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Let me try and explain it to you. My parents lived through the Hitler years, and I've been through three concentration camps, Dachau, Buchenwald and Terzin. I've also seen the hate that was shown in the recent elections in Hungary, as I was there during the later part of that campaign.
My fiance and I swore that no matter what, when we see glimmers of what happened during the Nazi era, we need to speak out against it. Don't forget, the Holocaust did not start immediately, in fact Hitler was in power for 8 years before the mass murders started.
The base that is being established right now, the demonizing of a group of people, using the extremes (MS13) to define the whole group, the dehumanizing (they're just animals) and the outright violation of human rights is exactly how things started in Nazi Germany.
Never again means NEVER AGAIN. Never again let those elements that established the groundwork for the horrors that followed get hold. Never again can the demonization of an entire set of people be allowed. Never again can the dehumanization be allowed, and never, ever, again will we be silent when we see human rights being violated.
We are not religious, but we are humanists. When you see what those people went through, even in a camp like Terezin or it's ghetto, you say, never again. We must speak out when we see even the slightest move towards the circumstances that allowed the Holocaust to occur.
Never again means none of us can be silent. Ever.
And me and my fiance won't. Ever.
You seriously need to get a grip.
Listen up --- Every country in the world has immigration laws and expects those who want to immigrate there to do so in accordance with their immigration laws. This is in no way, shape or form anything like the Holocaust The US is a very generous country that allows 1 million legal immigrants per year to come here. Maybe you should educate yourself on other countries' immigration laws and how they treat illegal immigrants before you make such shameful and vile Holocaust analogies.
It's despicable to make such comparisons. When you do so, you trivialize the suffering that Holocaust victims endured.
I guess you in your fevered imagination think that no country should have immigration laws and that having such laws means that it's all downhill from there with concentration camps coming soon. Well...countries have been enforcing their immigration laws for centuries and guess what? Nothing like the Holocaust has happened.
Worry about your own country. Maybe you should tell Canada that they need to do away with their immigration laws because they are going to end up like Nazi Germany.
Name one other country in the world, just one other one, that separates children from their parents of asylum seekers.
Just. One. Other. One.
And you are naive if you assume that the adults who brought these kids are their parents. Some of these kids are being trafficked. You don't care about that, do you? You want them left with the adults because they just have to be their parents, correct? Wow...just...wow.
You also know that many of these people don't have birth certificates or any valid form of ID.
That's why temporary separation happens. It takes time to verify if the child belongs to the adults that are with them. But then again, this has been explained to you over and over again ad nauseum. Why still harp on it?
If separating them helps save any child from being trafficked, then it is well worth it.
How would you feel if a child was allowed to stay with his/her trafficker and that child ended up being sold into prostitution or raped or killed?
Location: 23.7 million to 162 million miles North of Venus
23,610 posts, read 12,543,921 times
Reputation: 10479
Quote:
Originally Posted by normstad
Yes, Trump and his followers are doing EXACTLY that, demonizing a group of people.
Seems that you are the one doing the demonizing of groups of people -- "Trump and his followers"
Quote:
How many clips do you want me to get Dr. Google to serve up of exactly Trump doing that. You know they are there in spades.
No, after seeing the camps and the horrible campaign in Hungary this spring, me and my finance vowed that NEVER AGAIN means that no matter how small or how innocuous that groundwork is laid, it needs to be called out soon and often. I'm sorry if you can't see that, as it has nothing to do with being liberal or conservative.
In fact, for most of the post-war era, conservatives were well aware of this. Now? It appears not.
Oh my, you toured a couple of camps, that no one has been in for decades, and suddenly you're an expert. You can watch all of the videos, read all of the books, tour all of the camps and you still would not know what it is actually like, both beginning and during.
The following link has a video in it that you should watch. In that video is an actual Holocaust survivor who is telling people like you to "Grow Up", that what Trump is doing is nothing at all like Hitler's Germany. If anyone should know it would be this survivor, who has first hand experience.
People on the left love comparing Trump, and his followers, to Hitler and nazis. In doing so they are trivializing the pain and deaths of the many millions of people who had died at the hands of the real Hitler. I'm glad that the Jewish people have begun to say - Stop It!
They're not asylum seekers; they're illegal aliens. Asylum seekers are a different situation and the media has conflated both into one.
Wrong, and I have shown the difference in previous posts. Law and treaties requires asylum seekers to be treated properly, and that does NOT include separating families. The USA is breaking its own laws and the treaties it agree to by what they currently are doing.
Name me ONE other country in the world that does this. Just one. You can't.
Seems that you are the one doing the demonizing of groups of people -- "Trump and his followers"
Oh my, you toured a couple of camps, that no one has been in for decades, and suddenly you're an expert. You can watch all of the videos, read all of the books, tour all of the camps and you still would not know what it is actually like, both beginning and during.
The following link has a video in it that you should watch. In that video is an actual Holocaust survivor who is telling people like you to "Grow Up", that what Trump is doing is nothing at all like Hitler's Germany. If anyone should know it would be this survivor, who has first hand experience.
People on the left love comparing Trump, and his followers, to Hitler and nazis. In doing so they are trivializing the pain and deaths of the many millions of people who had died at the hands of the real Hitler. I'm glad that the Jewish people have begun to say - Stop It!
My parents and grandparents grew up under the Nazi's. I know their stories. First hand stories. Not trivalized ones. NEVER AGAIN shall those elements that caused that hate, that sorrow, that demonization of a human group ever be allowed to have even a foot hold. Anywhere we see it. In Hungary, in Poland, in Turkey, in the USA or anywhere else. Always, always, we will speak out and appeal to the humanitarian side of the populations.
And you are naive if you assume that the adults who brought these kids are their parents. Some of these kids are being trafficked. You don't care about that, do you? You want them left with the adults because they just have to be their parents, correct? Wow...just...wow.
You also know that many of these people don't have birth certificates or any valid form of ID.
That's why temporary separation happens. It takes time to verify if the child belongs to the adults that are with them. But then again, this has been explained to you over and over again ad nauseum. Why still harp on it?
If separating them helps save any child from being trafficked, then it is well worth it.
How would you feel if a child was allowed to stay with his/her trafficker and that child ended up being sold into prostitution or raped or killed?
See, this is exactly what I am talking about. You have swallowed hook, line and sinker the story that ALL or MOST of the segregated children are here because of human traffickers, when the actuality is that few to none are. Tell a lie often enough, and some people start believing it.
Apparently you fall in that group.
When a child cries out for it's papa or mama as they are separated, I have a pretty good idea it is not being trafficked. But that takes too much common sense, right. Oh, and a heart that cares.
Location: 23.7 million to 162 million miles North of Venus
23,610 posts, read 12,543,921 times
Reputation: 10479
Quote:
Originally Posted by normstad
My parents and grandparents grew up under the Nazi's. I know their stories. First hand stories. Not trivalized ones. NEVER AGAIN shall those elements that caused that hate, that sorrow, that demonization of a human group ever be allowed to have even a foot hold. Anywhere we see it. In Hungary, in Poland, in Turkey, in the USA or anywhere else. Always, always, we will speak out and appeal to the humanitarian side of the populations.
Because, it all started with a foothold.
So did my parents and grandparents. A part of my family was lost to the camps, too...not only adults but also young children. Not a one of them made it out alive.
The only one trivializing their pain and deaths is you and others like you. You're running on hate, for Trump, and not the truth.
So did my parents and grandparents. A part of my family was lost to the camps, too...not only adults but also young children. Not a one of them made it out alive.
The only one trivializing their pain and deaths is you and others like you. You're running on hate, for Trump, and not the truth.
I'm sorry that you don't see that a foundation is being set. I'm sorry you don't see that groups of people are being dehumanized (Trump "they're animals") and demonized (suggesting most are MS 13). That is setting the stage of fear. How can you NOT see that??
I don't think, I hope, that we will ever see the killing camps of the Nazi's, but we already have seen American citizens of Japanese descent but into concentration camps, haven't we. We already see children being taken away from their parents, and in many cases flown thousands of miles away, haven't we?
We've already seen a move to automatically deny asylum, haven't we? What next step are you OK with? Forced visual identifiers on asylum seekers? Continued incarceration for them? No other country in the world separates asylum seeker families nor incarcerates them. Not even those S(**** hole countries Trump talks about.
America used to be better than this. And yes, when one sees the foundation for further discrimination and inhumane treatment being set, one needs to say, NEVER AGAIN. You know why? Because if things advance, it will be too late.
See, this is exactly what I am talking about. You have swallowed hook, line and sinker the story that ALL or MOST of the segregated children are here because of human traffickers, when the actuality is that few to none are. Tell a lie often enough, and some people start believing it.
Apparently you fall in that group.
When a child cries out for it's papa or mama as they are separated, I have a pretty good idea it is not being trafficked. But that takes too much common sense, right. Oh, and a heart that cares.
I said no such thing. Stop trying to put words into my mouth. Never did I say that all or most were being trafficked.
How do you know that by calling out for his/her (not "it's"[sic]) mami or papi that they are calling for the adult they are with? Perhaps they were taken from their real parent(s) and are still calling for them.
I care about kids who are being trafficked. Why don't you care about them?
Do you seriously doubt that child trafficking never happens----that kids aren't being trafficked across the border?
Answer the question --- Do you think that kids should be allowed to stay with the adult they were with, no questions asked?
What are you doing about all of this besides whining? Have you gone down to the border and offered to take in some of these so-called asylum seekers? Time for you to put your money where your mouth is.
So did my parents and grandparents. A part of my family was lost to the camps, too...not only adults but also young children. Not a one of them made it out alive.
The only one trivializing their pain and deaths is you and others like you. You're running on hate, for Trump, and not the truth.
I'm sorry to hear what your family went through.
I can't rep you again but --- very well said.
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The US is a very generous country that allows 1 million legal immigrants per year to come here. Maybe you should educate yourself on other countries' immigration laws and how they treat illegal immigrants before you make such shameful and vile Holocaust analogies.