Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Okay, you didn't answer the question, but let's consider Lehi a bit further before moving on...
Lehi and other Zionist groups somehow managed audience and/or influence with other world leaders. Who is recognized as representative is part of the challenge when it comes to such groups, is it not? In all fairness, groups like Lehi are as much a direct reflection of Zionist leadership as many "terrorist" groups that are associated with Palestinian leadership. Who truly represented or represents Zionists or Palestinian interests then or now continues to be a matter of contention.
Again, Lehi did not represent the yishuv. It was a gang with very few supporters. Fateh and Hamas are the main powers in Palestinian society. I can compare the power of Lehi among the yishuv with the power of Isis among the palestinians. Very few supporters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
Aside from those truths, would you deny this fact as well?
"Former Lehi leader Yitzhak Shamir became Prime Minister of Israel in 1983."
Not a Zionist leader you say?
I knew I would "learn" something by way of this lesson plan...
He became PM 36 years after lehi ceased to exist. Mandela also was a terrorist, and became a President.
Shamir was not a representing leader of the yishuv at 1940-s.
What I have explained to you is not "mambo jumbo."
Just who do you really think you are?
I'm an Israeli who speaks Hebrew and Arabic, I know the region very well, I know the history of it also very well, and you are not from the region. That all I know. A Chinese guy will think about me the same if I would start to speaks bull*** about China without knowing Mandarin, ever living in China etc. Are you getting my point?
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
You don't know anymore than I do what it will take to bring Israel and the Palestinians to peaceful agreement. The big difference between you and me in this regard is that you have made up your mind about this. I haven't.
I am open to what new might be proposed, and there is a myriad of factors that can be newly reconsidered and presented in infinite combinations for new leadership to consider -- objectively.
Something you obviously can't do, so why keep beating both our heads against that wall?
Mine is not thick enough to take that sort of beating...
Hmm... I thought the occupation is so bad that the Palestinians must have their state now. Ok, no problem, lets wait.
Again, Lehi did not represent the yishuv. It was a gang with very few supporters. Fateh and Hamas are the main powers in Palestinian society. I can compare the power of Lehi among the yishuv with the power of Isis among the palestinians. Very few supporters.
He became PM 36 years after lehi ceased to exist. Mandela also was a terrorist, and became a President.
Shamir was not a representing leader of the yishuv at 1940-s.
Okay, Shamir, leader of Lehi who later became Prime Minister of Israel (despite being LEADER of that "gang," those very few supporters, not to mention the terrorism) was not a Zionist leader those 30-some years before...
I'll do my best to ponder that without further comment for now.
Thanks, but do please answer the question as first presented. I did not mean to cause you to stray from the main question(s) that I most want answered.
1) What did Zionist leaders first do in order to establish support for the creation of Israel?
I'm an Israeli who speaks Hebrew and Arabic, I know the region very well, I know the history of it also very well, and you are not from the region. That all I know. A Chinese guy will think about me the same if I would start to speaks bull*** about China without knowing Mandarin, ever living in China etc. Are you getting my point?
Me only thinks you think too much about yourself and your qualifications and too little about your obvious bias.
Are you or I not able to have informed opinion about what China does, because we are not Chinese?
This is the same sort of misguided sense of "intelligence" that caused Natanyaho to be condescending to the POTUS! The same sort of nonsense that also prevents intelligent thought from being exchanged between people of different language, culture and ethnic background! Backward thinking is what that is, closed-minded at a minimum.
I speak Spanish. Does this mean I necessarily understand what happens in Spanish-speaking countries better than you do?
Surely you know better than this my confused Israeli friend!
You're judgement is clouded even though you may know much about what you know, but critical thinking requires more than just knowledge.
Me only thinks you think too much about yourself and your qualifications and too little about your obvious bias.
Are you or I not able to have informed opinion about what China does, because we are not Chinese?
This is the same sort of misguided sense of "intelligence" that caused Natanyaho to be condescending to the POTUS! The same sort of nonsense that also prevents intelligent thought from being exchanged between people of different language, culture and ethnic background! Backward thinking is what that is, closed-minded at a minimum.
I speak Spanish. Does this mean I necessarily understand what happens in Spanish-speaking countries better than you do?
Surely you know better than this my confused Israeli friend!
You're judgement is clouded even though you may know much about what you know, but critical thinking requires more than just knowledge.
Critical thinking requires more than just knowledge, but it still requires knowledge. Without it, you base the foundations of your argument on false premises.
I can assure you that anyone that thinks the way you do is not his friend.
Critical thinking requires more than just knowledge, but it still requires knowledge. Without it, you base the foundations of your argument on false premises.
I can assure you that anyone that thinks the way you do is not his friend.
Friend or no, we have our differences, no doubt, and also no doubt this "knowledge" is somewhat select, as it appears we have already come to a stall with just question #1.
Two very different takes on Shamir as early Zionist leader, okay. We'll leave that be regardless he was also later PM of Israel despite that history, fine.
However, I can just as strongly assure you that you have demonstrated no such qualification to comment with intelligence or knowledge. Just more childish casting of stones that hardly deserve notice other than as you continue to insist with no decipherable intent other than to pester. Lots of people post in these threads with nothing more to contribute than that. Go ahead if that's your thing, or...
Why don't you try something new as well? Why don't you go ahead and answer this question for example?
1) What did Zionist leaders first do in order to establish support for the creation of Israel?
Me only thinks you think too much about yourself and your qualifications and too little about your obvious bias.
Are you or I not able to have informed opinion about what China does, because we are not Chinese?
A Chinese person with the same or better intellectual skills than me, who speaks Chinese fluently and lived in China many years - will know much better than me and you about China. I think it's obvious.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
This is the same sort of misguided sense of "intelligence" that caused Natanyaho to be condescending to the POTUS!
A POTUS who talks to a middle eastern leader with his legs on the table shows that he is an idiot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
I speak Spanish. Does this mean I necessarily understand what happens in Spanish-speaking countries better than you do?
If you lived in Spain for 20 years, like me in Israel, off course you will know much better than me.
Who were they (if not people like Shamir) and what did they accomplish of note that actually achieved for them the support they were looking to win?
Names, dates, details would be very educational for me. Just the more significant leaders and basics please.
Thanks!
Theodore Herzel (the founder of the Zionist movement) met with the turkish sultan and with the German king. The sultan allowed Jews to come to Eretz Israel.
Haim Veizman (a very important leader) got the famous Balfur declaration from the British foreign minister, to establish a Jewish homeland in Eretz Israel.
Ben Gurion worked with Roosevelt, Truman and Stalin to get their support. He was able to convince Stalin and to get the famous Gromiko speech in the UN at 1947, and their support for the division of "Palestine" at 11/29/1947.
Those are the most important.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
