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Old 03-23-2018, 12:32 PM
 
2,991 posts, read 4,290,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
Yes, a Jewish state is going to be the trigger for an Islamic Reformation out of the stone ages.


Interesting that you said a "Jewish state" rather than a "democratic state." Surely you wouldn't be just a little bit anti-semetic?
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Old 03-23-2018, 12:35 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
8,750 posts, read 3,119,604 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamish Forbes View Post
You don't consider WWII self-defense? You do know, of course, about the German nuclear program directed by Heisenberg. No?

But where you go seriously wrong is in the notion that he wants to "bomb countries all over the world." This is absurd -- a form of information pollution.
Nope.

1.) Hawaii was stolen land. The U.S. illegally overthrew Hawaii's queen and colonized them.
2.) FDR deliberately provoked Japan by cutting off their oil and gas supplies.
3.) FDR knew Pearl Harbor was a distinct possibility and yet did nothing to prevent it.
4.) No Axis nation invaded the U.S. mainland.
5.) Hitler wanted nothing to do with America. He knew he could never conquer the U.S. due to guerrilla warfare.

Well he wants to bomb most of Asia and much of Africa; I'm sure there are countries in Central and South America in which he wants to interfere as well. Seems like all over the world to me.
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Old 03-23-2018, 12:37 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irish_bob View Post
they ( neo cons ) differ on certain things , not all are supply side economics ideologues for example but all are unconditionally committed to the interests of the israeli state
Neocons are all former Democrats (Scoop Jackson disciples) who became Republicans when Reagan took office. Their ideology actually descends from Trotsky and Leo Strauss.
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Old 03-23-2018, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamish Forbes View Post
Israel is our only meaningful ally in the middle east. That's why a lot of Americans support them, probably including John Bolton (but I am only guessing about his reasons). Moreover, Israel is the only hope for the eventual emergence of decency in the middle east.
The U.S. taxpayer is forced to subsidize Israel to the tune of nearly $4 billion a year in welfare payments. This to a country that has universal health care, free college, and free abortions on demand.
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Old 03-23-2018, 12:41 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
8,750 posts, read 3,119,604 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamish Forbes View Post
Interesting that you said a "Jewish state" rather than a "democratic state." Surely you wouldn't be just a little bit anti-semetic?
Israel is a "Jewish State." Just like Iran is an "Islamic State."

Idiots like Richard Spencer also want an ethno-state for straight white Christians.
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Old 03-23-2018, 12:48 PM
 
2,991 posts, read 4,290,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rebeldor View Post
Nope.

1.) Hawaii was stolen land. The U.S. illegally overthrew Hawaii's queen and colonized them.
Oh, piffle. Every country extant is "stolen land."

Quote:

2.) FDR deliberately provoked Japan by cutting off their oil and gas supplies.
He cut their supplies in response to their atrocities in China. What obligation did the USA have to supply these warmongering savages?

Quote:

3.) FDR knew Pearl Harbor was a distinct possibility and yet did nothing to prevent it.
Prevent it how?

Quote:

4.) No Axis nation invaded the U.S. mainland.
Germany declared war on the US four days after Pearl Harbor. Had they had the means, they would have invaded our mainland the next day, as they timely did in Poland, Norway, France, Belgium, Holland, The Soviet Union, Romania, Sudetenland, and a few other places.

Quote:

5.) Hitler wanted nothing to do with America. He knew he could never conquer the U.S. due to guerrilla warfare.
He was developing long-range planes and nuclear weapons to attack the United States, specifically New York.

Quote:

Well he wants to bomb most of Asia and much of Africa; I'm sure there are countries in Central and South America in which he wants to interfere as well. Seems like all over the world to me.
Most of Asia and Africa? No. This kind of stuff is information pollution.

Last edited by Hamish Forbes; 03-23-2018 at 01:00 PM..
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Old 03-23-2018, 12:56 PM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,206,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamish Forbes View Post
Israel is our only meaningful ally in the middle east. That's why a lot of Americans support them, probably including John Bolton (but I am only guessing about his reasons). Moreover, Israel is the only hope for the eventual emergence of decency in the middle east.
As evidenced by what?

We don’t have an ally in the Middle East, nor do we need one.

We do have several Middle Eastern leeches though...we don’t need them either.
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Old 03-23-2018, 01:03 PM
 
2,991 posts, read 4,290,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
As evidenced by what?

We don’t have an ally in the Middle East, nor do we need one.
Intelligence sharing and ideological unity, as well as formal alliance.
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Old 03-23-2018, 01:30 PM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,206,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamish Forbes View Post
Intelligence sharing and ideological unity, as well as formal alliance.
Using intelligence from a biased “ally” in the region is the height of stupidity. Israel’s Intel should never be taken seriously by the American intelligence apparatus. It’ll ALWAYS be slanted in their favor.

For example, why didn’t they warn us off of invading Iraq? Why didn’t they warn us that it was gonna be a failure and a disaster...and that we’d destabilize the Middle East and empower Iran? You know...since they know so much! But no, they bought into the pretext for that war.

Why didn’t they warn us that going into Afghanistan was a fool’s errand? But no, they supported our invasion of that nation too.

Why didn’t they warn us about 9/11? You know...since they know so much about what’s going on in the Middle East and have (supposedly) the best intel in the region?

Get outta here. Israeli intelligence has been useless to us. We’re better off without it.

And “formal alliance?” What does that do for the United States? What do we gain? If we weren’t in a formal alliance with israel, how would that attenuate our fortunes overall because I sure as hell cant see the difference. You tell me. This country did just fine before 1948. We’d won two world wars without an alliance with Israel.
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Old 03-23-2018, 01:45 PM
 
2,991 posts, read 4,290,539 times
Reputation: 4270
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
Using intelligence from a biased “ally” in the region is the height of stupidity. Israel’s Intel should never be taken seriously by the American intelligence apparatus. It’ll ALWAYS be slanted in their favor.

For example, why didn’t they warn us off of invading Iraq? Why didn’t they warn us that it was gonna be a failure and a disaster...and that we’d destabilize the Middle East and empower Iran? You know...since they know so much! But no, they bought into the pretext for that war.

Why didn’t they warn us that going into Afghanistan was a fool’s errand? But no, they supported our invasion of that nation too.

Why didn’t they warn us about 9/11? You know...since they know so much about what’s going on in the Middle East and have (supposedly) the best intel in the region?

Get outta here. Israeli intelligence has been useless to us. We’re better off without it.

And “formal alliance?” What does that do for the United States? What do we gain? If we weren’t in a formal alliance with israel, how would that attenuate our fortunes overall because I sure as hell cant see the difference. You tell me. This country did just fine before 1948. We’d won two world wars without an alliance with Israel.
Your premises are weak, and your understanding of intelligence seems fuzzy at best. Consequently, your conclusions are questionable. Bottom line seems to be that you are anti-Israeli. But really, so what? Think whatever you want, and vote accordingly.
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