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Excellent post. I've been reading a lot of books lately about social welfare programs in other countries and how they work. I think I'm finally on board with flat taxes for all.
They do it through taxation and law, forcing people to fund education. Theft and violence to achieve their ends. It's not a voluntary system.
Taxation and law does not equal theft and violence.
We have a voluntary system here and its not working out so well is it?
I can agree, due to our state system, that it would be difficult to have a federal program similar to Norway or Finland. However, I think this is something states can start looking into doing, perhaps with some federal help.
When I see how well other countries are doing, I have to ask what scares people away from making sure all students have equity of opportunity? Please remember its equity of opportunity and not equity of outcome.
Taxation and law does not equal theft and violence.
We have a voluntary system here and its not working out so well is it?
I can agree, due to our state system, that it would be difficult to have a federal program similar to Norway or Finland. However, I think this is something states can start looking into doing, perhaps with some federal help.
When I see how well other countries are doing, I have to ask what scares people away from making sure all students have equity of opportunity? Please remember its equity of opportunity and not equity of outcome.
On the bold, I don't think it's really being afraid that is making them not want to ensure the equity of opportunity, but for people like the poster you were communicating with, they don't want to pay for other people to have that equity of opportunity.
Many of them, not meaning that poster, also don't care about society our nation and only care about themselves and what they and their family/friends have. They want to ensure that they remain on top and they don't have to compete with other people on an equal footing when it comes to opportunity.
A large percentage of my family were/are educators and education administrators.
I agree that many issues are the fault of parenting and home issues. But there are also huge issues when it comes to attitudes of the teachers/administrators and the lack of leadership skills of teachers/administrators.
Education is a difficult subject to classify "blame" with. But IMO both are to blame in most instances. I'll note that I do think that many teachers get burned out and are apt to generalize children based on where those children live.
I also don't believe that being an "involved parent" at the actual school is really of all that much importance. My mom was never a member of PTA and never volunteered at school and I graduated with a 4.63 GPA from high school. My brothers, all except one, also did very well in school. My mom worked a swing shift and didn't have the time or energy to go to school. She was "involved" by making sure we went to bed everyday at a decent time, making sure we ate nutritious meals (for the most part), and making sure we went to bed everyday by 9pm.
IMO that and not letting your kids be little a$$holes at home is enough involvement.
Also, my dad didn't live with me for a majority of my childhood, but I saw him often, he lived around the corner from me for most of my childhood after he and my mom split. He didn't come to school either except to PTC once a year when I was in high school. My entire family was of the belief that my "job" was school and I better go and do well and not shame our family with ridiculous behavior. I think ridiculous behavior on the part of children is the main thing that drives how poorly schools perform today - teachers are having to divert too much time/attention to behavioral problems. I also feel that teachers/administrators have their hands tied on how to deal with this bad behavior. When I was a kid, if you were bad at school you could get a paddling. I'm not really all that into corporate punishment but I know that I was afraid of that and didn't misbehave in part due to that. Also in our district there was a "bad kid's school" back in the day and any kid who had a bunch of behavioral problems or in high school who got under a 1.5 GPA was sent to the "bad kid's school." Because they were a disruption to those of us who wanted to learn. I think districts should be able to bring this sort of thing back, but they don't because too many parents sued about discrimination over it and school districts are afraid of being sued today. Schools really don't even have much disciplinary powers today in school and due to parents lacking on this at home, it makes for a poor learning environment.
Great post. I *was* an involved parent when that's classified as going to PTA meetings, helping out at the schools, etc. However, I've severely scaled back my volunteer time at the schools because, quite frankly, I didn't see the difference it made in the actual education of the kids. If I was mentoring or running educational programs to add to the curriculum, that would have been one thing. Selling cupcakes to fund an end of year party? Eh, not so much.
I also agree about the discipline issues but I think we need to be VERY careful when determining what a "bad kid" is defined as. Some "bad kids" are abused, neglected, etc. and/or may have learning disabilities. This may not be popular, but I think schools should have greater latitude in addressing, assessing and "treating" these issues. For example, if a teacher suspects a child has dyslexia, the teacher and guidance counselors should be able to test the child as a matter of routine and make the appropriate accommodations for that child. This is coming from a parent with a child with autism and ADHD. I'm an alert parent who keeps a close eye on my kids and had no problem with doing the legwork to make sure my child's issues were studied and treated. But if he was born into a family where parents can't or won't take those steps, he could have been labeled a "bad kid." I think that is a huge disservice to children.
On the bold, I don't think it's really being afraid that is making them not want to ensure the equity of opportunity, but for people like the poster you were communicating with, they don't want to pay for other people to have that equity of opportunity.
Many of them, not meaning that poster, also don't care about society our nation and only care about themselves and what they and their family/friends have. They want to ensure that they remain on top and they don't have to compete with other people on an equal footing when it comes to opportunity.
You are probably right. Afraid wasn't the correct term. I just wish that people who are against equity in education and access to healthcare (I think these two are more related than people realize) would realize that the entire country/state benefits when we have educated, healthy people who can direct their energies to more productive pursuits.
Taxation and law does not equal theft and violence.
We have a voluntary system here and its not working out so well is it?
I can agree, due to our state system, that it would be difficult to have a federal program similar to Norway or Finland. However, I think this is something states can start looking into doing, perhaps with some federal help.
When I see how well other countries are doing, I have to ask what scares people away from making sure all students have equity of opportunity? Please remember its equity of opportunity and not equity of outcome.
Taking property without the owners consent= theft
Taking property by force= violence
That the perp wears a govt issued costume while commiting the acts does not change the definitions
Great post. I *was* an involved parent when that's classified as going to PTA meetings, helping out at the schools, etc. However, I've severely scaled back my volunteer time at the schools because, quite frankly, I didn't see the difference it made in the actual education of the kids. If I was mentoring or running educational programs to add to the curriculum, that would have been one thing. Selling cupcakes to fund an end of year party? Eh, not so much.
I also agree about the discipline issues but I think we need to be VERY careful when determining what a "bad kid" is defined as. Some "bad kids" are abused, neglected, etc. and/or may have learning disabilities. This may not be popular, but I think schools should have greater latitude in addressing, assessing and "treating" these issues. For example, if a teacher suspects a child has dyslexia, the teacher and guidance counselors should be able to test the child as a matter of routine and make the appropriate accommodations for that child. This is coming from a parent with a child with autism and ADHD. I'm an alert parent who keeps a close eye on my kids and had no problem with doing the legwork to make sure my child's issues were studied and treated. But if he was born into a family where parents can't or won't take those steps, he could have been labeled a "bad kid." I think that is a huge disservice to children.
I agree in regards to special needs. However, I do feel that many educators are very serious about noticing things with their students and will seek some additional support or therapies or a better educational environment for those children's needs.
My oldest mentioned above has ADHD (inattentive type) and I know that that is a main contributor to him always being "bored" and not turning in any homework or classwork (he will literally do the work in class and not turn it in. He's even not taken tests before in class!! It is very frustrating to deal with). This was something that was noticed by his teacher in 3rd grade. They took steps to help him but at that time he was in a very small school so it was easier to assist him. This is one of the reasons why I am considering homeschooling him.
I also have a nephew who is on the autism spectrum. His mother is how you describe and is not very involved in his care at home. She never took him to get evaluated even though many people in the family encouraged her to do so starting when he was about 18 months old. He was non-verbal at age 6 and when she enrolled him for kindergarten, that is when the teacher and district recommended testing. He was tested then and was placed into a smaller class environment with a lot of support and therapy in class. He is now fully verbal and doesn't have many behavioral issues. His mother still lacks though in his academic needs. Many of us in the family think she uses him as a check basically as she gets disability income due to his diagnosis. I worry about him because he will eventually grow up and I just don't think she is preparing him for living as an adult and it is not a priority for her. However, I do feel that due to her being so uninvolved, it has caused him to have great strides in his therapies regarding speech and behavior. He has done very well. He currently lacks in academics though and I do feel his mom needs to push the school district to provide him a one on one paraprofessional to address his lacking academics. He can barely read and is nearly 12 years old and it will be harder and harder for him to learn if this lasts any longer but his mom is not bothered by this.
So I agree parenting is a factor in this regard for special needs students. I also think kids without a lot of needs, like my son lack in support at school without a lot of push back to the educators/administrators. Due to my son scoring in the 98th percentile and above, prior to me being "that mom" I was told he is "doing well." And they were fine with him getting Cs and Ds as long as he kept their rating up with his testing. This is also one of the main reasons I'm considering homeschooling.
Taking property without the owners consent= theft
Taking property by force= violence
That the perp wears a govt issued costume while commiting the acts does not change the definitions
Oh. So your assertion is that you HAVE to pay taxes so its theft and if you don't pay and lose your house to a tax sale, its violence.
Well I can't argue with this mindset. Not because I think you have any sort of point but more like if I was arguing with you over whether my grass was green or orange. How do you argue such ridiculousness? Answer: you don't.
You are probably right. Afraid wasn't the correct term. I just wish that people who are against equity in education and access to healthcare (I think these two are more related than people realize) would realize that the entire country/state benefits when we have educated, healthy people who can direct their energies to more productive pursuits.
Just to be clear, there's a huge difference between being against helping people and being against a certain means of helping people. I will never support forcing others to fund things that I think they should fund, because I have absolutely no right to.
If I felt personally justified in taking money from my neighbor for things I think they should pay for, I'd support the government doing it too. Because I would never do it on my own, I'd be a going completely against my principles by supporting that.
Oh. So your assertion is that you HAVE to pay taxes so its theft and if you don't pay and lose your house to a tax sale, its violence.
Well I can't argue with this mindset. Not because I think you have any sort of point but more like if I was arguing with you over whether my grass was green or orange. How do you argue such ridiculousness? Answer: you don't.
Except he's right.
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