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View Poll Results: Who Belongs on Public Roadways?
Only Motor Vehicles 34 36.17%
Motor Vehicles, Bicyclists, and Pedestrians 60 63.83%
Voters: 94. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-15-2008, 10:35 AM
 
392 posts, read 1,859,118 times
Reputation: 297

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Quote:
Originally Posted by silas777 View Post
I would never hit one, although I have had one scream at me for being too close and my dog scared the you know what out of him! so I slowed down to where he had a choice between my mirror or the ditch, he chose the ditch! An H1 is very wide, I am not about to get into a head on with oncoming traffic because some cyclist believes he owns the road.
So you purposely tried to injure someone that was fully within their legal right and are also proud that your dog scared them? What a man!! What a symbol of manhood, I am impressed! I can only imagine how tough you are without a Hummer and a dog.
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Old 04-15-2008, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Bike to Surf!
3,078 posts, read 11,065,699 times
Reputation: 3023
Quote:
Originally Posted by silas777 View Post
I would never hit one, although I have had one scream at me for being too close and my dog scared the you know what out of him! so I slowed down to where he had a choice between my mirror or the ditch, he chose the ditch! An H1 is very wide, I am not about to get into a head on with oncoming traffic because some cyclist believes he owns the road.
Ha ha. That's a funny story.

However, I'm guessing that this is a made-up story. I would think that most people would have better sense than to openly confess to an assault with a deadly weapon on a public message board.

What some drivers don't seem to realize is that they have clearly-visible liscense plates, very specific makes and models of vehicles, which are easily identified, and they tend to drive around and park in the same areas, at the same times, day after day.

As a commuter cyclist, I came to recognize abusive and wrekless drivers and their cars, even if they might not have recognized me. Now, I've got a pretty long fuse, I rode on a designated bike lanes, made space whenever safe and possible, and only took the lane with it was absolutely required for safety. I hardly ever was bothered and then most people who thought they'd vent on the cyclist in the bike lane did no worse than occasionally honk or shout, which bothered me not in the least. I just took note of their car, liscense plate, and occasionally what street address they parked at and their vin number just in case they ever got too aggressive. I keep a little book of notes on the various vehicles and drivers just in case I ever needed it in a civil court case or when filing a criminal complaint.
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Old 04-16-2008, 04:06 AM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,232 posts, read 46,663,996 times
Reputation: 11084
In Florida, bicycles belong on the road, not the sidewalk. I really can't comment on whether or not that's a good thing, since I never learned to ride a bike.
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Old 04-16-2008, 08:12 AM
 
Location: Marshall-Shadeland, Pittsburgh, PA
32,620 posts, read 77,624,272 times
Reputation: 19102
Quote:
Originally Posted by sponger42 View Post
Ha ha. That's a funny story.

However, I'm guessing that this is a made-up story. I would think that most people would have better sense than to openly confess to an assault with a deadly weapon on a public message board.

What some drivers don't seem to realize is that they have clearly-visible liscense plates, very specific makes and models of vehicles, which are easily identified, and they tend to drive around and park in the same areas, at the same times, day after day.

As a commuter cyclist, I came to recognize abusive and wrekless drivers and their cars, even if they might not have recognized me. Now, I've got a pretty long fuse, I rode on a designated bike lanes, made space whenever safe and possible, and only took the lane with it was absolutely required for safety. I hardly ever was bothered and then most people who thought they'd vent on the cyclist in the bike lane did no worse than occasionally honk or shout, which bothered me not in the least. I just took note of their car, liscense plate, and occasionally what street address they parked at and their vin number just in case they ever got too aggressive. I keep a little book of notes on the various vehicles and drivers just in case I ever needed it in a civil court case or when filing a criminal complaint.
This is a very good idea. I've been making a mental note myself of vehicles that are habitually illegally parked on the sidewalks in the few parts of town that DO have sidewalks. I plan to take a pen and paper along with me next time to make a list of all of the license plate numbers along with camera phone pictures of the offending parties so that I can submit it to borough council and/or the police department in order for all of these dozens of vehicle owners to receive proper citations for violating borough ordinances prohibiting obstructing sidewalks with vehicles. If I get the reputation as "Paul Brockovich," then so be it. I'm tiring of vehicle owners feeling as if they "own" the roadways, shoulders, AND sidewalks. If you're too poor to afford to purchase a home with off-street parking available, then either get rid of your car or downsize to an apartment or smaller home WITH off-street parking available. It's sheer idiocy.
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Old 04-16-2008, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Marshall-Shadeland, Pittsburgh, PA
32,620 posts, read 77,624,272 times
Reputation: 19102
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
Wide shoulders, sidewalks and bicycle paths all cost money that comes from the local road budget. Usually there is very little money for necessary repairs let alone the things that would increase the safety for motorists and other users. If folks want more than minimum they can vote to increase taxes enough to pay for them. Perhaps requiring road-using bicycles to pay a road use/license fee would be a way to fund the improvements.
I don't understand why sidewalks and shoulders aren't included as part of the "bare minimum" when developers ARE hacking away at our open space to build new residential areas though. If you look at Google Earth or Microsoft Virtual Earth and zoom around many Denver suburbs (including Louisville, CO), you'll see that every little cul-de-sac has sidewalks lining them, and every subdivision has biking/walking paths interconnecting them and linking them to other areas in order to make these suburban areas feasible to be accessible for motorists, bicyclists, recreational runners, pedestrians, joggers, etc. Are Pennsylvanians just "dumber" than Coloradoans when it comes to urban planning or what?

By the way, I live in a state with an outrageously high gas tax (which is probably why our fuel prices of around $3.41/gallon are amongst the highest outside of CA right now), yet our roads are so littered with potholes that many are barely passable. Obviously fuel taxes, car registration fees, etc. are NOT going to maintain roadways, so what ARE they being spent on?
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Old 04-16-2008, 08:34 AM
 
Location: Camberville
15,866 posts, read 21,445,747 times
Reputation: 28211
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
Wide shoulders, sidewalks and bicycle paths all cost money that comes from the local road budget. Usually there is very little money for necessary repairs let alone the things that would increase the safety for motorists and other users. If folks want more than minimum they can vote to increase taxes enough to pay for them. Perhaps requiring road-using bicycles to pay a road use/license fee would be a way to fund the improvements.
What about people who want to walk safely on a sidewalk without being hit by a bicyclist who should be on the road? Should we pay higher taxes on our tennis shoes? License to walk?
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Old 04-20-2008, 03:43 PM
 
Location: Duluth, Minnesota, USA
7,639 posts, read 18,127,435 times
Reputation: 6913
A few observations here:

1. I live "out in the country" in northern Minnesota about 4 miles from the nearest "town" (Proctor, Minnesota) and a little bit farther (about 7 miles biking or walking) from the city limits of Duluth (pop. 85,000), which is the hub of my metro area. During the warmer months, like many, I bike. I also walk along the county roads / highways by where I live.

2. The country highways here are generally safe for cyclists and walkers. Those that don't have shoulders generally are low-traffic; most of any serious level of traffic have shoulders, which are mostly respected by motorists. I feel very safe when driving on these roads. Also, very, very rarely if ever have I been shown any disrespect as a cyclist on them.

3. The same county roads generally have sidewalks when they enter an area of any real density. Out here in "the country", quite a few still walk the shoulder-less roads, but not as many as I'd think. As a motorist, the only thing that annoys me is when these people occasionally walk two or even three-abreast.

4. It seems like in many parts of the country, well-travelled suburban streets do not have sidewalks. This is ridiculous. It should be made mandatory that EVERY development, unless the smallest ones with narrow streets, contain sidewalks, if only for fitness reasons.

5. In the city, I generally don't have any trouble biking on the streets. If it's a narrow residential street where going 15 mph is not slow, but reasonable, than I'll bike in the center of the street. On most arterials I'll try to get to the side of the road to permit motorists to pass. Only once in a while do motorists criticize me or yell at me. One time a woman yelled at me for not using a turn signal, and I remember last summer / fall twice somebody yelled at me for simply being on the road. But that's very rare.
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Old 04-21-2008, 07:51 AM
 
78 posts, read 105,854 times
Reputation: 16
bikes and pellpe should not be ni roads its easier to not have to worry about cross walk with people. why cant u just drive like a normal person gee good idea right lol.;
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Old 04-21-2008, 02:37 PM
 
55 posts, read 198,308 times
Reputation: 40
One thing i cant fathom is how often i see a bicyclist riding down the middle of the street when there is a perfectly good sidewalk there... WTF

you are NOT an automobile, so unless you have no choice but to ride on the road, i suggest you get off or next time my tire starts scraping at the back of your bike, you will learn your lesson than

damn lance armstrong wannabes in your nasty skintight spandex slowing me down when i try and drive
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Old 04-21-2008, 02:48 PM
 
Location: Cleveland
4,669 posts, read 4,980,348 times
Reputation: 6028
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScranBarre View Post
No. If the road is too narrow for you to safely pass the bicyclist, then you just stop being in such a rush, suck it up, and wait until oncoming traffic clears so you can veer across the yellow line and then back into your own lane.
This hypocrisy is why no one will ever take you seriously on this issue. You tell people to take time out of their day just so you can run, telling them to "suck it up." However, sucking it up doesn't seem to be one of your strong points, as evidenced by your refusal or failure to:

-move somewhere walkable
-buy a membership to a nearby gym
-run on the treadmill in your own house
-run on your street
-run during hours during which the road is less busy
-pursue other solutions that I didn't think of in the 90 seconds it took me to dash off this post

I don't like the auto-centric lifestyle any more than you do. But I did something about it. I made sure to get a job in a major city, moved to a neighborhood with lots of sidewalks, and lived life. As for the people who didn't want to live life like me, I left them alone. I didn't go trying to change the laws so they could take time out of their commute every day to wait for me to run.

People are "in such a rush" because they want to live life. They want to get their business done so they can spend time with their friends and families. Is that really something to be so bitter and dismissive about?
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