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But first, let me tell about an experience of mine.
I went through grad school with this guy. He and I studied together. When we graduated, I found an engineering job first while he found a temporary job in logistics. After a year, my company needed another person, and I recommended him. Salary would start off at 49k/year for entry level. At the same time another buddies of his offered him a job in sales for 52k/year.
At the time, I explained to him that in the long run we could make a lot more money utilizing our degrees.
He ended up taking the sales job at that small blower company.
A couple years later, we compared salaries and he was still at 52k-53k while mine was 90k/year. I got promoted a couple years ago into the 6 figures, and he is still in the 50ks.
My point is some times young people tend to lose sight of long term goals and just go for the immediate benefit.
And people need to wake up to the fact that 2 years experience as a Walmart clerk doesn't make them qualified to be a business manager or entitle them to an 80g a year starting salary.
Interesting...
Tell me more about the people who think that qualifies them.
Sure, blame young people who have done everything that was asked of them: work hard, stay in school, get good grades, take out loans. Excuse corporation is making record profits who don't want to pay the decent wages.
Once again with the entitlement minded argument.
You got good grades? As if that is above and beyond.
Work hard? That is relative, but okay, say you did. Isn't that what you needed to do to get that degree? I mean you are paying for it, you better do what is required.
Take out loans. Well either you have the money or you don't. Welcome to life as an adult.
What should a company pay someone with minimal work experience in the field? Untested, unproven? Every new hire no matter the job is an investment and a net loss until they get up to speed.
You made my point though. Define decent wage? What to you is a decent wage for say a business engineer with no real experience in the field? How about a person with a 2 year business degree with no experience?
My wife was browsing for jobs a few months back and she was amazed how many companies were requiring people to have a 4 year degree and a few years experience just to be a receptionist and we aren't talking from a doctors office or anything like that. The job description was basic office work such as printing, filing, answering the phone, cleaning conference rooms, etc. On top of that, the pay would then be 12 bucks an hour. Why the hell would this job require a 4 year degree?
This is true. In 1984, I worked as a secretary/ administrative assistant. No college degree, and the pay was $8/hour.
During the 2008 recession, I saw an ad on a local jobs board: secretary/ administrative assistant. Pay: $8/hour. And they demanded that the applicant have a bachelor's degree.
That's not just wage stagnation, it's wage regression.
I said I prefer. I don't do the hiring. The reason I prefer that bracket I stated. More reliable. On time. More focused and dedicated to their work with a whole lot less drama. In other words they handle life like adults.
We hire from all age brackets including people in their late 50's.
They aren't excuses they are reality. You call it discrimination? How so? I train anyone I am assigned to train and with the same goal. Make them functional in the job. I have preference because of experience. 30-to 40 are the easiest to train and quickest to train. There are absolutely exceptions. The reality is though that a 24 year old kid or a 20 year old kid in general, isn't as focused as someone who has been around the block a few times. Their priorities are different and it shows.
That might be your reality, but it is not everyone's. By you writing off an entire age bracket, that is discrimination against anyone under 30. If you were the hiring manager, you could be passing up on great employees all because you have this mental image that everyone under 30 is lazy, always late, etc.
Once again with the entitlement minded argument.
You got good grades? As if that is above and beyond.
Work hard? That is relative, but okay, say you did. Isn't that what you needed to do to get that degree? I mean you are paying for it, you better do what is required.
Take out loans. Well either you have the money or you don't. Welcome to life as an adult.
What should a company pay someone with minimal work experience in the field? Untested, unproven? Every new hire no matter the job is an investment and a net loss until they get up to speed.
You made my point though. Define decent wage? What to you is a decent wage for say a business engineer with no real experience in the field? How about a person with a 2 year business degree with no experience?
What you call entitlement, others may view as an unfulfilled promises. It's not simply that people expect to earn a living wage out of college: they were explicitly told that they would, and every previous generation enjoyed that benefit. We have come to a point where salaries won't even pay the student loans that go along with the degrees that the positions require. Entitlement is thinking that manufacturing in mining jobs that pay 60,000 should be available for the unskilled and uneducated.
I would say someone who has proven experience in managing more than a few people in a successful business.
I have worked with people who say "I owned my own contracting business. I had 10 people working for me. This company is screwed up, if I was in charge I would."
Yeah they had a business that failed.
I detest the big bonuses for CEO's. Hell the company I work for is going through a bit of a shake up and they just gave our CEO a 25 million dollar bonus.
The reality at our level though is that the equipment is far more reliable than it was 20 years ago. Far less in need of daily rebuilds. The work has become easier. 20 years ago we needed 7 people to do the work of 5 today.
What hasn't changed is the need for solid techs for the what if moments. What has also changed is the mentality of entry level workers, especially our youth. They seem to feel owed the same respect and pay as their more experienced and skilled co-workers. They also seem much less focused on the job.
20 years ago entry level managers practically lived in the factory. LOL I hated seeing them in at all hours. I wondered what kind of life they had? Mechanical and chemical engineers and they were making about the same as I did. They were driven to learn the process. They learned that reality is often far different than theory. 3 years later they made double. If they made the cut. Today? 10 hours is a long day for them and they start at the pay I make now. They just aren't as dedicated. I like them, I enjoy teaching them. LOL about half of the ones I work with call me dad. It's an honor to be that guy to them.
I recognize that your question is almost rhetorical, and I understand what you are saying.
But I know first hand of a case in Phoenix there the lady would like to get off welfare and public assistance, but her sister - a CPA - figured out how much she would have to make, and it was $65,000/year.
And there is no way this poor lady could hope to make that much.
It's nice that we have welfare and other programs, and we have to be glad that she and her children are taken care of, but DANG!, what a trap.
(She ended up single and broke through no fault of her own. Her family even provides a condo for her and her children. She has decided to wait until the children are older before shrugging off the yoke of public assistance and dependence on her older family)
What you call entitlement, others may view as an unfulfilled promises. It's not simply that people expect to earn a living wage out of college: they were explicitly told that they would, and every previous generation enjoyed that benefit. We have come to a point where salaries won't even pay the student loans that go along with the degrees that the positions require. Entitlement is thinking that manufacturing in mining jobs that pay 60,000 should be available for the unskilled and uneducated.
Since the 90s we were told college didn't guarantee a job but gave us a better chance at success, still true. That is long enough to have heard the message. At one point that career was pretty much guaranteed, and dangerous work in the coal mine did pay well. Things have changed for all of us.
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