Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
$500-$3000+ televisions? Who? No one I know. Yeah, we've got a few flat screen TVs. They were like $200 each tops and we haven't replaced them in years and probably won't for years. You can get a flat screen TV pretty cheap at Walmart, you know.
Smart phones vs. "flip phones"?? Are you serious right now? You can get a very basic Android smart phone (a Go Phone) for like $20. That's what my teenagers have had. Who is buying a $600-1,000 iThingie?? Not us!
VACATIONS?? ROFL-FREAKING-MAHAAAOOO! Oh god. We haven't had a family vacation in....*thinks*...seven years. No, not even to the local Howard Johnson with a pool.
I drove my van for 14 years.
And some people talking about 3,000 square foot homes, or 5,000 square foot? What the hell? What kind of rich people are you talking about? At my most prosperous, with the benefit of my ex husband's VA loan (otherwise we'd have NEVER owned a home) our house was 2,798 square feet and oh my god we thought we were living in the lap of luxury in that house. Now I rent a 1,800 square foot townhome, and before that I was in a 980 square foot apartment. Still feel like I'm doing ok.
5,000 square feet though? I mean lol what? Do you even have any concept of how big a house that is? I mean surely anyone who lives in a house that big is doing really well and damn well knows it.
No it is not just out of control material greed that is making it hard for families to get by. One of the main things is the cost of education, and the notion that you MUST have a college degree or you're just a bozo burger flipper who shouldn't be allowed to live life like and independent adult with any dignity. We are starting to get a LITTLE attention focused in on the trades, but not enough. Everybody thinks they need college, we're often told we do, and it costs such a fortune that it tends to put people in debt well into middle age. The inflation of college costs is psychotic.
Then there is housing. There are more empty, vacant homes than there are homeless people in this country by far but damned if we'd let anybody have anything without paying that pound of flesh for it and damned if we're gonna lower the costs by even a tiny bit either. Rather have a house sit empty, or more likely put it through property management and make it a rental. Hell, who can afford to buy anyhow? People are too busy paying off their student loans to try and save up a down payment on a house, and you can't buy a house without one unless...military.
Don't get me started on the military.
They will never have to draft anyone again. Just have a great big class of desperate people with no better prospects, you will never have a shortage of volunteers. We can wage war on the whole world forever, so long as there's a GI Bill and a VA Loan in it for our soldiers.
Yes, those at the top are hoarding wealth and siphoning off enough of the value of American productivity that it's affecting society. Yes, they were able to do this partially due to women joining the workforce, but there's a whole lotta deregulation and cronyism that had to happen, too.
And the other end of the Great Scam...is debt. We can cut our teeth on student loans...but like what if you can't pay your taxes? The IRS says you should consider getting a loan. With people not able to make enough to create savings to cover any kind of emergency, the ONLY way to handle an emergency is to borrow. So middle class folks are stuck forever paying off the last crisis, rather than preparing for the next one. Dental work? Car trouble? Victim of a crime? Job loss? Illness, accident or injury? Kid needs glasses? I am sitting here listening to my coworkers sometimes talk about how they paid for private tutors or private schools for their kids, they got their kids cars, they put their kids through college. Must be nice. Not this single Mom. The next generation of my family will have to take on debt to get started. I can't help.
And you know it's crazy because I earn almost six times what I did when I entered the workforce 22 years ago. When I consider what I make, I feel like I'm doing really well, or I should be. Yet somehow it is never enough.
And I track my finances meticulously, not a penny moves though my life without it being logged in a spreadsheet and categorized to within an inch of its life. 78% of what I spend is what I consider "strictly necessary." Bills, groceries, gas. The other 22% is like, books, art supplies occasionally, fast food for us once in a while, celebration of holidays. I don't think that's wildly out of line? Maybe it is.
But $3,000 computers (HA) and 3,000 square foot homes and TRIPS??
I mean. Seriously people. What?
Regarding the bolded text, above. That's a conscious individual choice. Either one CHOOSES to live below one's means and save for various purposes, including emergency expenses, or one doesn't.
Women should work just like the men. The days of a woman staying home is way over. It takes two to pull the load anymore. Some women make even more than their husbands. Women are smart and they know this.
Agreed. I out earn my husband as well. Personally, for me, there were two primary concerns. If a person is educated and well skilled a several year absence could unrecoverable. And there is also the concern of unknowns in the future (cancer, death, job loss, etc).
I have several times, the main culprit is housing. And the fact that nobody wants to live in the ghetto, so they will spend as much as they have to on housing in order to not live in the ghetto
Yes and this is tied to school districts for parents. People will take a tiny home in a good district over a mansion in ghetto any day of the week. So, the 5000 sq ft home, 10 flat screen TV narrative is nonsense.
$500-$3000+ televisions? Who? No one I know. Yeah, we've got a few flat screen TVs. They were like $200 each tops and we haven't replaced them in years and probably won't for years. You can get a flat screen TV pretty cheap at Walmart, you know.
Smart phones vs. "flip phones"?? Are you serious right now? You can get a very basic Android smart phone (a Go Phone) for like $20. That's what my teenagers have had. Who is buying a $600-1,000 iThingie?? Not us!
VACATIONS?? ROFL-FREAKING-MAHAAAOOO! Oh god. We haven't had a family vacation in....*thinks*...seven years. No, not even to the local Howard Johnson with a pool.
But $3,000 computers (HA) and 3,000 square foot homes and TRIPS??
I mean. Seriously people. What?
Well, I am with you on the TV's.
But what is the meaning of life? Everyone should have vacations and the lack of such is probably the cause of much of the angst and stress we are feeling in the USA.
What you describe is indentured servitude. I cannot imagine my life without having gone to camp (summers off) for many years and then hitchhiking across the country...and then taking the kids camping and to museums and even Florida and the Islands. Skiing, snowboarding...etc.
We had a beach house too...and a boat (we bought a duplex so the rent from the other side paid most the mortgage).
We used to go to Club Med for a week each year. We'd meet many people there for all over the world. At lunch one day, a German couple sitting at our table asked us how long we were there for. When we told them one week their mouth dropped open. "Our doctors tell us the body and mind don't fully slow down until 10 days in". You know, lots of studies have shown the same.
More power to you if you love the Salt Mines that much. But that's not the modern life desired by a lot of people. A work/life balance is much more important to some...and I think they have a point.
Location: Live:Downtown Phoenix, AZ/Work:Greater Los Angeles, CA
27,606 posts, read 14,680,307 times
Reputation: 9169
Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72
Yes..it's an interesting concept and ..and ties into one of the paradoxes of the capitalism/Ronald Reagan worshipping right winger who tells everyone they should stop spending (lot of em around here).
Oh, those OTHER people should spend. You shouldn't because you are a LOSER who needs to tighten their bootstraps and buy rice and beans by the ton, and get your entertainment from the public library we also hate because it's run by liberals.
The best example is cars. It seems every financial expert says buy used cars only.
Well, if everyone only bought used cars, the car manufacturers wouldn't sell any new cars, would all go out of business; which in addition to adding millions to the unemployment rolls, would also dry up the supply of used cars and in say 30 years, it would be like Cuba, where we are using chicken wire and elbow grease to keep expensive 40+ year old cars running....
No, people garnering wealth via capital gains from real estate are profiteering on ether. That erroneously drives up prices without value. We saw the impact of that during the last recession. It's not sustainable, hasn't been, and that's not going to change.
Add an income from working on top of that. Now you've created an entire class of people that can drive inflation up even higher as they can afford to pay more for everything.
Quote:
All we're going to see, instead, is people not wanting to work while telling others to live within their means even if that means a cardboard box because they are sucking the value out of wages.
So... your premise is for the older generation to keep their higher level higher-paying jobs, effectively shutting out those younger than themselves? That's incredibly short-sighted and foolish.
Here's what happens in your world of everyone working until their dying day...
Quote:
You have your eye on that corner office, because, sure, the Baby Boomer occupant will soon retire, won’t he?
Don’t hold your breath on that. Sorry.
That is the reality in today’s workplace as - increasingly - it becomes plain that the Baby Boom generation has turned its back on the belief that 65 is the right time to retire. Leading edge Boomers now are 70 (the generation is usually dated as 1946 - 1964), and the youngest are 51. Boomers, definitely, hold a lot of the most senior and best paying jobs in the workplace.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
44,722 posts, read 81,641,337 times
Reputation: 58064
I don’t remember any single income families since my parents, in the 1950s. That was back when wives stayed home to take care of the kids, and clean the house. Surely we don’t want to go back there. We both worked since we met in 1973. Despite being able to manage on just my income, my wife has always liked her work, and the additional income is certainly nice to have. Not all couples both work because they have to. I know one family where the husband has a very successful business, but the wife works for the company healthcare plan.
The best example is cars. It seems every financial expert says buy used cars only.
Well, if everyone only bought used cars, the car manufacturers wouldn't sell any new cars, would all go out of business; which in addition to adding millions to the unemployment rolls, would also dry up the supply of used cars and in say 30 years, it would be like Cuba, where we are using chicken wire and elbow grease to keep expensive 40+ year old cars running....
Cuba is a communist paradise though!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
