Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW) - yay, or nay? (marriages, billion)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I dont necessarily believe failing relationships are on the rise. The ability to remove yourself from a failed relationship has increased. People have always been stuck in bad relationships there just wasn't any recourse.
You are failing to understand the psychology that has taken place in recent years. And while I have often emphasized the role of unfair laws, a lot of the problems have nothing to do with institutions or government.
Take social-media for example. What effects does social-media have on relationships? What about apps like Tinder?
You should watch this video called "Paradox of Choice".
It is true that people were often "stuck in bad relationships". But how does "being stuck" affect your perception of your relationship?
Let us pretend that you are "stuck" with your car. Would you treat it differently than if you could swap it out for a new model every few months?
In the above video, he explains how the more choices you have, the less happy you are, because when you have more choices, you have more wrong choices, but not more right choices.
In this video he discusses the phenomenon as well. And adds the aspect of "being able to change your mind".
Basically, if we have to make a decision and we are stuck with that decision, we are far more-likely to believe we made the right decision. But if we can change our minds as much as we want, we become far less-happy with our decisions.
There is a strong-correlation between marital-happiness and the number of sexual-partners a woman has had. The fewer lifetime sexual-partners, the happier the woman. With women having only one sexual partner being significantly-happier.
No one wants to be stuck in a bad relationship. So in the past, people often compromised because they basically had to. But now that you can leave at any time plus alimony plus child-support, why compromise?
I could name a dozen other causes of the high relationship failure-rate. For instance, in the distant past, people often knew each other most of their lives. You would marry someone from your church, or from some small town where you knew everyone, and they all knew you. And you tended to live closer to your family, so they were much more involved.
But regardless of the cause, I don't think you're going to be able to put that genie back in the bottle. Nothing can be done.
Last edited by Redshadowz; 04-18-2019 at 03:29 PM..
MGTOW aren't incels. And it is MGTOW who kicked the "wah-men" to the curb.
Somehow every "past-their-prime" ex-girlfriend found this thread and is trying to win the debate by questioning our manhood. Typical.
Well I may be a past prime ex-girlfriend but also a happy wife. If I got divorced or widowed I would not be opposed to marrying again. My past -prime friend found the best guy in the world for her and they are happily married. So good things do happen.
Some of my gen Z relatives seem pretty gung-ho on marriage. I don't know if it is a bit of a resurgence of conservatism but they want to get married and buy property and have kids (just like old dayz), we are telling them to slow down and don't jump into anything too fast. I try to pass wisdom of experience down to them but they will do what they will do.
You are failing to understanding the psychology that has taken place in recent years. And while I have often emphasized the role of unfair laws, a lot of the problems have nothing to do with institutions or government.
Take social-media for example. What effects does social-media have on relationships? What about apps like Tinder?
You should watch this video called "Paradox of Choice".
In the above video, he explains how the more choices you have, the less happy you are, because when you have more choices, you have more wrong choices, but not more right choices.
In this video he discusses the phenomenon as well. And adds the aspect of "being able to change your mind".
Basically, if we have to make a decision and we are stuck with that decision, we are far more-likely to believe we made the right decision. But if we can change our minds as much as we want, we become far less-happy with our decisions.
But regardless of the cause, I don't think you're going to be able to put that genie back in the bottle. Nothing can be done.
Well, the genie can definitely be in the bottle...it's all personal choice. Indians still often prefer arranged marriages, which tend to work out better than "choice".
Many groups in the USA, like the Amish, tend to follow relatively older ways. They may have a cell phone and maybe even limited Social Media, but they don't buy the BS.....
Social Media, IMHO, is exactly as Linus says....poison. I say that as someone deeply involved with forming and running some of the early online (and offline) communities. What people think of today as "social media" is anything but.....the newer version of it is more like a drug, one with 90% negative effects.
We can blame lack of education and our system (largely unregulated capitalism and consumerism and materialism) for much of this. People don't understand that Paradox of Choice. Dollars to Donuts that the people listening or watching a talk about it ALREADY KNOW about it...that is, those who need to learn this stuff aren't watching Ted Talks, but Fox News or Facebook or Twitter.
So much is basic common sense. Yet many people truly confuse 120 types of toothpaste to choose from as being "a free market". Taking this "free market" to an extreme, most of our society would sit around all day drugging, drinking and having sex while ordering more GrubHub.
Without a creed human beings are lost. The modern world doesn't give us many touchstones. You have to roll your own.
Although it may seem easier for many to "go along to get along" and try to be like everyone else (part of popular culture or some tribe), this is actually the hard way. It's much more pleasurable to carve your own path.
So, yes, I somewhat agree - it's more Madison Avenue and "Selling the Dreams" that causes people to become isolated and unhappy.
After all, isn't LOVE a Subaru? If I want to be athletic, can I do so with a "sports" car? If I picture myself as practical AND an athlete, isn't a "Sport Utility Vehicle" what I should look at?
Of course, this is a big joke since such a vehicle is the polar opposite of true utility...although the excess profits made over a sedan, minivan or basic PU are definitely of utility.
And so, people keep buying bigger and bigger cars and driving them on bigger and bigger roads....with bigger and bigger traffic jams. Then they go to a bigger and bigger store.....a "warehouse" store, which is much further away down those bigger roads in that bigger "Sport Utility"....
And on and on and on. And they don't even realize that they are doing it...after all, the other apes are doing the same thing so it must just be how life is. Right?
MGTOW aren't incels. And it is MGTOW who kicked the "wah-men" to the curb.
Somehow every "past-their-prime" ex-girlfriend found this thread and is trying to win the debate by questioning our manhood. Typical.
You're insults are missing the mark. Plenty of the women on this thread are in relationships or happily married.
I hardly think your constant name calling adds to the gravitas you are trying for MGTOW and the rest of your brethren.
Hurling inaccurate accusations adds to the embarrassment.
__________________ ____________________________________________
My posts as a Mod will always be in red.
Be sure to review Terms of Service: TOS
And check this out: FAQ
Moderator: Relationships Forum / Hawaii Forum / Dogs / Pets / Current Events
At what point are the odds so low, and the costs of failure so high, that something ceases to be worth pursuing?
You're moving the goalposts, now.
So can we assume that the odds are not stacked against young men, specifically, then?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz
In the distant past, the failure-rate of relationships was nearly 0%. Now the failure-rate is nearly 100%(for the average young person).
Please cite your data source for this claim.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz
Or put it another way, a hundred years ago the average length of a sexual-relationship was probably 30 years or more. Today the average length of a sexual-relationship is little more than a one-night stand. And for those who have more than just one night together, the average relationship lasts two years.
Relationship != marriage. There go those goalposts again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz
If she gets knocked up, it is child-support, alimony, and fighting with her "new boyfriends". At least if you're not the one stuck with some "proud single-mother", raising someone else's kids.
Objection. Assuming facts not in evidence, your honor. I don't and never have paid my ex-wife alimony. My brother pays no alimony. My wife never received alimony from her first husband. Child support? Sure. Why would you expect to father a child and then bear no financial responsibility for that child?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz
Here is your "modern woman". I'll pass, thanks anyway.
Good for you. I'm repeating myself, but your worldview is not the majority worldview.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
