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Old 05-12-2019, 10:14 AM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,888,434 times
Reputation: 20030

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Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Just one small lake that you can't see at the top of a small hill near here can generate more than a GW.....

And "conservatives" can't understand such things???? Amazing. I say we dunk them in crude oil and feather them...or, give them the choice of that or sitting up on the hill overlooking the river and having a beer?

Which one will they choose for themselves and their kids? You'd have to be a fiction writer to imagine people cheering against all the good things...and for the negatives! Yet, it happens. I'm thinking some crazed meth-addled Russian Fiction Writer may have had an influence on some of these folks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northf...icity_facility)

us conservatives understand a lot more than you realize, and give us credit for. but we also realize that we will need every form of energy we have right now as we transition to renewable energy sources as our primary source of energy. we cannot just make the conversion all at once.


right now solar panels are far to inefficient to do a proper job. and the current crop of wind turbines are huge and ugly on the landscape, as well as being far to inefficient to do the job properly.


but new technologies being developed show promise. for instance i read about a possible wind energy source that would look natural, and be very efficient in generating electricity. i am talking about using piezoelectric rods that would look like grass, and generate electricity even in mild winds, and wont have to be shut down in very high winds, including hurricane force winds.


and there are problems with hydroelectric power, or do you think that fish and other aquatic creatures dont count?
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Old 05-12-2019, 10:46 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,284,461 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post


i have. my paternal grandfather suffered from black lung disease from working in the coal mines. he became a train engineer after that running trains that hauled coal to market. but that was in the 30s when rebreather, and other technologies were not available to miners to protect their health.


modern air filtering technology, among other things will help greatly, as will modern medical treatments. and we can go further as well with robotic technology to mine the coal, already in use by the way, to eventually eliminate having people go under ground to mine coal. they would just need to go down to repair the technology as necessary.
People are still getting sick. On top of that the operators built up millions upon millions in fines they ignore until they get sold or file bankruptcy. Our own governor is finally being held accountable for his millions in fines.

They ignore the clean ups they are required to do until they file bankruptcy and argue for the taxpayers clean it up.

If we actually held the coal mines accountable, costs would skyrocket and people would demand a replacement.
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Old 05-12-2019, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Pacific 🌉 °N, 🌄°W
11,761 posts, read 7,271,536 times
Reputation: 7528
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
it is a scam.
Prove it's a scam and while you're at please provide us with any peer-reviewed papers to support your assertion.
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Old 05-12-2019, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Pacific 🌉 °N, 🌄°W
11,761 posts, read 7,271,536 times
Reputation: 7528
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
People are still getting sick. On top of that the operators built up millions upon millions in fines they ignore until they get sold or file bankruptcy. Our own governor is finally being held accountable for his millions in fines.

They ignore the clean ups they are required to do until they file bankruptcy and argue for the taxpayers clean it up.

If we actually held the coal mines accountable, costs would skyrocket and people would demand a replacement.
It's good to see coal companies looking for better energy alternatives.

A Kentucky city transitions from coal, minus the doom and gloom

US coal plant retirements to continue

All the deniers can either get on board with the change that's coming or continue spouting denier myths all the while throwing tantrums about the change that's inevitable.
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:06 PM
 
4,445 posts, read 1,453,477 times
Reputation: 3609
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post
Rather melodramatic response, who staid we are banning fossil fuels.
Rather a bit of a strawman there. My statement centered on the efficacy of renewable energy sources from a fiscal standpoint.

If energy bills increase to the point that people don't want to turn on the heat because they'd rather have groceries, self-serving environmental virtue signaling becomes little more than indulgence of bourgeoisie vanities.
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:15 PM
 
52,430 posts, read 26,688,370 times
Reputation: 21097
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Just one small lake that you can't see at the top of a small hill near here can generate more than a GW.....

And "conservatives" can't understand such things???? Amazing. I say we dunk them in crude oil and feather them...or, give them the choice of that or sitting up on the hill overlooking the river and having a beer?

Which one will they choose for themselves and their kids? You'd have to be a fiction writer to imagine people cheering against all the good things...and for the negatives! Yet, it happens. I'm thinking some crazed meth-addled Russian Fiction Writer may have had an influence on some of these folks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northf...icity_facility)
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
The naysayers will be saying the same thing when we are at 30%, 40% and even 70% renewables.

Remember, the primary method of transport for the Germans in WWII were HORSES.......

"and over the course of the war employed, in total, 2.75 million horses and mules; the average number of horses in the Army reached 1.1 million."
How many did the US and Brits use? Close to zero.
Dear, If the only way you can defend your point is to insult, criticize and profess superiority over 10s of millions of people you don't know, then you don't really have a point based on logic & fact.

Hydro will never be a big player in energy in the USA because it requires flooding of vasts areas of land and availability of huge amounts of water. It's very geographic specific.

I absolutely don't know what Nazis have to do with this discussion. Care to try again and sticking to just, maybe, the topic.
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:18 PM
 
Location: London
12,275 posts, read 7,153,395 times
Reputation: 13661
So...is the solution to keep using coal? When it runs out, then what?

Obviously it's going to be difficult to initially fully establish comprehensive green energy systems. I don't know why people are surprised by that.

You think it wasn't an initial struggle to get the original McDonald's up and running? It seems to operate effortlessly and seamlessly now, but it took sowing those seeds.
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:26 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,567 posts, read 37,182,394 times
Reputation: 14021
Portugal leads... Portugal’s renewable electricity production exceeded monthly consumption for what is likely the first time, in March, according to the nation’s transmission system operator, REN.The average renewable generation for the month exceeded 103% of consumption, beating out the last record (99.2%), set in 2014.

https://qz.com/1245048/portugal-gene...ntry-in-march/

The US is falling behind the rest of the world.

https://www.theatlas.com/charts/BJ-y9ZpKg
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Pacific 🌉 °N, 🌄°W
11,761 posts, read 7,271,536 times
Reputation: 7528
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
The US is falling behind the rest of the world.

https://www.theatlas.com/charts/BJ-y9ZpKg
Sadly the US has been falling behind the rest of the world in many areas. This is going to be the trend in the US from now on.

I never dreamed I would see the US become like this.
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Lone Mountain Las Vegas NV
18,058 posts, read 10,376,991 times
Reputation: 8828
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
us conservatives understand a lot more than you realize, and give us credit for. but we also realize that we will need every form of energy we have right now as we transition to renewable energy sources as our primary source of energy. we cannot just make the conversion all at once.


right now solar panels are far to inefficient to do a proper job. and the current crop of wind turbines are huge and ugly on the landscape, as well as being far to inefficient to do the job properly.


but new technologies being developed show promise. for instance i read about a possible wind energy source that would look natural, and be very efficient in generating electricity. i am talking about using piezoelectric rods that would look like grass, and generate electricity even in mild winds, and wont have to be shut down in very high winds, including hurricane force winds.


and there are problems with hydroelectric power, or do you think that fish and other aquatic creatures dont count?
Even now solar panels are already the least expensive source of electrical power. Large scale utility plants are below $0.03 per kwh and still dropping. And that is fully loaded life time costs. At that price you duplicate all fossil resources. And if we chose we can net the US. That will provide virtually continuous access to wind and solar. And it means access to the remaining fossil back up capability can be a nationwide shared resource.
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