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Who says that these students are graduating with good grades? Do you have any evidence to back this up?
Who says they're not graduating with good grades? And do you have any evidence to back THAT up? Do you have evidence of reputable colleges which allow students to graduate who don't have passing grades in their courses?
The fact of the matter is you're trying to divert to something else since you don't want to have to admit something positive about at least some Black students (the ones who graduate college) but you had no problem coming out and admitting something negative about ALL Black students (that they all were propped up in the admittance process by AA).
If AA goes, it goes. There always has been and always will be Black people who graduate college with or without AA to help get them in. Don't you just hate it?
That article is about college graduation RATES, not college grades, by race. Thanks for providing stats but fatlou already knew that there are Black college graduates. Then again he may not, I can't assume he's a college grad or even a HS grad.
However, he attempted to discount how Black students got into college saying they all got in due to AA but he's been unable to explain how they were able to pass their classes and graduate because Affirmative Action doesn't do your: homework, help build relationships with professors, do your research, type your papers, read your textbooks, study for you, do your internships/externships, apply for jobs, or go on interviews for you. These things are all on the student and this is what Black college grads have done. Then again, a person would never graduated college wouldn't know that which may explain why the poster used a diversion tactic (answered a question with a question) instead answering my question.
But you didn't answer my question. I feel that we're on the precipe of unacknowledged ability that heretofore went unnoticed and unheralded.
Blacks graduate college every year. Fatlou said that Black students, as in all Black students, are propped up for entrance into college due to AA. I assumed the prop-ups were limited to Ivy league schools not state and private colleges/universities.
My question is then how are Black college students able to come from behind academically, learn the material/lessons, pass the courses, and graduate college along with their White and Asian counterpart who were academically ahead of them at the start of freshmen year?
Again, I feel that we're on the precipe of unacknowledged ability that heretofore went unnoticed and unheralded.
They typically don't at the same rate. Their retention, 4-year, and 6-year graduation rates are lower than that of Asians and Whites. Look at any flagship state university's data digest.
I have been saying here on city-data for years that the problem is due to lack of K-12 school vouchers/choice. A lot of Black kids with exceptional potential are lost to our country's public school system.
Unqualified minorities are given spots that they don't deserve to ease white guilt
This is my problem with affirmative action. Any minority that gets into a school or gets a job, is stigmatized as an unqualified affirmative action baby that was given something for free.
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and reflexively blame white people for their failures.
It's the other way around. With AA, mediocre white people who don't get into the school they want or don't get a job blame minorities for their own failures. "They let those black people in! I'm being discriminated"
But you didn't answer my question. I feel that we're on the precipe of unacknowledged ability that heretofore went unnoticed and unheralded.
Blacks graduate college every year. Fatlou said that Black students, as in all Black students, are propped up for entrance into college due to AA. I assumed the prop-ups were limited to Ivy league schools not state and private colleges/universities.
My question is then how are Black college students able to come from behind academically, learn the material/lessons, pass the courses, and graduate college along with their White and Asian counterpart who were academically ahead of them at the start of freshmen year?
Again, I feel that we're on the precipe of unacknowledged ability that heretofore went unnoticed and unheralded.
Sorry, I must have missed your question - and almost missed you asking it again since this thread fell to the 2nd page, which I rarely check.
I don't think it works the way Fatlou thinks it does. There are plenty of black students that get in with ACT/SAT scores and gpa's that are in the top of the range or in the middle of the range, and they do well and graduate. They're not getting a URM boost - they don't need it. They're able to graduate with everyone else because they weren't behind to start out with. In the case of two of my sons black friends, one who went to Yale and the other Harvard, they had scores that put them in the upper percentile of our 4000+ student high school. They weren't put in the pile needing a boost.
Also, let's say School #1 has 5% URM's - they're going to lower their requirements to bring in more URM's. School #2 has 32% URM's - they're probably not going to lower their requirements to bring in more URM's. This is in nearly all schools, by the way, private, state, and Ivy League's.
I feel such boosts can set students up to fail. What they're doing is lowering the requirements to get in, but once there, those same young people are being held to the same higher requirements everyone else had to meet to get in and may struggle to keep up.
I've posted before that when colleges in certain parts of the country start saying they need to do away with specific class requirements because minorities can't keep up, they need to look at those feeder high schools (and grade schools) to find out what's going wrong that their students are ill-prepared for college. Something is wrong, and for the sake of those coming up, they need to figure out what it is and fix it.
They typically don't at the same rate. Their retention, 4-year, and 6-year graduation rates are lower than that of Asians and Whites. Look at any flagship state university's data digest.
I have been saying here on city-data for years that the problem is due to lack of K-12 school vouchers/choice. A lot of Black kids with exceptional potential are lost to our country's public school system.
And the biggest reason for that is wealth. Naturally since the vast majority blacks were shut out from a decent education and/job until the 1960s they were unable to earn the money to help their children attend school. Things are changing but slowly...
It never really mattered to me because even with the policy in place, its still so easy to get around ie, rejecting applicants based on names, linkedin profile pictures, this new "culture fit" crap, etc. If anything, AA makes it so the recruiter at least looks at your app before discarding it based on whatever whims they have. As for how it makes other feel, I do not care. I earned my credentials and know my worth. I'm not about to spend my life proving myself to randoms crying because they "think" I'm an AA hire, student or whatever. As for what you said about liberals, you don't think Trump manipulated his supporters with the same rhetoric?
I've posted before that when colleges in certain parts of the country start saying they need to do away with specific class requirements because minorities can't keep up, they need to look at those feeder high schools (and grade schools) to find out what's going wrong that their students are ill-prepared for college. Something is wrong, and for the sake of those coming up, they need to figure out what it is and fix it.
Why should the wealth-level of a neighborhood change what's taught at their local public schools?
08-26-2017, 02:00 PM
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n/a posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineDeCoeur
And the biggest reason for that is wealth. Naturally since the vast majority blacks were shut out from a decent education and/job until the 1960s they were unable to earn the money to help their children attend school. Things are changing but slowly...
Yep. Not only were they denied jobs and education for decades, they still live in areas with subpar schools, still get denied jobs because of their names, and have their families broken up by a racist justice system.
But the casual racists like to pretend that everyone is on equal footing and that none of the discrimination ever happened, and if it did, it was at least ten minutes ago so they should be fine now.
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Grades
