in the real world, actions have consequences.
The First Amendment protects individuals exercising protected speech from adverse government action. Government action extends broader than an arrest. Any fallout the students face must be private or social in nature; the University isn't free to take official adverse action against the students for protected, albeit hateful, speech.
I have the feeling that this was one of the old frat songs that are handed down and these idiots were just singing it for the amusement of it and not really comprehending the gravity of what they were doing.
Fraternities have old completely out dated and raunchy ditties that are a part of the fraternity's legacy. Apparently some are also insanely racist.
you are probably correct. However, I can't see how anyone can sing that song without knowing the gravity of what they are doing.
SAE has probably sang this song on the day it was founded.
Considering the debauchery I experienced as a college student on and off campus among fellow college students the stupid song is nothing. Blacks use ****** all the time. Betcha if black kids singing some song with ****** in it or kill whitey or kill po-po no one would care.
Funny item: Unreconstructed older white southener I work with commented regarding this incident, "Folks need to realize no one will ever like ******s. They [The forcing of PC] can try to control our mouths but never our minds."
I'll play advocate here: there are numerous examples of kids at Berkeley making similar comments against a sitting President, white males, and CEO's. I recall at least one event that included an effigy of Bush and a noose. All protected speech.
If you don't understand the difference between the political statement of hanging someone in effigy and chanting about hanging n****rs from a tree there is nothing I can do to help you.
The First Amendment protects individuals exercising protected speech from adverse government action. Government action extends broader than an arrest. Any fallout the students face must be private or social in nature; the University isn't free to take official adverse action against the students for protected, albeit hateful, speech.
I think you are reaching...
they can be expelled from this university yet be free to go to school at another one.
Considering the debauchery I experienced as a college student on and off campus among fellow college students the stupid song is nothing. Blacks use ****** all the time. Betcha if black kids singing some song with ****** in it or kill whitey or kill po-po no one would care.
ahh... it's those Black people's fault.
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