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I think in this particular case, it's a bit of grey zone to be fair and I don't agree with defunding them for this particular action. However, I do think it should show or at least warn other campuses they need to be more proactive in ensuring their students' rights are protected. In this, I feel quite strongly. If this means being proactive in providing the necessary security to keep this type of activity from recurring, then yes, they need to do so. They should have and could have coordinated with any number of law enforcement bodies to ensure the event went ahead peacefully. Because this shutting down speech by making it too unsafe too speak? That's extortion - it's the idea of you better only say things I agree with or we're going to get so violent you can't speak anyway. No colleges or university should allow this to continue and I am 100% certain that if they asked for the law enforcement resources, local or federal if local is unable or unwilling to do so, they would get them.
Berkeley used its own police and also had assistance from additional law enforcement agencies. Because of Trump's misleading tweet, people have all kinds of misconceptions about what happened. LE was present & involved in planning; university facilities were made available; security situation got out of hand & LE cancelled event as a result. Berkeley was proactive. And it's not like UC Berkeley or its students got violent. So focusing anger on those institutions is simply misplaced.
As an aside, this is the Yiannopoulos schtick: spew bs, convince some starry-eyed Young Republican SJW snowflake group to invite him to campus, complain bitterly about opposition to soak up media attention, rinse, and repeat. Frankly, it would not surprise me if the agitators here or at past events are ultimately on his payroll.
Berkeley used its own police and also had assistance from additional law enforcement agencies. Because of Trump's misleading tweet, people have all kinds of misconceptions about what happened. LE was present & involved in planning; university facilities were made available; security situation got out of hand & LE cancelled event as a result. Berkeley was proactive. And it's not like UC Berkeley or its students got violent. So focusing anger on those institutions is simply misplaced.
As an aside, this is the Yiannopoulos schtick: spew bs, convince some starry-eyed Young Republican SJW snowflake group to invite him to campus, complain bitterly about opposition to soak up media attention, rinse, and repeat. Frankly, it would not surprise me if the agitators here or at past events are ultimately on his payroll.
Oh I know it's his MO and he purposely is choosing these types of campuses for a reason. He knows it will provoke a response and usually one just like this. So what does that say? That falls right into his hands. He can say "see they won't even hear an opposing point of view without getting violent." But it doesn't change the fact that the colleges and universities have a problem on their hands. They're not doing enough - period. So Berkeley tried - I knew that - but so what? They need to do better. Just showing some effort isn't good enough. It's going to be difficult, yes, but do you want people and/or your gov't to only show effort to protect your civil rights or do you want them to do what is necessary to ensure you can exercise your civil rights.
This is why I called this particular incident a grey area. They did try, they did invite him to speak, but their efforts were lackluster and lacking. That's not enough to defund them but I do think it was enough to warrant a warning. I hope the message they received was "do better."
They didn't do enough. UC Berkeley doesn't get a pat on the back for their effort nor do the other colleges and universities which allow violent political extortion. They need to do more - period.
partial enforcement of the law is a violent weapon. When the thugs beat up someone who could have been protected with an impartial leadership, that is the same as the leadership beating people up on the streets.
If there are wolfs walking in your neighborhood, someone intentionally leaves your door open, the wolves eat your child, then who did the murder? - the wolves or the person opening your door? The same logic applies to the Berkeley riots. Arrest the Berkeley leadership for physical assault.
Oh I know it's his MO and he purposely is choosing these types of campuses for a reason. He knows it will provoke a response and usually one just like this. So what does that say? That falls right into his hands. He can say "see they won't even hear an opposing point of view without getting violent." But it doesn't change the fact that the colleges and universities have a problem on their hands. They're not doing enough - period. So Berkeley tried - I knew that - but so what? They need to do better. Just showing some effort isn't good enough. It's going to be difficult, yes, but do you want people and/or your gov't to only show effort to protect your civil rights or do you want them to do what is necessary to ensure you can exercise your civil rights.
This is why I called this particular incident a grey area. They did try, they did invite him to speak, but their efforts were lackluster and lacking. That's not enough to defund them but I do think it was enough to warrant a warning. I hope the message they received was "do better."
First, a clarification: it was a student group, not the university, that invited him.
This incident is not a grey area. The University conducted itself appropriately. The school has to balance security, speech & assembly rights, and resources. Agitators take advantage of demonstrations to engage in violence. It's happened before and will happen again. It does not justify preventing protest, which is, of course, protected.
Police made the right decision here: they didn't enter into conflict with the agitators which would have threatened both officer and student safety. What you are offering is armchair quarterbacking of the security response. It is unjustified.
Quote:
Originally Posted by southbel
They didn't do enough. UC Berkeley doesn't get a pat on the back for their effort nor do the other colleges and universities which allow violence political extortion. They need to do more - period.
They conducted themselves professionally and responsibly. Period.
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