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Originally Posted by LearnMe
I don't equate emotions with critical thinking either.
However, emotions are what drives us to pursue the truth. I have a desire to know better why my opinions are justified, objectively speaking, and that emotion/desire causes me to lean toward critical thinking. At the same time I know that for others, their emotions prevent them from objective reason, critical thinking.
If we are honest, this is a challenge to some extent or another for all of us. Emotions are relevant. We simply need to understand how they play a part, objectively speaking. Politics, for that matter, is largely driven by emotion. We are fools to deny this. Wise to keep our emotions in check accordingly.
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No. That's false, emotions are not relevant. Your words, are part of a trendy problem with this nation. Think of it as a mental handicap placed upon others.
If you can sit here and tell me in person, straight faced, that emotions are valid I'd smile and say have a good day, and leave it at that and walk away laughing saying yup, another lemming.
Why?
Emotion sparks behavior as Originalist pointed out in their response to you.
If you are compelled by emotions, or seek to validate emotions, you literally are a problem to this nation. Period.
How? Why? Prime examples. Blind outrage over Donald Trump being president. You mean to tell me any rational logical individual would behave like an incessant toddler that got told no throwing a massive temper tantrum and Justify it by saying that's what you get for electing Donald Trump as if it's some sort of punishment? Nahhhhh..... Doesn't work that way.
Emotions are invalid and irrelevant. It's an attempt to enable even justify unhinged behaviors. Oh that's okay, we can discount this behavior that behavior because their feels are hurt, they are upset. It's okay. You disagree? You're intolerant!
No. Absolutely not okay. You are responsible for your behavior. Your behavior stems from your feelings. I refuse to relinquish any power to anyone, I can't be insulted nor offended. If anything I'm thoroughly entertained by whining, crying, rage filled shouting. It's not that I take pleasure in others pain, it's that others are too stupid to form a cogent argument and have to validate their emotions.
What it shows me, is how weak and feeble a person is that they can not contain their emotions. That they reason with spur of the moment decisions, here and now reaction, knee jerk responses. Not considering if this, then what will be 5 minutes from now, 5 hours from now, 5 days from now, 5 weeks from now, 5 months from now, 5 years from now, 5 decades from now. I won't enable anyone by validating their emotions. Period.
Especially gun control debates. Arguments are incompatible. Those that a pro gun argue logic and fact. Those that are anti gun/"common sense" argue emotion through conflation, guilt by association, and hide behind trendy catchy buzzwords.
Take for example the buzzword-Assault weapon LOL if you assault someone with your fist, your fist is the weapon. Does that become an assault weapon? Fits the buzz phrase to a T. Assault-Action. Weapon-Object. If you assault someone with any object, it becomes an assault weapon. I know, how inconvenient to invalidate the argument against gun control.
Gun violence. Another catchy trendy buzzword been tossed around since I was a kid.
Guns are incapable of thought and action. They require physical manipulation by a person. So make the bold statement gun violence is responsible for X deaths per year on average. Nope. Doesn't work that way, acts of negligence/irresponsibility like they were cleaning the gun and it just went off? That isn't violence. That's stupidity. Darwin award for never chamber checking the weapon.
Suicides don't count.
Homicides. That's what the scope of focus is when you say gun violence to someone that has more than 2 functioning brain cells.
Arguments pertaining to age to acquire. Well if you have to be 21 to buy a pistol or hand gun, then the same must apply to rifles and shotguns. False. What age does a person become a person? 2nd Amendment states, the right of the people. Not the right of 21 year olds.
Attack one civil liberty on the basis of fear and distrust in your fellow countryman/woman, you make a compelling argument to topple every other civil liberty. Like voting rights. Nobody can vote until they're 21. They cant be trusted to vote appropriately due to not being 21. They'll support communism, socialism, fascism. You don't have a 4th or 5th amendment right and shall be subject to cruel and unusual punishment with no right to an attorney for legal representation until age 21.
Machine guns. Dangerous and unusual.
No. What's dangerous and unusual are hyper hysterical emotionally driven people, with the desire to harm and kill others.
It is the person with Motive, Incentive, and Intent that needs addressing. Not the type of firearm, it's physical appearance, it's operation, it's capacity, nor it's caliber. Hence no legislation meaningful to prevent, deter, nor productive except to get 2 sides wanting to rip each other's tongues out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
I don't have much more in the way of time here, but I'm glad you are offering a bit more in the way of intelligent exchange instead of the usual garbage dumped in these threads...
Objectively speaking, you should be specific if you really want to substantiate your opinion. You make this statement about "arbitrary taxation," as if anyone should consider this fact.
I worked in the energy industry for the better part of my career, and I remember similar argument when the first efforts by the EPA came along to require cleaner-burning fuels. Nothing "arbitrary" about that. I grew up in the L.A. basin, and I still remember when my lungs hurt just from breathing in that smog on hot Summer days. Not long after the regulations came into being, it became far easier to breath in the area, but I had moved from there by then.
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Newsflash. LA is unique. It is its on unique problem for being in a geographical valley. Smog? That wasn't a problem else where. Big cities? Sure. LA is unique and not the model of America. I know that defies and goes against the grain of indoctrinated collectivist thought processes. LA /= rest of America. Not by a long shot.
So yes, it is arbitrary. If the EPA no, I'll do one better. If CARB was a legitimate entity, it would be tasked at filtering the air you breathed. Not pushing for further regulations through fines and taxation.
Same can be said about lake Okeechobee local to me. That's a unique problem in of itself and it should not be the rule for the rest of America. Politics irrelevant, neither side is going to do anything productive or meaningful about what's going on there. Oh let's burn through more vacant land and put reservoirs in. How about no.
Rick Scott can get federal funding. Do something meaningful then.
3 problems that contribute to that lakes algae problem.
1. Warm water.
2. Tributaries that feed the lake contaminated by pesticides (north end loaded with arsenic) and fertilizers(nitrides, phosphates etc)
3. Silt accumulating from the tributaries.
Want it fixed? No, under no circumstances should reservoirs be put into place. Period. None.
Step one. Secure federal funding. Step 2 instead of imposing fines against farmers, go in, dig, test soil and when you find a lack of contaminants you put in a clay barrier that depth plus 20% to be safe, build a berm about 3 feet high. Farmers fields flood? That's their problem now. They can put a pump house in and storage tanks in and use excess water for future use as irrigation.
You just stopped contaminants from farming operations from getting into the tributaries that feed the lake promoting algae growth
Step 3 throw down a clay or concrete bed out for the silt. Dredge the tributaries and the lake dump all the contaminated silt in that pit, toss in hemp seeds. Hemp cleans soil. I forget the college in NY but their botany program took dredged silt from the Hudson River and grew hemp in it and reduced PCB levels and other contaminants as well in the silt. After 2 or 3 crop rotations from the parent plants more contaminants were removed as the plants had adapted to the silt. Do the same down here. Can use the fibers as a replacement for fiberglass.
Step 4 put pumps in that lake with fountains to aerate the water and keep it from getting stagnant.
You want to try and cool the lake? A lake in a state, with a tropical climate with intense sun? How intense? Riding around for job interviews the couple days after arriving to Florida with no window tint, getting sun burn, that intense. Having the skin blasted off the tip of my nose and tips of my ears being outside in August for an 8 hour day, that intense.
Better put some massive reactors in to power cooling stations... There's no way in hell with how intense the sun is here, that you'll be able to cool that water without a massive cooling operation.
The reason I oppose the construction of reservoirs is, with the tributaries cleaned, lake dredged, no more algae infested water, that lake can be purged with no dire consequences.
The lake I lived literally 20 feet from, was ruined by cityiots rezoning it a residential area, banned waterfowl hunting and Canadian Geese proliferated chasing the mallards out and using it as their toilet. Water went from picturesque like a mirror save for when the bass jumped, that you could see to the bottom from my porch, to a green smelly swamp in just 2 years time. Never mind the obnoxious honking all hours of the night. Oh how I wanted to get a WW2 anti aircraft battery and knock them out with flak shells and quad 50s.
Useless bird. Greasy tough meat you absolutely have to put in a yogurt/milk and salt brine to make it remotely tender and less gamey tasting. Nope don't focus on that... go after my jetskis though. And any boat that had a gasoline engine. Because pollution. Try and pin the blame on farmers in the surrounding area, forced them to use the clay barriers around their fields where they were close to streams. But ignore the fact from November-April you can't see the surface of the lake just hordes of obnoxious worthless territorial prick birds using said lake as a toilet. That contributed not to just algae but to bacteria levels so high in the water DEC ENCON and the Health Department put warning signs up not to go in the water with open sores/cuts, not to drink the water, not to eat the fish caught in the lake.
Used to have acceptable amount of sea weed. Confined on one end of the lake. Afterwards? Forget it. That bird crap fueled the growth of it. Used to bind a troller motor and paddle boat up it would grow right to the surface then look like floating green/brown fuzzy spaghetti. Cue the sickle bar paddle wheel boats that had to trim it every twice a month and leave piles of it out in the fields stinking the place up. Dumping copper sulfate in to help combat it, followed by dead fish floating on top of the water.
Karma/poetic justice came with the geese pecking the cityiots designer ankle biter dogs, kids running around barefoot stepping in goose crap getting parasites/worms. Reap what you sow when you ended hunting an invasive species allowing it to proliferate.
The Do something! Crowd from the city know it alls that migrated to that area ruined that lake in short order. Think they would have learned from that error? Hell no. Sell the house to someone else from Joisey or Yangkahz and find another lake side area to build upon and repeat the same logical error again. I'd bet money on it. Cityiot liberals are that retarded they spread like a cancer a tumor. They ruin one area. Then flee to another to impose the exact same disastrous things for a second go around. Never learning from the first. Similar to what's happening here in Florida. Can't afford to retire in the north east? Move to Florida. Then vote for the same ideology that caused you to be burdened with taxes. Impose the same regulations you fled from, because that's how you did things back home. I side with native Floridians. If it's so good where you're from, why not stay there? Why come here and wreck the state? You'll only leave and move to another one to ruin. They're really a plague on society. Like a cancerous tumor. It just spreads. Latches onto a healthy tissue wreck it, move on to another. Wreck it.
I've only been telling people down here for 2 years now they need to work to change their states economy. Can't rely on Disney Tropicana and Tourism. All you get is remedial jobs for dirt wages. Get industry and technology here. Put some oil rigs off the coast. Guarantee rough necks on oil platforms make more than someone who serves a retiree food and drinks, services their HVAC system, or grooming their HOA as a landscaper. Political hacks on both sides double down on the dumb and claim we don't have the workforce to support it. BS. They have engineering schools down here that give RPI a run for its money. Those graduates go north for work. Or they came from the north for the education to return to the north for employment.
Alas. Nobody listens to me. Too concerned and caught up with that Salt Life, Muh Riverz! Tourism!
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
Then too, there was all the similar push-back about raising the cost of energy (the cost of gas at the pump), cost of travel, goods, etc. The oil companies came along with their better way to clean up their act (fuels), with MTBE, that proved a disaster. We've come a long way toward avoiding the mistakes that China is now struggling to overcome. Now all the EPA did to improve air quality back then is considered a "no brainer," at least for most people. Yet, people strongly objected back then, just like you are doing now, with the same old reasons.
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EPA didn't do a thing directly. The oil companies did. Your words exactly. If you want to give credit to the EPA. EPA then is responsible for the pollutants and their responsibility to clean it. Not the job of fuel companies and auto manufacturers. That's how you wind up to where we are today with a chit box trim sedan/work Truck 35k and fuel prices via taxes.
All they did was place a regulation and enforce it via fines for non compliance. They didn't do anything proactive nor hands on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
So please, be specific as to what the Paris climate accords attempted to accomplish and what you view as "arbitrary" let alone unjustified. There are always the oversteps, mistakes, but on the whole, we need to make better progress toward making our environment cleaner, certainly not even more dirty.
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I gave them to you. Not my problem if you ignored them or don't like them because it doesn't involve taxing it away or further restricting and regulating industires.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
My opinion, born of some emotion, because I care about my kids and their health/future in these regards.
And again, thanks for avoiding the bull crap...
I've got to sign off now and actually do something productive. Until tomorrow. Here's to cleaning up our act.
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I'm going to kick a hornets nest here.
Spare me the ChildrunzTM (trade mark) argument. The most feeble of emotionally compelled arguments. Want something banned? Want something passed? Shriek it's for the Childrunz. For once, just once, I would love to argue/debate without the incessant battle cry of the childrunz. You do nothing productive what so ever on that line of tripe but justify sheltering and coddling and breeding feeble lemmings.
Boomers do have a point in their generational poop flinging attacks about my generation-Millennials living at home with mom and dad in their 20s-30s. However, who raised them? Who spoiled them? Who sheltered them? Who educated them? Enabled them to double down on dumb life choices? Told them they absolutely needed to inherit a debt they can't default on in order to make it? Who told them on top of that they need 3-5 years worth of experience or take the 30-35k per year internship level job? Who indoctrinated them for a non existent utopia, thus causing their inability to cope with reality?
The boomers did. I had very few teachers who weren't boomers. I think a total of 4 between middle and high school.
Can't have a car devoid of 87 air bags Traction control stability control and ABS because The Childrunz and arbitrary safety regulations.
Hence the insane prices of new cars even before the tariffs. What? You think airbags are cheap? That it's free to develop yaw rate sensors and software to limit the performance of a vehicle based on input from wheel speed sensors and yaw rate sensors? All of that gets passed onto us, the consumer
keep calling for more and an econobox will be $50k.
Every vehicle I owned, I deactivated ABS. Unplugged the drivers airbag fooled the restrain control module via resistor that way the seat belt retractors would still function if in the event of a collision. All you really need is a 5 point race harness and bolstered seats. Not crumple zones. Not 87 air bags. Traction control. Stability control. ABS. Don't need it if you know how to drive.
Those regulations on the automotive industry are a double edged sword. They are a slap on the wrist for big manufacturers if they fail to comply. And protect them from me firing up Studebaker and Packard to compete with the likes of Ford/Lincoln. Chevy/Cadillac.
I could build a car the size of a Ford Focus in my garage. Sell it for 8500 dollars and make about 3k in profit. It would have a full perimeter frame. Rear wheel drive. Beneath the interior panels would look like the interior of one of my old stock cars. Instead of chintzy door latches, you'd have roll bars that stop at the door post, steel bars in the door, similar to how a safe is set up, that fit inside the roll bars. Doors would be reinforced. Once shut the door is one with the roll cage. You'd be able to take my Studebaker Champ, and blitz a suburban head on at 60 and total the suburban. And live. Unless it went up the hood and it's driveshaft became a harpoon through the windshield.
Manual gear box. Get 30 35+ MPG. It would not have air bags. Won't need them when you're strapped in secure with a 5 point harness. It would not have ABS. It would not have traction control. It would not have stability control. Nor the ability to pair a phone to the radio. It would not have rare earth metals in the exhaust catalyst. There are other ways to clean up the exhaust rather than using rare earth metals.
Problem is. Insurance companies are in bed with the Nanny state, they wouldn't insure them.
Can't have legal marijuana for all purposes because it's for the Childrunz. Grandma's/grandpa's medicine cabinet can be chock full of opioids though.
How dare you endorse the 2ND Amendment and believe in machine guns for everyone. Ban them! It's for the Childrunz!
Can't have lawn darts. It's for the Childrunz.
Can't have 3 wheelers. It's for the Childrunz. Can't operate a quad over 90cc unless you're 16 because it's for the Childrunz.
Makes a compelling case (and I'm a catholic) to end churches. Because priests molest kids. Shut down the church. It's for the Childrunz.
Ban highschool sports. They might get injured! It's for the Childrunz!
Ban everything. It's for the Childrunz! Society the environment it's all so scary. Ban it all. It threatens the Childrunz. Put them in bubbles and padded rooms!
No. I don't buy it. I saw through it as pure BS when I was a kid. I see right through it today.
Muh Childrunz is the most weakest invalid argument I have ever heard. It's justification for a nanny state. Deem something dangerous or unusual and say it's for the Childrunz. Condemn it and those that oppose or endorse/enjoy whatever it is that should be open to more arbitrary subjective regulation, paint them as monsters that are selfish, that don't care about kids.
It was like the first lock down drill I had in my highschool following 9/11. The day after we had a big meeting in the school's auditorium full of Q & A I went last.
My words exactly were "So let me get this straight. You're doing this, to protect us? Protect us from potential terrorists that want to bomb and shoot up schools correct?
Where is your logic huddling us on the floor like cattle before the slaughter 1, and 2 you will be allowing teachers to carry, right?" Damn near all of the air was consumed in one uproarious gasp. I can't tell if you're genuine or not here, because if someone's shooting the school up, if you don't have someone ready to put rounds on whoever comes through that door, that wooden door with a glass window which can easily be compromised, I can't take you serious in your efforts in saying it's for my safety. I don't buy it for one minute. You are either naive or plain stupid. After the alarm sounded it took 20 minutes before I heard sirens and screeching tires out in the parking lot. It was 45 minutes past the sounding of the alarm to hear boots stomping and the occasional bark from the K9s and shouting of Clear. 20 minutes to get police here. Really. You're going to protect me? Nah. I don't think so. That affords a terrorist a ton of time. Besides, you fools built this school right in front of a forest. No bullet proof glass? 270 degrees field of view from the forest of the playgrounds football field tennis court, track, and eastward facing wings including the glass cafeteria.
Following year we had 2 state troopers as SROs. And during summer at football captains practice they had arborists out back clearing tree limbs as to prevent a sniper from climbing the trees. Like that will stop someone determined... Idiots. Nope can't trust school faculty with the right to keep and bear arms to serve as a line of defense.
all of the feeble assumptions of a teacher being subdued their weapon taken and used against them, being enabled etc.
Okay. The militia can assemble and stand guard at entrances, maybe even perform foot patrols. No resounding no. Can't trust someone with good intentions to volunteer to stand armed to guard the schools. Just ban the guns and demonize ownership of firearms on multiple basis. Can't hunt with X. Like hell you cant.
Nobody needs x. Who are you to decide what need is? If you need a Cadillac rather than a Camry does that make you evil? Oh the state should facilitate and dictate what need is? That's communism. Trump is literally Hitler. So ban the guns. The most derptastic line of logic I have ever heard. If anything the feeble left should be taking advantage of salad days and buying while the prices are genuinely affordable if they're that convinced.
Never mind the fact personal responsibility is at play and is often over looked. Nope. Just ban it. It's for the Childrunz. Court of public opinion says-Nope. It's for the Childrunz you need more government to protect you from yourselves. It's for the Childrunz. That concerned? Put them in impervious space suits hooked to air filters at a sub micron level then. Problem solved.
I'd rather my kids grow up where they are responsible for their actions.
Where they accept the risks associated with freedom and plan accordingly rather than shelter them from reality in vain of their safety. Nope. I don't buy it. I didn't buy it as a kid. I don't buy it now. If anything it's given me cause to double down making a mockery out of the argument that is "Muh ChildrunzTM"
All it does is spawn busy bodies who would split a family up because oh dear they like something I don't and don't have the same values I do. Hurry CPS go capture those Childrunz! Put those bad parents in jail. They taught their kids different morals and values than what is "main stream".
As I said before. If you're that concerned about the air put them in space suits or get behind scientists developing ways to pull carbon out of the air and put to good use. Not through arbitrary regulations and taxes. But if you choose the space suit route, don't be surprised they wind up rebelling and defying. There's no reason for taxing and regulating any business or any industry because of global warming. None.
Why? Because that money received did not go towards .gov funded air filtration or water filtration. It's to generate income for .gov. Nothing more, nothing less in an attempt to sway and discourage the private sector from doing something that doesn't fitted the narrative or agenda.
That's not only immoral it's flat out stupid. Go on. Raise costs for manufacturing. Raise a tax on fuel.
What. You don't think the price of goods will skyrocket?
Get outta here with that nonsense.
And in typical fashion LOL someone will take this to the extreme with Lead pipes. Asbestos dust from brakes and clutches, toxic waste dumped into streams so on and so forth, and paint me as evil child hating etc etc because I hurt their feelz and declared them for what they are-feeble minded lemmings seeking protections from every imaginable boogey man there is.
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