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it was the liberal YUPPIES that put the kibosh on pensions back in the 80's and 90's
they didn't want pensions...they wanted to be UPWARDLY MOBILE , and pensions didn't fit their mold
very few places give pensions anymore, mostly just government jobs and the few unions that are not part of a government/municipal field
unions (which a have their beginnings in organized crime) have become the monster they once hated... a corporation of their own.....what have unions done for the worker in the last 50 years...nothing...75-100 year ago.yep they were good....today its time to say goodbye to the dinosaur of unions
Remind me, do we currently have a Republican or a Democrat majority in the Senate and House?
This past December, Congress used a loophole to dismantle workers’ pension protections without any up or down vote on the issue, by attaching the change to a budget bill that needed to be approved to avoid a government shutdown.
Quote:
Tucked into the federal spending bill were provisions that will allow certain struggling multi-employer pension plans to reduce benefits already being received by retirees.
it was the liberal YUPPIES that put the kibosh on pensions back in the 80's and 90's
they didn't want pensions...they wanted to be UPWARDLY MOBILE , and pensions didn't fit their mold
very few places give pensions anymore, mostly just government jobs and the few unions that are not part of a government/municipal field
unions (which a have their beginnings in organized crime) have become the monster they once hated... a corporation of their own.....what have unions done for the worker in the last 50 years...nothing...75-100 year ago.yep they were good....today its time to say goodbye to the dinosaur of unions
it was the liberal YUPPIES that put the kibosh on pensions back in the 80's and 90's
they didn't want pensions...they wanted to be UPWARDLY MOBILE , and pensions didn't fit their mold
very few places give pensions anymore, mostly just government jobs and the few unions that are not part of a government/municipal field
unions (which a have their beginnings in organized crime) have become the monster they once hated... a corporation of their own.....what have unions done for the worker in the last 50 years...nothing...75-100 year ago.yep they were good....today its time to say goodbye to the dinosaur of unions
That's nonsense, but I can be wrong. So please cite that " liberal YUPPIES put the kibosh on pensions back in the 80's and 90's."
My understanding was that right-to-work laws, passed by conservatives; easy means to outsource jobs overseas, etc. caused a decline in union membership, coinciding with a decline in worker pay. Those weren't "liberal yuppies."
your union demanded???..... or OSHA demanded?? or your union pointed out a failure to follow OSHA rules (OSHA, EPA,etc)
99% of all safety rules are government born....not the unions
Unions often are way ahead of OSHA and often lead the effort to improve safety.
Take this situation for example:
Quote:
But leading up to the negotiations, the USW criticized poor process safety practices and equipment failures for causing 18 deaths in the petrochemical industry from 2009 through 2011. It often cited the 2010 Deepwater Horizon drilling rig tragedy as an example of what can go wrong.
Quote:
“Health and safety in the oil industry is still out of control, and we can't let this continue any longer,” said one union statement released in January
The company I work for, as is true with most of the O&G industry, authorizes any employ to "stop work" on any job if they see anything that could be considered questionable in terms of safety.
That's nonsense, but I can be wrong. So please cite that " liberal YUPPIES put the kibosh on pensions back in the 80's and 90's."
My understanding was that right-to-work laws, passed by conservatives; easy means to outsource jobs overseas, etc. caused a decline in union membership, coinciding with a decline in worker pay. Those weren't "liberal yuppies."
As I note above, the 401k was never meant to be a primary retirement vehicle this is something most people are not aware of. Instead, 401ks were created to be a supplement to executive retirement compensation in the 1970's.
In 1980, a HR consultant named Ted Benna came up with the idea for the modern-day 401k after hearing employers complaining that they wanted to pay less for employees retirement. But even in his own words today, they don't work as he intended. In fact, he refers to it as a "financial product that took off" rather than a pension replacement.
Those of us that were around in the '80s remember the hype: The "Decade of Excess", in a culture that brought us the yuppie and where movie anti-heroes told us that "Greed is good.", had everybody seeing dollar signs. Many bought into the hype of "optional" 401k plans making them richer than their wildest dreams in retirement, while plain old pensions would simply leave you in the poorhouse with their slow and steady monthly payments. Many people don't remember the hype (or were too young to know about it), forget or never knew that pensions were once viewed so negatively compared to a 401k. This is why it has become so easy for so many to attack pensions today - they forget the history. It should be said that the negative views of pensions by workers in the 80's ("They're crappy, low return investments!") versus the negative views today ("They're golden parachutes!") present an interesting dichotomy: Yesterday, people thought of pensions as holding them back in retirement, while today, people wonder why they can't enjoy the same kind of stable retirement their parents and grandparents did.
As I note above, the 401k was never meant to be a primary retirement vehicle this is something most people are not aware of. Instead, 401ks were created to be a supplement to executive retirement compensation in the 1970's.
In 1980, a HR consultant named Ted Benna came up with the idea for the modern-day 401k after hearing employers complaining that they wanted to pay less for employees retirement. But even in his own words today, they don't work as he intended. In fact, he refers to it as a "financial product that took off" rather than a pension replacement.
Those of us that were around in the '80s remember the hype: The "Decade of Excess", in a culture that brought us the yuppie and where movie anti-heroes told us that "Greed is good.", had everybody seeing dollar signs. Many bought into the hype of "optional" 401k plans making them richer than their wildest dreams in retirement, while plain old pensions would simply leave you in the poorhouse with their slow and steady monthly payments. Many people don't remember the hype (or were too young to know about it), forget or never knew that pensions were once viewed so negatively compared to a 401k. This is why it has become so easy for so many to attack pensions today - they forget the history. It should be said that the negative views of pensions by workers in the 80's ("They're crappy, low return investments!") versus the negative views today ("They're golden parachutes!") present an interesting dichotomy: Yesterday, people thought of pensions as holding them back in retirement, while today, people wonder why they can't enjoy the same kind of stable retirement their parents and grandparents did.
I certainly didn't make it up....
Because the Daily Klos is a liberal leaning news site and reported on a phenomenon, doesn't mean liberal leaning people caused whatever phenomenon that the Daily Klos reported on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero View Post
it was the liberal YUPPIES that put the kibosh on pensions back in the 80's and 90's
they didn't want pensions...they wanted to be UPWARDLY MOBILE , and pensions didn't fit their mold
Where in the Daily Klos article, you posted, do they attribute the 401K trend to "liberal YUPPIES putting the kibosh on pensions?"
FYI: A yuppie (/ˈjʌpi/; short for "young urban professional" or "young upwardly-mobile professional") is defined by one source as being "a young college-educated adult who has a job that pays a lot of money and who lives and works in or near a large city".
How far do you right wing voters want to take this right wing agenda?
First they came for the the entitlement programs, and I did not speak out—........
I have never been a member of a union rather held a management position. I am retired and receiving a guaranteed pension. I did not work for a city/county/state/or federal government. IMO unions have priced themselves right out of the market. Years ago there was a definite need for unions with the unfair labor practices, ill treatment, hours, etc. Then the unions became so big and so demanding that companies closed up or moved to a right to work state. Although I have several teachers in my family, I think the teacher's union is one of the most outrageous groups. When I worked I had to have a performance review every year, set goals for the next years and be judged by what I accomplished. No performance? No increase. The company had the right to fire at will. Why would I need someone go to grievance for me if I wasn't doing my job or in some way doing something wrong? Why pay someone big union person, when I can defend myself? Nothing but a scam.
your union demanded???..... or OSHA demanded?? or your union pointed out a failure to follow OSHA rules (OSHA, EPA,etc)
99% of all safety rules are government born....not the unions
I retired from the BNSF railway company in 2010. I worked for them for 37 years. I was a maintainence of way worker. In other words I worked maintaining the tracks and track structures.On average every year there are 5 to 10 people killed and many permanently injured in my craft. It is a very physically demanding job which is not for the weak hearted or slow witted. Slow reaction times can also kill you. Literally.
We have various large mechanized track "gangs" that perform different tasks including but not limited to replacing track ties, replacing rail, surface correction,ditching operations, weed spraying, Etc.
Many times this takes place in multiple track territory. to the lamen this means working a very dangerous job around several dangerous machines which are very noisy and constantly moving. all this is going on while you are 8 to 10 feet from a "live" track next to you with trains going past you at speeds of up to 79 MPH. I am sure you have hardly any idea of what a danger this is. Just take my word that several people were struck by trains over the years while involved in this type of work. that usually results in being picked up in several pieces.........
Our union asked the railroads to allow us to have the authority to stop or slow these trains down on the adjacent tracks. They balked and said it cost too much money to slow these trains lower than 40 MPH. this was not adequate.Our union went to the FRA {we are not directly under OSHA} and they sided with the railroads. subsequently another worker was killed and our union gave notice that unless stricter rules were put into place that we would strike until they were. the FRA. railroads and unions met and worked out a solution agreeable to us.
Just one example of the continuing need for unions.
I would think that just about anyone knows by now that you cannot rely on the Government or a large corporation to "police" themselves............
Last edited by jeffdoorgunner; 05-11-2015 at 08:33 PM..
Reason: additions
The company I work for, as is true with most of the O&G industry, authorizes any employ to "stop work" on any job if they see anything that could be considered questionable in terms of safety.
Tell me exactly how many times you have done that, and how did that go over with your supervisor??
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