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Old 04-24-2017, 08:12 PM
 
34,278 posts, read 19,358,607 times
Reputation: 17261

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
The polls ruined what credibility they had. Silver was putting his chances at near zero. At least he was honest about letting his biases screw his predictions.

Clinton far ahead in Electoral College race: Reuters/Ipsos poll | Reuters

In the last week, there has been little movement. Clinton leads Donald Trump in most of the states that Trump would need should he have a chance to win the minimum 270 votes needed to win. According to the project, she has a better than 95 percent chance of winning, if the election was held this week. The mostly likely outcome would be 326 votes for Clinton to 212 for Trump.

That is no margin of error.
If by "near 0" you mean "28.6%%" on the day of the election.

Seriously, you should work on better lies.
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...tion-forecast/

The lowest in the months prior was 11.9% in October.
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Old 04-24-2017, 08:21 PM
 
79,913 posts, read 44,167,332 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
If by "near 0" you mean "28.6%%" on the day of the election.

Seriously, you should work on better lies.
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...tion-forecast/

The lowest in the months prior was 11.9% in October.
LOL, if that impresses you, have at it.

Trump has a better chance of cameoing in another “Home Alone” movie with Macaulay Culkin — or playing in the NBA Finals — than winning the Republican nomination.

Nate Silver.
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Old 04-25-2017, 07:47 AM
 
29,531 posts, read 9,700,562 times
Reputation: 3466
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
The ACA was nothing short of a give away to the insurance companies and directly lead to the (D)'s losing the House and Senate. If Obama had been the president he promised to be this does not happen and we do not have Trump. No, I do not have to reluctantly support that.

Because it mostly is.

In the faint hope that people will learn a lesson. It doesn't seem the majority will, even though some are.
Even Obama has explained the ACA did not come out of Congress as intended going in, but the legislation was passed, and now all we need to do is fix what needs fixing. As explained many times before, the Social Security Act met with the same sort of objection back in 1935, and it has been amended countless times to address what needed to be addressed in order for it to be improved upon, over and over.

We may all have had great expectation for the ACA at birth, but anyone who expected an immaculate conception is simply ignorant of just what a massive overhaul the ACA represents and/or the challenges faced regardless how the ACA may have been born. Obama delivered the baby, now Congress/America needs to direct its development from infancy to adulthood. Simple as that.

Here too, if you/anyone can't agree on these fundamental principles and realities, complicated and imperfect as they are, then going around in more circles about the same thing is simply more waste of time. Perhaps we ALL will learn a lesson or two about this sort of thing. All of us, including you!
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Old 04-25-2017, 08:07 AM
 
29,531 posts, read 9,700,562 times
Reputation: 3466
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogueMom View Post
It the media and "polls" had told us the truth, instead of lying to us and trying to push their desired outcome down out throats, this may not be true.

Not very happy with Trump, but the media and "polls" lost any and all credibility in 2016 with most thinking people, period.
Thinking people consider what the media is reporting, biased or not, just as thinking people need to consider what Trump is reporting, saying, doing, even though Trump also has his political agenda and bias.

Polls don't "lie," (again that word). Polls provide poll results, and they too are far from perfect. Still, most thinking people take them into account as well, to judge as best one's critical thinking skills will allow.

Not very happy with Trump, why?

Because he was ridiculous to promise a great wall and have Mexico pay for it, then not only finds getting Mexico to pay is a non-starter but is now backing off America paying for it too?

Or is it the bombing of Syria even though he admonished Obama for going to Congress to get that approval when Obama was POTUS? "The President must get Congressional approval before attacking Syria-big mistake if he does not!" -- Trump tweet. Is it that Trump said also tweeted "No, lets make our country great again as they fight their war! 6:45 PM - 3 Sep 2013

Or is it that we were going to repeal and replace Obamacare with something far better for Americans and got nothing of the sort?

Or is it that Trump doesn't want any sort of reporting of his accomplishments so far in his first 100 days, because there isn't anything to report?

Or is it that Trump has declared all objectors as "enemies of the people?"

Is it that Trump is driving relations with Mexico and now Canada too into the ground?

Maybe the offensive comments about how he has treated women in the past? Or maybe the mocking of a handicapped reporter? The stupid tweeting about Schwarzenegger maybe and all the rest into the night?

Or is it that Trump has now turned his attention toward North Korea as if he is some sort of ruler of the world. McConnell has called a briefing for all of the Senate on North Korea. Is it the concern that Congress will be briefed but not asked to vote for approval before military action is taken?

Or is it that there are really too many reasons not to be "very happy with Trump?"
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Old 04-25-2017, 08:08 AM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,419 posts, read 20,295,184 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
Even Obama has explained the ACA did not come out of Congress as intended going in, but the legislation was passed, and now all we need to do is fix what needs fixing. As explained many times before, the Social Security Act met with the same sort of objection back in 1935, and it has been amended countless times to address what needed to be addressed in order for it to be improved upon, over and over.

We may all have had great expectation for the ACA at birth, but anyone who expected an immaculate conception is simply ignorant of just what a massive overhaul the ACA represents and/or the challenges faced regardless how the ACA may have been born. Obama delivered the baby, now Congress/America needs to direct its development from infancy to adulthood. Simple as that.

Here too, if you/anyone can't agree on these fundamental principles and realities, complicated and imperfect as they are, then going around in more circles about the same thing is simply more waste of time. Perhaps we ALL will learn a lesson or two about this sort of thing. All of us, including you!
The problem with the ACA (Affordable Care Act) is that it isn't affordable, and because of that, it is basically useless. It's throwing your money into a pit. Premiums that cost a couple of thousand per month, and deductibles in the tens of thousands mean you'll never use it, which means your throwing your money away and still having to pay to see the doctor (until you meat that high deductible).

When you have to shell out that much money each month for something so worthless, it means you are doing without a whole lot of other things, and that's one reason the economy was suffering under Obama.
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Old 04-25-2017, 08:15 AM
 
29,531 posts, read 9,700,562 times
Reputation: 3466
Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
The polls told the truth. People don't comprehend statistics, polling, and probability sadly. The whole "don't trust polls" nonsense reflects a failure of education in this country that is stunning.
True.

100 people: 52% ± 10%, with 95% (2-sigma) confidence.
500 people: 52% ± 4.5% with 95% confidence.
2,000 people: 52% ± 2.2% with 95% confidence.
10,000 people: 52% ± 1.0% with 95% confidence.

These types of errors are known in science circles as statistical errors. Poll more people and your errors go down, and the greater the odds that the sample you polled will accurately reflect what the electorate will actually do.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/startsw.../#2da56ab33795
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Old 04-25-2017, 08:24 AM
 
29,531 posts, read 9,700,562 times
Reputation: 3466
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
The problem with the ACA (Affordable Care Act) is that it isn't affordable, and because of that, it is basically useless. It's throwing your money into a pit. Premiums that cost a couple of thousand per month, and deductibles in the tens of thousands mean you'll never use it, which means your throwing your money away and still having to pay to see the doctor (until you meat that high deductible).

When you have to shell out that much money each month for something so worthless, it means you are doing without a whole lot of other things, and that's one reason the economy was suffering under Obama.
With all due respect, you are mistaken...

The ACA is not what is unaffordable, it is the rising cost of health care that is making health care coverage more and more costly -- unaffordable -- for too many Americans. That was the problem before the ACA was passed. That is the problem the ACA was designed to better manage going forward. This is the problem that remains regardless whether we end up improving/fixing the ACA or repeal and replace it.

A manner in which to better manage America's health care system is only "useless" if the management doesn't happen! Just like management of any system or process, if the management is abandoned or undermined by those with vested interests to allow the necessary changes, then of course nothing works.

Bottom line, if the ACA is not the better direction going forward, what is? Even Democrats have acknowledged the ACA is far from perfect and that changes, fixes, improvements are needed, but they can't move forward with next steps to make progress, because Trump and the GOP is still stuck on obstructing progress rather than allowing for it!

PS: Allowing people to access health care coverage even though they had/have pre-existing conditions is anything but "useless." What we had before the ACA was entirely useless to those millions of people. Essentially barbaric as far as most people were/are concerned!

Last edited by LearnMe; 04-25-2017 at 08:45 AM..
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Old 04-25-2017, 12:24 PM
 
79,913 posts, read 44,167,332 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
Even Obama has explained the ACA did not come out of Congress as intended going in, but the legislation was passed, and now all we need to do is fix what needs fixing. As explained many times before, the Social Security Act met with the same sort of objection back in 1935, and it has been amended countless times to address what needed to be addressed in order for it to be improved upon, over and over.

We may all have had great expectation for the ACA at birth, but anyone who expected an immaculate conception is simply ignorant of just what a massive overhaul the ACA represents and/or the challenges faced regardless how the ACA may have been born. Obama delivered the baby, now Congress/America needs to direct its development from infancy to adulthood. Simple as that.

Here too, if you/anyone can't agree on these fundamental principles and realities, complicated and imperfect as they are, then going around in more circles about the same thing is simply more waste of time. Perhaps we ALL will learn a lesson or two about this sort of thing. All of us, including you!
I learned a lesson. Never trust a politician to do the right thing. Nothing stopped Obama from doing this the right way. There is NO way to fix this now.
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Old 04-25-2017, 12:43 PM
 
Location: Boston
20,097 posts, read 8,998,912 times
Reputation: 18745
After being proven wrong last Nov 8th, you'd think Dems would shy away from polls.

Slow learners.
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Old 04-25-2017, 12:48 PM
 
34,278 posts, read 19,358,607 times
Reputation: 17261
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
LOL, if that impresses you, have at it.

Trump has a better chance of cameoing in another “Home Alone” movie with Macaulay Culkin — or playing in the NBA Finals — than winning the Republican nomination.

Nate Silver.
You should add the date to it, and that it was a opinion.....in 2015.

Any other nonsense? With the kind of responses you give I could do this all day.
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