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Old 10-23-2017, 01:05 PM
 
29,519 posts, read 22,661,647 times
Reputation: 48241

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Yes it's obvious that raising a baby with attention, love, nurturing, and care is common sense.

But it's shocking the difference visually between a baby raised in a healthy environment and one raised in neglect and abuse.

Criminals and deviants are raised as much as they are born.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/two-brain...120608571.html

Quote:
To neurologists who study the brain, and who have worked out how to interpret the images, the difference between these two brains is both remarkable and shocking. The brain on the right lacks some of the most fundamental areas present in the image on the left. Those deficits make it impossible for that child to develop capacities that the child on the left will have: the child on the right will grow into an adult who is less intelligent, less able to empathise with others, more likely to become addicted to drugs and involved in violent crime than the child on the left.

 
Old 10-23-2017, 01:21 PM
 
1,348 posts, read 792,514 times
Reputation: 1615
I learned about this kind of thing a few years ago when at a party. A woman I was talking to was quite candid when describing her family. She and hubby and adopted two Russian kids, a boy first and a girl a couple years later.

They each were about 2 years old when adopted and came from orphanages. Oh boy, what an eye-opener I got. She said they both have: reactive attachment disorder (RAD). Here's a description from Wikipedia:

RAD arises from a failure to form normal attachments to primary caregivers in early childhood. Such a failure could result from severe early experiences of neglect, abuse, abrupt separation from caregivers between the ages of six months and three years, frequent change of caregivers, or a lack of caregiver responsiveness to a child's communicative efforts. Not all, or even a majority of such experiences, result in the disorder.

Children with RAD are presumed to have grossly disturbed internal working models of relationships that may lead to interpersonal and behavioral difficulties in later life. There are few studies of long-term effects, and there is a lack of clarity about the presentation of the disorder beyond the age of five years. However, the opening of orphanages in Eastern Europe following the end of the Cold War in the early-1990s provided opportunities for research on infants and toddlers brought up in very deprived conditions.
........there's more here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reacti...hment_disorder

She described both kids lacking warmth, trust, being violent and often nasty. They simply have little basis for understanding trusting and caring human attachment because of the neglect in the first couple years of life. They get special counseling every week and their schools are aware of the situation. They have to lock them in their rooms at night because of things that have happened. I was slaw-jawed listening to her stories.
 
Old 10-23-2017, 01:22 PM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,206,841 times
Reputation: 18824
I’m not surprised.
 
Old 10-23-2017, 01:26 PM
 
Location: deafened by howls of 'racism!!!'
52,697 posts, read 34,564,185 times
Reputation: 29289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Travel Crazy View Post
I learned about this kind of thing a few years ago when at a party. A woman I was talking to was quite candid when describing her family. She and hubby and adopted two Russian kids, a boy first and a girl a couple years later.

They each were about 2 years old when adopted and came from orphanages. Oh boy, what an eye-opener I got. She said they both have: reactive attachment disorder (RAD). Here's a description from Wikipedia:

RAD arises from a failure to form normal attachments to primary caregivers in early childhood. Such a failure could result from severe early experiences of neglect, abuse, abrupt separation from caregivers between the ages of six months and three years, frequent change of caregivers, or a lack of caregiver responsiveness to a child's communicative efforts. Not all, or even a majority of such experiences, result in the disorder.

Children with RAD are presumed to have grossly disturbed internal working models of relationships that may lead to interpersonal and behavioral difficulties in later life. There are few studies of long-term effects, and there is a lack of clarity about the presentation of the disorder beyond the age of five years. However, the opening of orphanages in Eastern Europe following the end of the Cold War in the early-1990s provided opportunities for research on infants and toddlers brought up in very deprived conditions.
........there's more here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reacti...hment_disorder

She described both kids lacking warmth, trust, being violent and often nasty. They simply have little basis for understanding trusting and caring human attachment because of the neglect in the first couple years of life. They get special counseling every week and their schools are aware of the situation. They have to lock them in their rooms at night because of things that have happened. I was slaw-jawed listening to her stories.
i know a highly respected family who adopted a Russian kid like the ones described. he beat a doctor to death with a pool cue.

New Mexico man convicted of second-degree murder for beating doctor to death with pool cue | Fox News
 
Old 10-23-2017, 01:31 PM
 
16,212 posts, read 10,826,104 times
Reputation: 8442
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
I’m not surprised.
Me either.

Read the article a couple days ago and this is not surprising.

The first 3 years of a child's life are the most important developmentally and "nurture" (environment) is the only way to ensure the "nature" (genetic) positives come into play.

I found it interesting that these are English children and an English study in that they are trying to implement an early intervention program, similar to the ones here in the US.

I honestly feel ours could use some dramatic improvement and early parenting and breastfeeding is something that I'm very passionate about in my own volunteerism and charity contributions.
 
Old 10-23-2017, 02:01 PM
 
51,654 posts, read 25,828,130 times
Reputation: 37894
In the Realm of Hungry Ghosts: Close Encounters with Addiction, Gabor Maté’s relies on his experience as a medical doctor and his groundbreaking work with the severely addicted on Vancouver’s skid row to describe the neurological development, and brain chemistry involved with the addiction craving.

It's a fascinating book that you can read a page or two and think about all day.

Children's brains develop at a phenomenal rate the first five years, and babies who have responsive caregivers, ones whose pupils enlarge as they look at them, their brains develop differently than those with non-responsive caregivers.

Though he focuses on the experiences that can lead to addiction, the broader issue of what are we doing as a society when we promote leaving young children in the care of a series of strangers haunts me.
 
Old 10-23-2017, 02:03 PM
 
Location: Washington, DC
4,320 posts, read 5,139,161 times
Reputation: 8277
Makes me more pro-choice than I already am.
 
Old 10-23-2017, 02:05 PM
 
18,561 posts, read 7,375,874 times
Reputation: 11376
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburban_Guy View Post
Yes it's obvious that raising a baby with attention, love, nurturing, and care is common sense.

But it's shocking the difference visually between a baby raised in a healthy environment and one raised in neglect and abuse.

Criminals and deviants are raised as much as they are born.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/two-brain...120608571.html
You can't draw conclusions like that from the article you cited. There was no discussion of all the other variables that could contribute to the apparent differences.
 
Old 10-23-2017, 02:09 PM
 
51,654 posts, read 25,828,130 times
Reputation: 37894
When our kids were growing up, I could tell with a fair degree of accuracy which children were raised in daycare.

When we had a houseful of children, (which we often did as I was a full-time Mom when the kids were young and we had a basement and great back yard), the homegrown kids seemed more independent, less needy, less likely to need help with every little thing.

It was, of course, a small sample and I haven't kept up with all of them, so don't know how it actually all turned out. But do recall at the time dreading the children of several families as I knew they would need a lot of attention.
 
Old 10-23-2017, 02:18 PM
 
Location: London
12,275 posts, read 7,142,126 times
Reputation: 13661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Travel Crazy View Post
I learned about this kind of thing a few years ago when at a party. A woman I was talking to was quite candid when describing her family. She and hubby and adopted two Russian kids, a boy first and a girl a couple years later.

They each were about 2 years old when adopted and came from orphanages. Oh boy, what an eye-opener I got. She said they both have: reactive attachment disorder (RAD). Here's a description from Wikipedia:

RAD arises from a failure to form normal attachments to primary caregivers in early childhood. Such a failure could result from severe early experiences of neglect, abuse, abrupt separation from caregivers between the ages of six months and three years, frequent change of caregivers, or a lack of caregiver responsiveness to a child's communicative efforts. Not all, or even a majority of such experiences, result in the disorder.

Children with RAD are presumed to have grossly disturbed internal working models of relationships that may lead to interpersonal and behavioral difficulties in later life. There are few studies of long-term effects, and there is a lack of clarity about the presentation of the disorder beyond the age of five years. However, the opening of orphanages in Eastern Europe following the end of the Cold War in the early-1990s provided opportunities for research on infants and toddlers brought up in very deprived conditions.
........there's more here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reacti...hment_disorder

She described both kids lacking warmth, trust, being violent and often nasty. They simply have little basis for understanding trusting and caring human attachment because of the neglect in the first couple years of life. They get special counseling every week and their schools are aware of the situation. They have to lock them in their rooms at night because of things that have happened. I was slaw-jawed listening to her stories.
I believe there's always hope.

I myself was completely and absolutely neglected for the first three years of my life, and having not started talking yet even at the age of 5, early childhood doctors were convinced that I was a lost cause.

However, once the situation at home was remedied and I was enrolled in school where I had actual interaction with other people, I managed to catch up to my peers in no time.

That said, I do not have any contact with my parents, but it's not because of lingering attachment disorders - but because they never deserved the title of "mom" and "dad" in the first place. They were housemates at most, highly irresponsible deadbeat ones at that.

My trust and feelings are reserved for those who deserve it, like my husband, my in-laws, and close friends.
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