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Old 02-19-2020, 07:04 AM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,746,762 times
Reputation: 22232

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Communism and socialism always start with the rise of the people to overthrow inequity and put the people in charge, and then they end up basically enslaving the citizens.

Communist and socialist country have to use force to keep people from leaving while capitalist countries have to keep people from entering.
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Old 02-19-2020, 07:08 AM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
9,700 posts, read 5,139,464 times
Reputation: 4270
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
wsad.when has socialism or communism not decayed into a dictatorship?

As a country declines under either horrible system, ruling with an iron fist is the only way to maintain control.
Either you're trying to slip a strawman by everyone to compare socialized healthcare with actual countries who took control of all/most private means of production, in which case... just stop.

Or you're lazily calling socialized healthcare "socialism," in which case... Every other industrialized country in Europe?
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Old 02-19-2020, 07:10 AM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
31,335 posts, read 14,447,509 times
Reputation: 27877
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cida View Post
I think that by now it's been going on for something like a hundred years. And it still works on some people, although Bernie has diminished the fear a bit.


https://www.timesfreepress.com/news/...ialist/515766/

Republicans have a long, disreputable history of conflating any attempt to improve American lives with the evils of "socialism." When Medicare was first proposed, Ronald Reagan called it "socialized medicine," and he declared that it would destroy our freedom. These days, if you call for something like universal child care, conservatives accuse you of wanting to turn America into the Soviet Union. It's a smarmy, dishonest political strategy, but it's hard to deny that it has sometimes been effective.
Bernie Sanders is a self described socialist. That isn't scare tactics - that's the freaking truth.
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Old 02-19-2020, 07:18 AM
 
24,230 posts, read 15,297,372 times
Reputation: 13126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rachel976 View Post
How does one redistribute money to corporate America? By allowing them to keep more of their profits? No. And besides, that money is returned to American taxpayers: by increased hiring (lowest UE in 50 years), increased wages (which we've seen particularly on the lower end), and a roaring stock market (in which more than half of all Americans - primarily the tax-paying half - have a vested interest). If I had been allowed to keep more of my gross profits, I could have plugged that extra money back into the business, grown it to a greater extent, and provided livelihoods to a greater number of people.

Other than that, I agree with the rest of your post. I would have done significantly better by keeping my SS contributions and investing on my own. The problem, though, is that's ME. What would happen is that 100+ million Americans would not have made wise decisions, end up with no retirement savings, and require a special SS program given to people with minimal assets.

I like the idea of a flat tax, with one exception: The first $25,000 or so would be exempt so as to not present a hardship to low-income people (who spend a disproportionate amount on basics like food and rent).
By cleaning up the messes they make.

I stopped counting superfund sites in my state created by dry cleaning fluid dumped into the ground instead of being properly disposed of. No telling how many wells have been poisoned or tainted.

About once every 6 months a large corporate owned petroleum processing or chemical plant explodes or leaks. They may get a fine, but that nowhere near pays for the damage done.

Last month a welding company with known problems blew up and damaged 400 houses. Killed 2 employees. Filed for bankruptcy, but wants the judge to allow them to pay off loans instead of replacing the houses the damaged. It will eventually fall on the taxpayer.

Yesterday a court ruled that the flooding caused to the houses built along the perimeter of a Corp of Engineers reservoir is not the fault of the Corps. Why were homes built there in the first place? The corps told the county and city of the risks. Developer money runs Harris county Texas. And the taxpayer cleans up their mess.

Now my biggest bailout woe. FEMA. Builders build, people buy and the taxpayer bails them out of their collective stupidity. I have lost count of the billions of dollars spent by the federal government on flooding. My town was founded by real estate developers. Nothing has changed since the Allen Bros. landed.


I'll endorse the first 25K exemption. The thing about a flat tax with no exemptions is it would stop half of us from believing that we are being screwed by the other half. It's just plain fair.
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Old 02-19-2020, 07:31 AM
 
Location: Long Island
57,398 posts, read 26,458,152 times
Reputation: 15709
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeerGeek40 View Post
Bernie Sanders is a self described socialist. That isn't scare tactics - that's the freaking truth.
"We aren't going to be Venezuela" is the republican theme song just more scare tactics.
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Old 02-19-2020, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
38,759 posts, read 22,555,861 times
Reputation: 14209
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
Nobody's "tagging" anyone. Sanders is a self-described Socialist.

Socialism has NEVER been effective. It has ALWAYS resulted in starvation, death to those to speak out in opposition, misery to the citizens, and death to millions.
...and socialism and communism are antithetical to our representative republic; including Democratic-Socialism.
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Old 02-19-2020, 07:45 AM
 
3,011 posts, read 1,193,683 times
Reputation: 2760
The left: Trump is Russia's puppet.

Also the left: Let's be like Soviet Russia.
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Old 02-19-2020, 07:48 AM
 
8,969 posts, read 2,589,073 times
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These days our friends on the left aren't being "tagged" as socialists or communists, they are self identifying as socialists or communists seemingly unaware that they should be ashamed of those titles.
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Old 02-19-2020, 08:04 AM
 
2,691 posts, read 1,419,282 times
Reputation: 2837
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
Nobody's "tagging" anyone. Sanders is a self-described Socialist.

Socialism has NEVER been effective. It has ALWAYS resulted in starvation, death to those to speak out in opposition, misery to the citizens, and death to millions.
Yep, that is the right wing messaging in a nutshell...gotta watch out for that slippery slope. Universal health care today, Auschwitz or the gulag tomorrow.
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Old 02-19-2020, 08:12 AM
 
2,691 posts, read 1,419,282 times
Reputation: 2837
Quote:
Originally Posted by RICANRICAN View Post
The left: Trump is Russia's puppet.

Also the left: Let's be like Soviet Russia.
Nobody on the left...except some extremist loonies on the fringe...wants a system anything like the Soviet Union had. Nice straw man argument.
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