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Pharma salesmen are the highest paid salesmen out of all careers. It is all by design and a racket.
The salesmen in other occupations sell directly to the consumer or business owner that will be paying for it.
With a Pharma salesmen, they bypass the consumer and sell it to the doctor that has no skin in the game and has a vested monetary interest in prescribing it.
There is so much misinformation on this thread I don't know where to start. Pharmacy reps are the highest paid salesmen according to whom? You? And you know this how? You have zero proof, you just say it because you hate medicine, right? My brother-in-law sells fancy playground equipment and he makes at least 5 times more than any of the pharmaceutical reps I've dealt with over the years. Once again, pharmaceutical companies do not sell medications to doctors.
They GIVE them samples of brand name drugs that are not yet available in generic. The doctor GIVES samples to the patient. They are not permitted to accept gifts from reps nor are they allowed to sell the samples to the patients. The patient tries the sample for free, tells the doctor whether it works, then the doctor writes the prescription based on this information. Who pays for the drug? The insurance company and the patient. If the drug is generic, docs don't have samples. They just write the script and the patient gets it much cheaper from the pharmacy and once again, it's a contract between insurance and patient. (Or just out of pocket).
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Originally Posted by nobodysbusiness
Can't wait for the doctor apologists to try to defend this.
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Originally Posted by Scooby Snacks
I can. It has been illegal for doctors to accept gifts from drug reps for years. I work in the medical field, so I know this for a fact. Another fail at medication bashing. Besides, that study you cited was several years old and correlation does not mean causation.
For those who frequently denounce "Big Pharma," I would love to know what you do when you develop diabetes, high blood pressure, cancer, or have surgery. Do you refuse all medications and hope your body fixes itself? I seriously doubt you do.
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Originally Posted by pknopp
I find it kinda amazing that someone (you) would still say something like this when it's easy to look and see how much doctors receive in gifts.
And the quote you listed had the last date as of 2016. As I posted upthread, it has been illegal for doctors to receive gifts from drug reps for years. And my point still stands. For those who denounce "Big Pharma," I assume you never, ever take any medication, right? Because if you do, it's pretty hypocritical for you to talk about how evil the pharmeceutical industry is. I'm not a fan of how ridiculously expensive our medications are today. But I do realize that without all the R&D that has gone into them, we would not have the amazing medications available that has offered us the ability to hugely prolong and improve our quality of life.
And the quote you listed had the last date as of 2016. As I posted upthread, it has been illegal for doctors to receive gifts from drug reps for years. And my point still stands. For those who denounce "Big Pharma," I assume you never, ever take any medication, right? Because if you do, it's pretty hypocritical for you to talk about how evil the pharmeceutical industry is. I'm not a fan of how ridiculously expensive our medications are today. But I do realize that without all the R&D that has gone into them, we would not have the amazing medications available that has offered us the ability to hugely prolong and improve our quality of life.
The link is missing one year. That's pretty common. I'm not interested in your diversionary point. I provided a source that shows you are wrong. You?
Well the study acknowledged that it did not separate deaths from legally prescribed medication and illicitly acquired ones. Here in NV doctors get slammed with pharmaceutical reps, perks and such all the time but it's not opioids that are getting pushed. Antidepressants and antibiotics are the biggies. Outside of actual pain specialists you can't get prescribed opioids here unless it's from a specialist post surgery.
It didn't say where the problem in this article is happening though I'm sure its in Appalachia somewhere. Kentucky WV Tennesee. The number of people ODing on managed medication programs is very low in comparison to illegal abuse. I'm not apologizing for doctors. Just looking at reality from my front porch.
At my doctors office, they have a big sign in the lobby...'WE WILL NOT PRESCRIBE ANY OPIOID MEDICATION FOR ANY REASON'.
The ER is the same, they will not give out narcotic medication, not even Vicodin (which is pretty weak).
How are the pharma companies and doctors, the bad guys, when there are so many restrictions placed on these drugs? Normally, when companies are trying to profit off these kinds of things, they make them as easy to obtain as possible..?
At my doctors office, they have a big sign in the lobby...'WE WILL NOT PRESCRIBE ANY OPIOID MEDICATION FOR ANY REASON'.
The ER is the same, they will not give out narcotic medication, not even Vicodin (which is pretty weak).
How are the pharma companies and doctors, the bad guys, when there are so many restrictions placed on these drugs? Normally, when companies are trying to profit off these kinds of things, they make them as easy to obtain as possible..?
Just because you note that some local hospital does something, does not make a larger point. As I noted earlier, my daughters orthodontist proscribed her some.
Just because you note that some local hospital does something, does not make a larger point. As I noted earlier, my daughters orthodontist proscribed her some.
I bet they didnt prescribe many and probably vicodin or another fairly weak opiate.
After the 2012 laws, around here, prescription opioids skyrocketed in price (when you could find any), a single Oxycodone 30mg was going for $60-80.(normally it was $1 per mg). Every addict I knew made the switch to heroin when pills became too expensive, I knew about 10-12 dealers back then, and they all had LOTS of heroin at that time, One of them I had known since high school, she was having SO MUCH heroin pushed on her, she didnt think she could get rid of it, its almost like her dealers and theirs above them, and so on, knew this was coming and they were prepared...that first week when those prescription drug laws took effect, she barely got any sleep, she was working 16 hours a day, she made close to $28K in one week (from heroin alone)!!
Pharmaceutical companies spend money on direct marketing to doctors -- even more than they do on research and development -- because they strongly believe it works, said Dr. Adams Dudley, a pulmonologist and professor with the University of California, San Francisco.
No, they do not spend more on marketing than R&D. The numbers being used for marketing also include other expenses. The comparison seems dishonest to me.
The pharmaceutical and device industry in 2015 paid about $2.4 billion to almost 450,000 out of more than 933,000 doctors, the researchers found.
The money included $1.8 billion in general payments to doctors, $544 million for ownership interests like stock options and partnership shares, and $75 million in payments for research efforts, the study reported.
The ProPublica link I gave lets you see exactly where that money went. The vast majority of payments were for meals that cost less than $20. Should those who do research not get paid?
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Originally Posted by pknopp
They don't have to be. Only those who sold them after the fact need to be. I've heard people "joke" about this all the time. We have a large box here in town at the city building where people can bring their drugs they didn't take. They joke quite often about what they could have got on the streets.
Do we know that the people who overdosed got drugs from patients of the doctors who got "gifts and payments"? If not, causation cannot be shown.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp
I find it kinda amazing that someone (you) would still say something like this when it's easy to look and see how much doctors receive in gifts.
A modest meal is pretty much all that is allowed now. No coffee mugs, pens, post-it notes, or expensive trips.
The really large payments are for people who invented medical devices or equipment or sold the right to manufacture a new drug. Some are payments for giving talks. Should someone who takes time off from seeing patients to do that not get compensated?
A modest meal is pretty much all that is allowed now. No coffee mugs, pens, post-it notes, or expensive trips.
The really large payments are for people who invented medical devices or equipment or sold the right to manufacture a new drug. Some are payments for giving talks. Should someone who takes time off from seeing patients to do that not get compensated?
There are plenty of trips listed. There are no regulations concerning what are expensive trips or modest meals.
All the same they are "gifts" and I was countering the statement that gifts were made illegal. They were not.
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