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Old 11-07-2019, 04:43 PM
 
Location: Proxima Centauri
5,772 posts, read 3,224,169 times
Reputation: 6115

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Quote:
Originally Posted by justus978 View Post
..."you can't help but recall...."?...Tony, how the heck old are you, anyway????...

Cicero was a personal friend.

 
Old 11-07-2019, 04:50 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,824 posts, read 24,913,395 times
Reputation: 28520
Quote:
Originally Posted by TreeBeard View Post
Everything Trump touches dies.

Trump is a useful idiot of Putin’s and is doing exactly what Putin wants him to do. Trump is a Russian asset. Trump’s stupidity and depravity is what is destroying our alliances.

Hard to believe that anyone with a single functioning brain cell can support this walking and talking trash.

Merely typing the president's name must be a terribly traumatizing experience for you. Your bitterness and rage is not a virtue or asset. It makes you look insane in the eyes of ordinary, middle of the road Americans, so keep it up. It is pushing them into the warm embrace of the republican party, the party of personal responsibility and not being a burden to society. Lot of people have been seeing the light lately, that much I can assure you. Trump 2020 is all but certain. Be sure to mark you calendar for the great day in which America will formerly renew it's contract to keep America great.
 
Old 11-07-2019, 06:18 PM
 
Location: Toronto, ON
2,339 posts, read 2,071,861 times
Reputation: 1650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
There is no reason whatsoever for the US to be involved in NATO
There's no reason for NATO.
 
Old 11-07-2019, 06:21 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
30,373 posts, read 19,170,654 times
Reputation: 26266
NATO is no longer a valid organization...let's dissolve it.
 
Old 11-07-2019, 08:37 PM
 
Location: Earth
7,643 posts, read 6,480,492 times
Reputation: 5828
NATO keeps the peace.


I don't trust the europeans not to start world war 3.


I'm not storming normandy to have my guts spill out from machine gun fire.


NATO prevents all that.
 
Old 11-07-2019, 09:52 PM
 
1,710 posts, read 1,463,521 times
Reputation: 2205
You can argue the Cold War is over and Nato is no longer needed. Putin has a strong argument for expanding his influence when NATO is expanding.

That said, Spain folded pretty quick and pulled out of AFG and really does nothing. Most of the NATO nations really do very little to do much other than allow the US military to fly over, stop and refuel in their airspace.

Regardless the bigger issue would be if the US pulled all forces out of Europe and the mid east.....how long would it take for it to all fall apart?
 
Old 11-08-2019, 04:50 AM
Status: "“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”" (set 4 days ago)
 
Location: Great Britain
27,185 posts, read 13,469,799 times
Reputation: 19508
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonyafd View Post
The American commitment to NATO has been less clear in recent years than it was in the past. This is the view of European analysts as reported on DW News this evening.

America under Trump is reducing its military commitments abroad. A glaring example is the recent withdrawal of American troops from the Turkish border and the prompt occupation of those abandoned bases by Russian troops. Another example is our tolerance of Russian soldiers in Venezuela and a reduced commitment to NATO. As I see this happening, I can't help but recall how General Stilicho of the Western Roman Empire recalled troops from the Danube frontier in order to defend the Italian peninsula from the Visigoths. Rome was sacked for the first time in 410 AD.
The problem for NATO is that if the Democrats are elected in to power they are promising all these social programs, and to pay for them they are going to look to cut certain budget, and defence spending would see extensive cuts.

So it seems that whilst NATO may continue in some form, the European countries are going to have to stop relying on the US and build more substantial military forces.

Obviously those such as Macron would prefer a European force as the French have never been big NATO supporters and left NATO's integrated military command in 1966, whilst closing US and NATO bases in France. France did not rejoin the NATO Military Command Structure and full NATO membership until the 4th April 2009, and France is still not a great NATO supporter.
 
Old 11-08-2019, 05:02 AM
 
45,231 posts, read 26,450,499 times
Reputation: 24988
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammy87 View Post
You can argue the Cold War is over and Nato is no longer needed. Putin has a strong argument for expanding his influence when NATO is expanding.

That said, Spain folded pretty quick and pulled out of AFG and really does nothing. Most of the NATO nations really do very little to do much other than allow the US military to fly over, stop and refuel in their airspace.

Regardless the bigger issue would be if the US pulled all forces out of Europe and the mid east.....how long would it take for it to all fall apart?
How would rate the cohesiveness of it now on a scale of 1-10?
 
Old 11-08-2019, 05:06 AM
 
13,651 posts, read 20,780,689 times
Reputation: 7652
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hrw-500 View Post
Didn't former president Charles DeGaulle pulls France out of NATO's integral structure around 1966-67?
Oui.

Booted out American forces and forced NATO headquarters to move to Bruxelles.

Hey, their country, their choice. But it makes Macron's statements more than a bit ironic.
 
Old 11-08-2019, 07:26 AM
 
78,432 posts, read 60,613,724 times
Reputation: 49733
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangerous-Boy View Post
NATO keeps the peace.


I don't trust the europeans not to start world war 3.


I'm not storming normandy to have my guts spill out from machine gun fire.


NATO prevents all that.
More specifically, NUKES keep the peace.

There have been many NATO like organizations in Europe over the years and ironically they have sucked people into wars and prevented pretty much nothing.

Europe's had a constant string of wars since the beginning of recorded history until the old splitting of the atom came about and put a stop to things.
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