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Whatever rethoric some use to mask their true feelings, this forum is composed with 3 groups:
1) The ones with social conscience and class conscience
2) The ones with NO social conscience whatsoever, that see society as a place in where everyone wants to take whatever they have. They love the fact that there are poorer people so they can complain about them and feel superior. Probably people with emotional issues of some sort, or very resented for whatever reason.
3) the ones that are no one on other, in the middle, probably due to ignorance, and can be swept either way.
Whats social conscience? I was born in a middle class, or maybe slightly upper middle class family. I know i had more opportunities in my life than many people. I went into a (supposedly) good private school, when i was little i studied english, i went ballet and swimming. When i was 18 and left my house and city to study, i knew i had a house and a roof and food for whenever i wanted to get back. I studied two carreers in the 2 most prestigiuos Universities in the country. College here is free so this wasnt necesarily thanks to my class but, still, poor people dont have the time to enroll in public university, they have bigger problems.
I was able to buy an apartment when i was 29. I now have a baby, a husband, and we both are renting our apartments to go live in a bigger one with a room for the baby. We live in a nice neighbourhood, have good health insurance, and have jobs. My husbands haves a PHD in philosophy and is a college proffesor, im an editor and only work outside of home twice a week so i can be with the baby.
When im riding the subway to go work and a 7 year old comes to me and asks for money to eat followed by his mom, i dont feel like he or his parents are lazy and thats why they get for being like that, i understand they were born in a completely different context than mine, and that their life is filled with struggles i cant even imagine. I feel terrible, and i know that, even when i gave them money, that wont change their outcoming, because thats what capitalism is. For ones to have money, there needs to be ones that are hungry. I was lucky to fall from this side and im conscious of the fact. I ve been helping for years now, by going to slums to teach language and help wherever i can. Since my baby was born, i have far less time and i actually skipped a reunion i had yesterday with the group that helps poor people, cause i had to take care of my son. Me and my husband (he comes from a similar socioeconomic background) will always be behind the causes of the opressed, the poor, women, inmigrant, different races, etc.
We know we didnt EARN all we have; but we were lucky to be born into privilege, and we know our mission here is to give back all we can, be grateful, study a lot and learn and teach, and educate our son to be a compassionate human being.
I think the ones with social consciousness and the selfish ones can NEVER, eve, understand eachother. Cause they think they EARNED everything they have and all their pride resides in that, while we KNOW we just got lucky and our pride resides in being educated, grateful and compassionate human beings.
I grew up in the UK, socialized health care is a complete failure.
Unless you think the VA is great.
This link is access to a survey published in 2003 [14+ years ago] comparing the public's perception of their healthcare systems in three countries: The USA, Canada and the United Kingdom.
Significantly, this was when the USA alone had a totally free market healthcare system. George W Bush was president in the USA at the time and no reforms had yet been attempted. It seems the USA had relatively high marks for perceived quality of care but low marks for affordability of access.
This article published in 2014 [circa 3 years ago] seems to argue that your personal experience may be an outlier in the UK. The health system there is fairly well rated against the USA and several other countries.
Another one who yada yada about slavery but isnt packing their bags and doing the big thoreau
Society means slavery for you? You want to be FREE FREE FREE
Well, have you read Thoreau? He at least put his money where his mouth is
Look how they mock liberty people, how they mock freedom.
This is what you are seeing today, the rise of a generation of communists who do not respect the individual, who do not respect liberty and freedom, who think the end justifies the means, who will end up killing you and claiming they are just in the process.
Universal health would be funded by taxes. If you don't pay what tax is claimed, men with guns will kidnap and cage you.
And for any health care worker who would refuse to treat, the same fate awaits.
They are fine with that. Communist principals justify the murder of those who do not conform. In fact, Marx even states that when you are converting the society over to such, you will have to get to the point where you kill off all the people who refuse to conform to the system.
In short, they don't care if people are killed, in their eyes... it is "good riddance" as to them, they get in the way of the righteous goal they believe in, so their deaths are acceptable. This is why Socialism/Communism is evil to its core.
This is the one area I agree with the left. My opinion is that national health care is the worst system except for all the others. Health care should not be a for profit thing. But the left then as it always does goes off the rails and says we need to give it to illegals and others who are not citizens.
You're arguing apples and papayas. You think providing basic healthcare is "charity." We part ways there.
I'll tell you what I think is "theft" when it comes to healthcare: the tens of millions of fat, lazy, Americans who choose to eat poor diets, who smoke, drink too much and/or abuse other drugs, who destroy their bodies, and who, as a result, are among the biggest VAMPIRES of the PRIVATE healthcare system. In fact, I'll just bet there's plenty of those types on this very thread saying they don't believe basic healthcare is a right. What a riot.
Meanwhile, they are unbelievably unhealthy (never seen so many unhealthy people in my life before I moved to the US) and cost ALL of us a LOT of money. After all, PRIVATE insurance companies are in the business of making huge profits. They're not running charities.
It should be obvious that those tens of millions of fat, lazy idiots are the reason our PRIVATE insurance premiums, copays, and deductibles continue to rise. THEY are the THIEVES, and I have ZERO patience for their abject laziness, irresponsibility, and sense of entitlement. The rest of us, who are grown up enough to eat sensibly, to exercise regularly, and to take care of our health have to pay for THEM, ultimately.
Universal healthcare, per se, is NOT theft. The irresponsible behaviour of stupid people who CHOOSE to live unhealthy lives IS. You should redirect your revulsion in THEIR direction. But, then again, perhaps you're one of them, FatBob?
My user name is a play on the type of motorcycle I own.
I'm actually rather svelt for my height.
I am a former smoker though, (and pay higher premiums because of it) .
And that's OK, because it's a consequence of my own actions.
It's when you ask me to pay for the consequences of YOUR actions that I have a problem, especially if my involvement is compulsory.
I actually have no issue with a government healthcare system, as long as participation is voluntary.
Those who say the constitution does not give health care as a right, well it also does not say you have a right to breath air, drink clean water but I believe this as a human right. I think steelers wheel pined it. clowns to the left of me jokers to the right. Stuck in the middle.
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