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How can 1.5% of the population be so powerful that they can destroy the institution of marriage, especially if the majority of that 1.5% don't even get married?
Ah, but that's the thing! They're in cahoots with all sorts of Evil Forces.
It's a classical ploy - the enemy is at once very weak, yet able to influence society in a manner out of all proportion to his numbers. The Jews can't undermine society all on their own, but they have sinister, powerful allies. Sorry, did I say Jews? The gays. The gays, of course.
How will you explain your living in sin to G-d? After all, I suspect you were not married by a rabbi.
Most Jews I have met, and I have met many, have respect for Christians, as I have respect for Jews.
However, if you want to spar: "I'm not ashamed of the gospel [of Christ], because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes [in Christ Jesus]; first for the Jew, then for the Gentile." Romans 1:16
You see, it says, "first for the Jew?" We gentiles have been "grafted in to the promise" by God's Grace. We are "Jews by adoption," scripture tells us. He came for his own, but his own rejected him. He was "the stone [cornerstone] the builders rejected." For it even says so in what we gentile believers call the "Old Testament," from which Jesus taught, and proved from those very scriptures who he was.
The Jews of the day were amazed at his knowledge of the scriptures, because he had not been taught. Yet they still didn't accept him.
Paul was known for his persecution of the Church:
Paul Called by God - Saul's conversion on the road to Damascus
"I want you to know, brothers, that the gospel I preached is not something that man made up. I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.
For you have heard of my previous life in Judaism, how intensely I persecuted the church of God and tried to destroy it. I was advancing in Judaism beyond many men my own age and extremely zealous for the traditions of my fathers. But when God, who set me apart from birth and called me by his grace, was pleased to reveal his Son in me so that I might preach him among the Gentiles, I did not consult any man, nor did I go up to Jerusalem to see those who were apostles before I was, but I went immediately into Arabia and later returned to Damascus.
Elsewhere, we are told, "For it is by Grace you are saved, by Faith, and this not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not by works, so that no one may boast."
The Law can not save you, because you cannot keep the Law perfectly.
"All who rely on observing the Law are under a curse, for it is written:"Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law." Clearly no one is justified before God by the Law, because, "The Righteous will live by faith"" — Galatians 3:10,11
Can you keep the Law perfectly?
Jesus said, "No one comes to the Father but by me." It is only through faith in Christ that we may enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
I don't think the straights need help from the gays in destroying marriage or the family unit. After all, straights and their preachers don't seem worried about all the cheating that goes on that can destroy marriages and break up families. Neither do straights worry about where it said in the Bible that committing adultery was worthy of death. Instead, some of them like nononsenseguy are too busy judging gays and worried like silly over Marxism.
Coming down on adultery means looking into behavior in their own circles, and that's no way to run a business. Pointing at an outside group and saying "These guys need to change their ways" is an easy sell, whereas pointing at the paying customers in the pews and saying "You guys need to change your ways" is a good way to lose market share.
Jesus said, "No one comes to the Father but by me." It is only through faith in Christ that we may enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
Immense respect for Jews, but they're not quite kosher enough for Paradise? The Pearly Gates carry a sign saying "Pork served on Saturdays"? If there is indeed a supreme being, I'd like to think he possesses a bit more class than that.
[W]e are still waiting for you to explain how gays (I assume you only mean gay men) getting married has any affect on the American culture and family? Like real examples besides your fictional false god telling you that it is wrong because we all know your personal beliefs affect what you think god's opinions are.
Oh, are you unable to Google? Or you just don't want to be bothered? But you expect me to do the work for you?
"Same-sex marriage and parenting withholds either a mother or father from a child while telling him or her that it doesn’t matter. That it’s all the same. But it’s not. A lot of us, a lot of your kids, are hurting. My father’s absence created a huge hole in me, and I ached every day for a dad. I loved my mom’s partner, but another mom could never have replaced the father I lost."
Consider:
"Homosexual Marriage" is not "Marriage" Two entirely different things cannot be called the same thing.
A moral wrong can never be a civil right.
What about couples that can't have children; should they marry? Yes. Procreation is connected to the essence of marriage and the family. While a man and a woman may not be able to conceive a child, their union is still in accordance with nature. Homosexual unions are sterile and not natural.
Homosexual "marriage" defeats the states purpose of benefiting marriage. The states purpose is this: By nature and by design, marriage provides children with the normal conditions for a stable, beneficial, affectionate, and moral atmosphere. This strengthens society.
The primary purpose of homosexual "marriage" is the personal gratification of two individuals. That's whey homosexual unions are not entitled to the same protections that the State gives to natural marriage.
Homosexual "marriage" imposes immorality on society, and the State becomes the official promoter. And the State will expect good people to betray their conscience, to betray the natural order, and to betray Christian morality.
These are just some of the reasons why homosexual marriage is harmful to society and the family.
You really have no understanding of the Bible at all, do you? But you think you do. That is your problem.
But, I was hoping this thread was going to be a discussion of "Progressivism" and how the goals of so-called "Progressives" (Marxist/socialists) are being helped by the Homosexual activists trying to shove their agenda down our throats.
Where do you get from Genesis 3:10 that women are inferior? Doesn't say that there.
Neither does it say in 1 Cor 11:3 that women are inferior. The subject is Propriety in Worship (public worship). It is not talking about male/female relationships.
1 Cor 14: 34-36 is also talking about Oderly Worship, not male female relationships.
Colossians 3:18, Rules for Christian Households. Talks about obedience. Does not say women are inferior. But someone has to be in charge, and God put the man in charge of his household. Most women accept that, whether they are Christian or not. I would go further and say, most women want it that way. You seem to ignore that it tells men how they should treat their wives (love your wives and do not be harsh with them). Also children should obey their parents. "Fathers do not embitter your children."
1 Timothy 2, again is talking about Instructions on Worship. It is not talking about male/female relationships.
You need to realize the context of verses you choose to cite. You are guilty of applying them inappropriately. This is what Barrack Obama usually does.
Bible doesn't say women are inferior, but just gave men power over the household? Why did he do this? Surely, he would put the most qualified person in charge of the home. Since it's been, he's saying men are better in some way, no matter what.
And no, most women don't accept it. Or if they do, they've been told they have to or a god will get mad at them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy
Oh, are you unable to Google? Or you just don't want to be bothered? But you expect me to do the work for you?
"Same-sex marriage and parenting withholds either a mother or father from a child while telling him or her that it doesn’t matter. That it’s all the same. But it’s not. A lot of us, a lot of your kids, are hurting. My father’s absence created a huge hole in me, and I ached every day for a dad. I loved my mom’s partner, but another mom could never have replaced the father I lost."
Consider:
"Homosexual Marriage" is not "Marriage" Two entirely different things cannot be called the same thing.
A moral wrong can never be a civil right.
What about couples that can't have children; should they marry? Yes. Procreation is connected to the essence of marriage and the family. While a man and a woman may not be able to conceive a child, their union is still in accordance with nature. Homosexual unions are sterile and not natural.
Homosexual "marriage" defeats the states purpose of benefiting marriage. The states purpose is this: By nature and by design, marriage provides children with the normal conditions for a stable, beneficial, affectionate, and moral atmosphere. This strengthens society.
The primary purpose of homosexual "marriage" is the personal gratification of two individuals. That's whey homosexual unions are not entitled to the same protections that the State gives to natural marriage.
Homosexual "marriage" imposes immorality on society, and the State becomes the official promoter. And the State will expect good people to betray their conscience, to betray the natural order, and to betray Christian morality.
These are just some of the reasons why homosexual marriage is harmful to society and the family.
A marriage is a civil contract. If the contract is accessible to homosexuals, as it is in several states and countries are the world, it's legally held to be the same as any other marriage.
A moral wrong can't be a civil right. Give us a reason as to why it's a moral wrong. A good one that delves into moral philosophy. And by the way, this argument has been used to keep a lot of things from happening, like black people being considered people.
So, if what makes homosexual relationship wrong is their infertility, why is the infertility of a heterosexual relationship not also unnatural? Presumably you believe in a god, why did this God make them infertile if not to prevent them marriage, which exists for the purpose of procreation, as you claim?
Marriage has a lot of purposes. Among them is financial security, which same sex couples have no way of obtaining without a right to marriage. Do gay people not deserve financial security?
I think the primary purpose is civil rights and financial security. That's what they've told me, and I would say they know more about it than you.
We aren't a Christian country, so we can betray Christian ethics. We don't stone adulterers, nor require mandatory charity. And I ask again what logic you are using to define homosexuality as immoral?
"Same-sex marriage and parenting withholds either a mother or father from a child while telling him or her that it doesn’t matter. That it’s all the same. But it’s not. A lot of us, a lot of your kids, are hurting. My father’s absence created a huge hole in me, and I ached every day for a dad. I loved my mom’s partner, but another mom could never have replaced the father I lost."
I understand about feeling that the parents who raised me were not quite up to the job. I understand about wanting a parent's real attention but never really getting it. My parents were heterosexual though. And, I don't claim at all that my experience is the experience of all people with heterosexual parents. Nor am I pleading with heterosexual parents to cease being either parents or heterosexual. Nor am I pleading that heterosexual parents refrain from getting married.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy
Consider:
"Homosexual Marriage" is not "Marriage" Two entirely different things cannot be called the same thing.
A moral wrong can never be a civil right.
What about couples that can't have children; should they marry? Yes. Procreation is connected to the essence of marriage and the family. While a man and a woman may not be able to conceive a child, their union is still in accordance with nature. Homosexual unions are sterile and not natural.
Homosexual "marriage" defeats the states purpose of benefiting marriage. The states purpose is this: By nature and by design, marriage provides children with the normal conditions for a stable, beneficial, affectionate, and moral atmosphere. This strengthens society.
The primary purpose of homosexual "marriage" is the personal gratification of two individuals. That's whey homosexual unions are not entitled to the same protections that the State gives to natural marriage.
Homosexual "marriage" imposes immorality on society, and the State becomes the official promoter. And the State will expect good people to betray their conscience, to betray the natural order, and to betray Christian morality.
These are just some of the reasons why homosexual marriage is harmful to society and the family.
What a pile of circular reasoning. Surely you could do better than this. All of these could be summed up by saying "It's bad because it's bad."
And, most importantly, none of this explains at all why the marriage of two gay people you don't even know cheapens *your* marriage. Which was your original assertion.
"Same-sex marriage and parenting withholds either a mother or father from a child while telling him or her that it doesn’t matter. That it’s all the same. But it’s not. A lot of us, a lot of your kids, are hurting. My father’s absence created a huge hole in me, and I ached every day for a dad. I loved my mom’s partner, but another mom could never have replaced the father I lost."
Consider:
"Homosexual Marriage" is not "Marriage" Two entirely different things cannot be called the same thing.
A moral wrong can never be a civil right.
What about couples that can't have children; should they marry? Yes. Procreation is connected to the essence of marriage and the family. While a man and a woman may not be able to conceive a child, their union is still in accordance with nature. Homosexual unions are sterile and not natural.
Homosexual "marriage" defeats the states purpose of benefiting marriage. The states purpose is this: By nature and by design, marriage provides children with the normal conditions for a stable, beneficial, affectionate, and moral atmosphere. This strengthens society.
The primary purpose of homosexual "marriage" is the personal gratification of two individuals. That's whey homosexual unions are not entitled to the same protections that the State gives to natural marriage.
Homosexual "marriage" imposes immorality on society, and the State becomes the official promoter. And the State will expect good people to betray their conscience, to betray the natural order, and to betray Christian morality.
These are just some of the reasons why homosexual marriage is harmful to society and the family.
What a great post that is well thought out. We are a Christian Based Country and those of faith should not waiver under Political presser.
But a Civil Union between Gay people is the about rights in this country, which is basic. Marriage it is not. Even though Gay Marriages IS A sin. But we call that free will and God let's people decide to go to the light or live a downward moral life style.
I am glad more Christians are speaking out and maintain the family unit. One Man and one Woman compliments each other. Marriage is hard some days, but the rend result is very Godly!
LIST=1][*]"Homosexual Marriage" is not "Marriage" Two entirely different things cannot be called the same thing.[*]A moral wrong can never be a civil right.[*]What about couples that can't have children; should they marry? Yes. Procreation is connected to the essence of marriage and the family. While a man and a woman may not be able to conceive a child, their union is still in accordance with nature. Homosexual unions are sterile and not natural.[*]Homosexual "marriage" defeats the states purpose of benefiting marriage. The states purpose is this: By nature and by design, marriage provides children with the normal conditions for a stable, beneficial, affectionate, and moral atmosphere. This strengthens society.[*]The primary purpose of homosexual "marriage" is the personal gratification of two individuals. That's whey homosexual unions are not entitled to the same protections that the State gives to natural marriage.[*]Homosexual "marriage" imposes immorality on society, and the State becomes the official promoter. And the State will expect good people to betray their conscience, to betray the natural order, and to betray Christian morality.[/list]These are just some of the reasons why homosexual marriage is harmful to society and the family.
What a great post that is well thought out. We are a Christian Based Country...
Nope.
Quote:
But a Civil Union between Gay people is the about rights in this country, which is basic.
Man, civil unions are becoming all sorts of popular now that those on the anti-gay side of the debate feel cornered like rats. Too bad that people on your and nononenseguy's side did everything they could to outlaw said unions, back when they might have been accepted. A bit late to offer compromise now - events have overtaken you, and history will not be kind.
Last edited by Dane_in_LA; 05-30-2015 at 07:35 PM..
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