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Old 06-26-2016, 06:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irspow View Post
Except that "progressive" ideology in this country regresses back to the worst ideologies of the past that fill mass graves and enslave human beings into deplorable conditions...



That is so far from actual reality it's hard for me (or many others I suspect) to take that seriously.
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Old 06-26-2016, 06:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irspow View Post
Except that "progressive" ideology in this country regresses back to the worst ideologies of the past that fill mass graves and enslave human beings into deplorable conditions...



How do you explain all of the other western, free world countries that are way more progressive than we will probably ever be not having mass graves and enslaved peoples living in deplorable conditions?


Reality vs Ideology
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Old 06-26-2016, 06:28 PM
 
Location: Houston
26,979 posts, read 15,892,870 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-R-B View Post
How do you explain all of the other western, free world countries that are way more progressive than we will probably ever be not having mass graves and enslaved peoples living in deplorable conditions?


Reality vs Ideology
How do you define progressive?
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Old 06-26-2016, 06:33 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
How do you define progressive?



Well I suppose there are more than a few variations.....


The opposite of the modern American Republican party seems like an accurate enough definition
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Old 06-26-2016, 06:42 PM
 
Location: Houston
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-R-B View Post
Well I suppose there are more than a few variations.....


The opposite of the modern American Republican party seems like an accurate enough definition
Yep, you have no definition. As a classical liberal my definition is heading toward less government..

Once again, what is yours?
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Old 06-26-2016, 06:49 PM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
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Collectivism of any form is not static. It is a transitional. As more is taken from the individual, more is requested by the individual. While the distributive evil criminal enterprise (the ruling elite, party, or government takes its cut and creates losses of inefficiency by needless transactions) In a never ending cycle of increasing confiscation, inefficiency, and thus increasing dependency and needs of those who have been looted and enslaved by the State. Until there is less left to confiscate then there is to distribute. Then the downward spiral into the deplorable conditions and dehumanization. As the serfs and slaves begin to rebel at the lack of resources the State in an effort to appear to meet the needs with inadequate supplies must resort to "eliminating those who need", filling the graves. So temporarily the State can increase distributions to those who are still alive. But it does not last long after this stage. Because the downward spiral of the anti freedom anti human collectivist ideology does not work. We are human beings and not insects. We are not and never will be a "collective".

Or in more blatant terms. The only "equality" or "fairness" that can ever occur among a species where each individual is completely unique with individual ideas, ideals, interests, and desires is when each individual is as free to express his uniqueness as much as is possible. Where each individual has his freedom maximized. That is only achieved when no person, group, or government has a supposed right to ever initiate force upon any person, group, or government for any reason.

Maximum human freedom occurs when the non-aggression principle is obeyed. And if any form of State does exist, it exists only as a RETALIATORY force against those who initiate force upon others. Any other form of government, State, "society" or "civilization" is evil and immoral.

"Progressives" and "liberals" (and "conservatives" as well to be fair) in this country are authoritarian thugs. They implement all of their policies through violence, threats of violence, and initiations of force upon their neighbors. They are evil animals and nothing more. They certainly are not liberal in the literal sense of the word. Liberals support human freedom, they do not act like thugs and tyrants towards their fellow man.

What is more regressive than acting like a violent animal toward your fellow man to get what you want? What could possibly be more regressive than being a beast of violence and evil? Progressive would be making voluntary agreements with your neighbor instead of using the thug government to impose your will upon your neighbor. That would be enlightened and noble.

Not stealing from your neighbors house to "donate" to your favorite charity. That is theft, it is vile and evil. If "progressive" ideas are so great and beneficial to others, why is force, coercion, and extortion necessary?

The ideology of evil, collectivism in all of its disguises, can only lead to more and more violence. Live by the sword, die by the sword. The States that use coercion must devolve into violence and mass murder as this is at its foundation. Since collectivism and coercion are evil and violent, and "society" that worships its inherent immoral behavior must fail as it is anti human and anti freedom. It simply is anti nature and it is doomed to fail.

As history points out over and over and over again...
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Old 06-26-2016, 07:32 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
Yep, you have no definition. As a classical liberal my definition is heading toward less government..

Once again, what is yours?



This feels a lot like all of the fuss over President Obama not using a certain phrase or title after the Orlando shootings.


Whether or not I lean left or right depends on the issue


Have you met many bleeding heart liberals that were in the military?


That alone should tell you enough.


It depends on the issue because I use my critical thinking skills.


I lean left more times than not but not all the time.


Probably still not the right definition though right?...or Left?!!!!!
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Old 06-26-2016, 07:38 PM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
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In classical terms, the left or liberal refer to those who are for for human freedom and anti-establishment or centralized power as was always the case in the past. "Liberals" in this country are authoritarians who resort to violence and aggression to implement any and every one of their policies or beliefs upon everyone else. (Albeit, "conservatives" are no different either as we are a completely statist nation)

In real terms there are no liberals or left wingers in this country other than the few true libertarians, agorists, and anarchists here and there. Everyone else are just thugs and tyrants taking turns abusing each other with immoral initiations of force...
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Old 06-26-2016, 07:50 PM
 
892 posts, read 1,577,938 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irspow View Post
In classical terms, the left or liberal refer to those who are for for human freedom and anti-establishment or centralized power as was always the case in the past. "Liberals" in this country are authoritarians who resort to violence and aggression to implement any and every one of their policies or beliefs upon everyone else. (Albeit, "conservatives" are no different either as we are a completely statist nation)

In real terms there are no liberals or left wingers in this country other than the few true libertarians, agorists, and anarchists here and there. Everyone else are just thugs and tyrants taking turns abusing each other with immoral initiations of force...



Well....


I guess I know who I am now. A " violent, aggressive thug and tyrant".


I'm so confused because I thought liberals were tree hugging, bleeding heart softies


Man....it sure is hard to know what to do.
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Old 06-26-2016, 07:53 PM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
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You would think, but then all you have to do is look at all of their policies and notice how many people must be violently forced to comply. They are no better or noble than any dictator or tyrant. By today's standards in America, Stalin and Roosevelt are "liberal". Clearly, neither believed in any form of human freedom or independence from the Almighty Holy State...
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