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Old 05-23-2017, 07:54 PM
 
Location: PGI
727 posts, read 390,283 times
Reputation: 522

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Throughout history we have seen aspiring leaders vilify certain members of a society in an effort to promote themselves. Today we hear those who rely on government help need to suck it up and take responsibility and stop whining.

Upon my first return from Viet Nam, I was greeted with a hatred that was foreign to me. It was so foreign, I thought my country had gone crazy. How could they vilify me when all I did was answer the call to duty? It was so bad I volunteered for a second tour, hoping the country I knew and loved would be there when I got back.

It wasn't.

Viet Nam vets will tell you how poorly we were treated. We were vilified, for reasons we couldn't understand. Our country wouldn't stand by us. Our politicians often painted us as druggies and losers. And America threw us in the trash.

When we asked for help, we were treated like beggars, losers and the unwanted. It was only when we united did we find the strength to continue.

This may be hard to believe today. We consider those who go to war for our country to be heroes. And they are. But why weren't we back then?

What I learned over the years is when we let our so-called leaders pick and choose who the winners and losers are, the leaders win and America loses.

We need to stand up for everyone in our country. Anyone who believes otherwise, is NOT an American. Stand united or fall, one by one.
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Old 05-23-2017, 08:21 PM
 
Location: Buckeye, AZ
38,936 posts, read 23,885,452 times
Reputation: 14125
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimChi2PG View Post
Throughout history we have seen aspiring leaders vilify certain members of a society in an effort to promote themselves. Today we hear those who rely on government help need to suck it up and take responsibility and stop whining.

Upon my first return from Viet Nam, I was greeted with a hatred that was foreign to me. It was so foreign, I thought my country had gone crazy. How could they vilify me when all I did was answer the call to duty? It was so bad I volunteered for a second tour, hoping the country I knew and loved would be there when I got back.

It wasn't.

Viet Nam vets will tell you how poorly we were treated. We were vilified, for reasons we couldn't understand. Our country wouldn't stand by us. Our politicians often painted us as druggies and losers. And America threw us in the trash.

When we asked for help, we were treated like beggars, losers and the unwanted. It was only when we united did we find the strength to continue.

This may be hard to believe today. We consider those who go to war for our country to be heroes. And they are. But why weren't we back then?

What I learned over the years is when we let our so-called leaders pick and choose who the winners and losers are, the leaders win and America loses.

We need to stand up for everyone in our country. Anyone who believes otherwise, is NOT an American. Stand united or fall, one by one.
I agree, with your theory but it isn't easy. As you likely know first hand, people don't care about others. It isn't an American thing par-say but human nature. We just have a bunch of different mix of people whether it is coastal liberals, bible belt, dust bowl conservatives or blue-collar rust-belters along with races, creeds and anything else that can divide us.

But to be fair with Nam, it had several things going against it:
  1. It wasn't a popular war to begin with. We all know that college students fought the war tooth and nail, but mothers also didn't want Johnny coming home in a bodybag from the draft either. We sent too many good men over and many died, many more came back injured and so many more came back with something we don't treat...
  2. Drugs and crime were vices of former vets. Drugs were common with many veterans whether in Nam to cope with the war, or to cope with the after effects when they got home (I'll get to one later.) Drugs were big in the 1960's and not just hippies. Speed was common in the L.A. scene before LSD was a thing. Heroin was big in Nam and a number got so many fixes, they became addicts and needed it at home. Many resorted to crime to get it.
  3. Shellshock/PTSD was prevalent. PTSD existed WAY before Nam. Shellshock was around about World War 2 as a common mental illness related to war. However, PTSD became big in Nam. Vets couldn't hold jobs because of this invisible issue. Mental illness isn't a LT. Dan paralysis we can clearly see. Mental illness instead is an issue that we even now can't really discuss sadly. There's too much stigma to it. Some vets
    became homeless over it, others saught drugs to cope and then by default, crime.
  4. Homeless vets. Now the homeless vets are the most felt sorry for homeless people, Americans frankly don't give a damn about the homeless period. If they do, it's all lip-service. This was due to not being able to live outside of the war, PTSD or even drug habbits and crime.
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Old 05-23-2017, 08:23 PM
 
Location: Newport Beach, California
39,219 posts, read 27,586,391 times
Reputation: 16052
I agree.
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Old 05-23-2017, 08:25 PM
 
Location: Houston
26,979 posts, read 15,883,018 times
Reputation: 11259
I guess I should support Charles Manson since he is an American.
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Old 05-23-2017, 08:30 PM
 
Location: Anderson, IN
6,855 posts, read 2,844,087 times
Reputation: 4194
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimChi2PG View Post
Throughout history we have seen aspiring leaders vilify certain members of a society in an effort to promote themselves. Today we hear those who rely on government help need to suck it up and take responsibility and stop whining.

Upon my first return from Viet Nam, I was greeted with a hatred that was foreign to me. It was so foreign, I thought my country had gone crazy. How could they vilify me when all I did was answer the call to duty? It was so bad I volunteered for a second tour, hoping the country I knew and loved would be there when I got back.

It wasn't.

Viet Nam vets will tell you how poorly we were treated. We were vilified, for reasons we couldn't understand. Our country wouldn't stand by us. Our politicians often painted us as druggies and losers. And America threw us in the trash.

When we asked for help, we were treated like beggars, losers and the unwanted. It was only when we united did we find the strength to continue.

This may be hard to believe today. We consider those who go to war for our country to be heroes. And they are. But why weren't we back then?

What I learned over the years is when we let our so-called leaders pick and choose who the winners and losers are, the leaders win and America loses.

We need to stand up for everyone in our country. Anyone who believes otherwise, is NOT an American. Stand united or fall, one by one.
That was beautiful, Jim. And so very true. Also, thank you for serving.
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Old 05-23-2017, 08:32 PM
 
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD
3,674 posts, read 3,034,048 times
Reputation: 5466
Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
I guess I should support Charles Manson since he is an American.
nominee for the 2017 "If there's a God in heaven, you won't reproduce" award!!
Way to miss the obvious point. Proof the gene pool needs a better lifeguard.
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Old 05-23-2017, 08:37 PM
 
Location: Gone
25,231 posts, read 16,932,412 times
Reputation: 5932
Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
I guess I should support Charles Manson since he is an American.
Are you serious or do you just say the first thing that pops into your brain?
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Old 05-23-2017, 08:44 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,827,584 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimChi2PG View Post
Throughout history we have seen aspiring leaders vilify certain members of a society in an effort to promote themselves. Today we hear those who rely on government help need to suck it up and take responsibility and stop whining.

Upon my first return from Viet Nam, I was greeted with a hatred that was foreign to me. It was so foreign, I thought my country had gone crazy. How could they vilify me when all I did was answer the call to duty? It was so bad I volunteered for a second tour, hoping the country I knew and loved would be there when I got back.

It wasn't.

Viet Nam vets will tell you how poorly we were treated. We were vilified, for reasons we couldn't understand. Our country wouldn't stand by us. Our politicians often painted us as druggies and losers. And America threw us in the trash.

When we asked for help, we were treated like beggars, losers and the unwanted. It was only when we united did we find the strength to continue.

This may be hard to believe today. We consider those who go to war for our country to be heroes. And they are. But why weren't we back then?

What I learned over the years is when we let our so-called leaders pick and choose who the winners and losers are, the leaders win and America loses.

We need to stand up for everyone in our country. Anyone who believes otherwise, is NOT an American. Stand united or fall, one by one.
first let me say thank you for your service to this country. not everyone vilified vietnam vets, mostly a few radical anti war types that would today vilify any military person coming home from a war zone.

we should also note that vietnam is considered a loss, and as patton once stated americans hate losing. the trouble is that it wasnt the military that lost, it was the politicians.

to your point though, i do agree with you. we citizen are all americans, whether we were born here, or immigrated here and became citizens. and we do need to support each other, and help each other in the best way we can. the key though is how we do it. we cannot rely on government to do the job for us, we the people have to do it ourselves, because when government does it, they screw everything up, especially the federal government.

we need to get the churches involved, as well as local and national charities. but until the economy turns around and starts getting better, there wont be enough money to do what needs to be done.

but there are things we can do, for instance donate your time to homeless shelters, take a few cans of food in your pantry and donate them to the local food bank, write to the businesses in your community and encourage them to support homeless shelters and food banks. supermarkets, restaurants, banks, food distributors, car dealers, and many other businesses all have the means to help out, they just need encouragement.
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Old 05-23-2017, 08:51 PM
 
Location: Buckeye, AZ
38,936 posts, read 23,885,452 times
Reputation: 14125
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
first let me say thank you for your service to this country. not everyone vilified vietnam vets, mostly a few radical anti war types that would today vilify any military person coming home from a war zone.

we should also note that vietnam is considered a loss, and as patton once stated americans hate losing. the trouble is that it wasnt the military that lost, it was the politicians.

to your point though, i do agree with you. we citizen are all americans, whether we were born here, or immigrated here and became citizens. and we do need to support each other, and help each other in the best way we can. the key though is how we do it. we cannot rely on government to do the job for us, we the people have to do it ourselves, because when government does it, they screw everything up, especially the federal government.

we need to get the churches involved, as well as local and national charities. but until the economy turns around and starts getting better, there wont be enough money to do what needs to be done.

but there are things we can do, for instance donate your time to homeless shelters, take a few cans of food in your pantry and donate them to the local food bank, write to the businesses in your community and encourage them to support homeless shelters and food banks. supermarkets, restaurants, banks, food distributors, car dealers, and many other businesses all have the means to help out, they just need encouragement.
Of course it was just the anti-war counter-culture that dismissed vets from Nam. Why else did many have issues with drugs and PTSD as referenced in my post.
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Old 05-23-2017, 09:11 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,827,584 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkpunk View Post
Of course it was just the anti-war counter-culture that dismissed vets from Nam. Why else did many have issues with drugs and PTSD as referenced in my post.
there are many reasons vets have issues with PTSD, one being the fact that they went into combat and did and saw things no one should ever have to see or do. in vietnam, there was a drug culture as well among the soldiers. also dont forget that when these guys were wounded, they were pumped full of drugs while recovering from their wounds, many got hooked that way as well.
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