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The deals the UK want already exist, and the UK has made it crystal clear that it will not be subject to EU Courts and will be a free nation.
If need be the UK can just leave and trade with the EU the same way Canada does, however in such circumstances we would need to withdraw from the Lancaster House Treaties and other European defence projects as well as other obligations.
I think walking away is the sensible thong to do, if the EU which has a £100 billion trade surplus with the UK which is their biggest customer wants to do a trade deal then so be it, however walkinf away offers the UK a lot of fexibility.
The UK will make lots of new trade deals and any action from the EU in a WTO situation would just see tariffs raised on their products, and would allow the UK to hit back if they try to punish us.
Lol...not trying to ridicule you, but this just comes off as fantastic. Working out new trade deals is gonna be tortuous, and i have a big hunch that Britain has bitten off far more than it can chew. This isn’t 1900. Britain isn’t at the top of its game anymore.
But hey, good luck. It’s not my country and really none of my business I suppose.
Lol...not trying to ridicule you, but this just comes off as fantastic. Working out new trade deals is gonna be tortuous, and i have a big hunch that Britain has bitten off far more than it can chew. This isn’t 1900. Britain isn’t at the top of its game anymore.
But hey, good luck. It’s not my country and really none of my business I suppose.
Bitten off more than it can chew? How exactly? (If you can be bothered to comment again on something affecting un-important non USA people).
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Originally Posted by desertdetroiter
Lol...not trying to ridicule you, but this just comes off as fantastic. Working out new trade deals is gonna be tortuous, and i have a big hunch that Britain has bitten off far more than it can chew. This isn’t 1900. Britain isn’t at the top of its game anymore.
But hey, good luck. It’s not my country and really none of my business I suppose.
There are lots of countries that would like trade deals with the UK and making a trade deal between two countries is far simplar than having to negotiate with 27 EU member countries any one of which can object.
The UK can't make trade deals until the current transition period finishes which is the end of the year however there are numerous trade deals.
As the Australian PM rightly pointed out 'no country ever became poor through free trade'.
Not really, the UK merely wanted a Canada plus deal and a fishing strategy similar to Norway, it's not a herculean task, however just walking away now seems the best option.
The UK has even suggested we walk away in June if progress can not be made.
Quote:
Originally Posted by atltechdude
It was a Herculean task given the disposition of the EU and the comparative time the Canada deal took to negotiate.
If the EU were looking to make it easy for the UK, then yes it likely wouldn’t have been herculean.
There are lots of countries that would like trade deals with the UK and making a trade deal between two countries is far simplar than having to negotiate with 27 EU member countries any one of which can object.
The UK can't make trade deals until the current transition period finishes which is the end of the year however there are numerous trade deals.
As the Australian PM rightly pointed out 'no country ever became poor through free trade'.
Bro...having a bazillion different trade deals is imprudent. Trading within a bloc OBVIOUSLY has great advantages, which is why every nation worth its salt does it.
If Britain were to come to me seeking a stand alone deal, I would of course negotiate one. But there’s no way I’d give you as good a deal as you had as an EU member because I’d have to give the Bloc the trade advantage. That’s only common sense. I wouldn’t dare do anything to undermine my relationship with the EU by giving the U.K. a similar deal.
This is what Britain faces as a stand alone trading partner. It’s going to be very tough.
Look, I get it. Anglophiles have this tendency to jump up and down and rant about national sovereignty and we tend to show a strange reticence when it comes to sacrificing even an iota of it. But the U.K.’s future is with Europe. That’s a fact. The Germans, French and your other Europeans understand this although they chafe at the notion of Brussels issuing edicts that they have to follow.
Bro...having a bazillion different trade deals is imprudent. Trading within a bloc OBVIOUSLY has great advantages, which is why every nation worth its salt does it.
If Britain were to come to me seeking a stand alone deal, I would of course negotiate one. But there’s no way I’d give you as good a deal as you had as an EU member because I’d have to give the Bloc the trade advantage. That’s only common sense. I wouldn’t dare do anything to undermine my relationship with the EU by giving the U.K. a similar deal.
This is what Britain faces as a stand alone trading partner. It’s going to be very tough.
Look, I get it. Anglophiles have this tendency to jump up and down and rant about national sovereignty and we tend to show a strange reticence when it comes to sacrificing even an iota of it. But the U.K.’s future is with Europe. That’s a fact. The Germans, French and your other Europeans understand this although they chafe at the notion of Brussels issuing edicts that they have to follow.
But again, good luck. You’ll need it.
You seem to think that Britain will accept bad deals' that's obviously not going to happen. Trade deals are only going to be struck if it's an advantage to both parties, and here is the real 'deal breaker' (pardon the pun). Making trade deals is making money and if you or anybody else thinks that countries are going to pass any opportunities for money making just to 'teach a lesson', which is affectively cutting off their nose to spite their faces then you are very much mistaken. Why is it a 'fact' that Britain's future is as nothing more than a satelite state of Europe?
You seem to think that Britain will accept bad deals' that's obviously not going to happen. Trade deals are only going to be struck if it's an advantage to both parties, and here is the real 'deal breaker' (pardon the pun). Making trade deals is making money and if you or anybody else thinks that countries are going to pass any opportunities for money making just to 'teach a lesson', which is affectively cutting off their nose to spite their faces then you are very much mistaken. Why is it a 'fact' that Britain's future is as nothing more than a satelite state of Europe?
I don’t think you’re seeing the full picture, with all due respect.
Look, nations form alliances for reasons. Germany is far more economically powerful than Britain. Their workers enjoy better pay and benefits and a better standard of living. They are the engine of Europe. They’ve managed to flourish under the EU framework. You think they liked giving up the Deutsche Mark? They HATED it! And moreover, Germany manages to flourish while taking in another nation like East Germany that was broke, impoverished, and saddled with crumbling infrastructure from top to bottom.
Now this isn’t about negotiating from an aspect of revenge, but simply put, I couldn’t in good conscience give a stand alone Britain the same good deal that I give the EU. It would be asinine. I’d be undermining my relationship with the EU if I did that. And how do you expect the U.K. to get a favorable trade deal on par with what they had in the EU? That doesn’t make sense. Britain simply put, isn’t the nation you think they are. Britain only has 1.8% share of global manufacturing. That’s behind at least 3 other European nations. Hell, that’s barely more than Mexico.
Now there are positives, depending on how you see trade deficits. Britain is a trade deficit monster, which makes its potential trading partners very happy. They are a voracious consumer of foreign goods. And Britain’s banking sector might be the best in the world. Still though, neither of those things do much for the average worker in the U.K. British workers have REALLY fallen behind in wages and standard of living, and Britain is one the most expensive European nation to live in. It’s ridiculous.
Still, I just can’t see the benefit of having dozens of trade deals with individual nations. It’s extraordinarily labyrinthine and time consuming. For what? Because you can’t accept that your future is within a European framework and not the defunct British Empire? LMAO...it’s madness. It’s delusion at its best.
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"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
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27,185 posts, read 13,469,799 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter
Bro...having a bazillion different trade deals is imprudent. Trading within a bloc OBVIOUSLY has great advantages, which is why every nation worth its salt does it.
If Britain were to come to me seeking a stand alone deal, I would of course negotiate one. But there’s no way I’d give you as good a deal as you had as an EU member because I’d have to give the Bloc the trade advantage. That’s only common sense. I wouldn’t dare do anything to undermine my relationship with the EU by giving the U.K. a similar deal.
This is what Britain faces as a stand alone trading partner. It’s going to be very tough.
Look, I get it. Anglophiles have this tendency to jump up and down and rant about national sovereignty and we tend to show a strange reticence when it comes to sacrificing even an iota of it. But the U.K.’s future is with Europe. That’s a fact. The Germans, French and your other Europeans understand this although they chafe at the notion of Brussels issuing edicts that they have to follow.
But again, good luck. You’ll need it.
The UK's future is in a global world market place and not part of a European Federal Super State, and we have now left the EU and are negotiating a deal. It's also woth noting that we have not left Europe we have left the EU and there is a big difference.
The UK looks like it will secure a fishery deal similar to Norway and there is no reason why a Canada style plus trade deal can not be done, however of a trade deal is not done then we can trade with the EU the same way Australia does which is on WTO rules, whilst the US manages $500 Billion a year weithout a trade deal.
The truth is that Italy may be next to leave, with much of Southern Europe and Eastern Europe extremely unhappy with the mass immigation and migrants, the Euro-crisis and the poor EU response to Covid-19.
The Scandivanian countries are also far fromn enthusastic about many aspects of he EU, whilst Iceland is also signalling it will be leaving
Bro...having a bazillion different trade deals is imprudent. Trading within a bloc OBVIOUSLY has great advantages, which is why every nation worth its salt does it.
If Britain were to come to me seeking a stand alone deal, I would of course negotiate one. But there’s no way I’d give you as good a deal as you had as an EU member because I’d have to give the Bloc the trade advantage. That’s only common sense. I wouldn’t dare do anything to undermine my relationship with the EU by giving the U.K. a similar deal.
This is what Britain faces as a stand alone trading partner. It’s going to be very tough.
Look, I get it. Anglophiles have this tendency to jump up and down and rant about national sovereignty and we tend to show a strange reticence when it comes to sacrificing even an iota of it. But the U.K.’s future is with Europe. That’s a fact. The Germans, French and your other Europeans understand this although they chafe at the notion of Brussels issuing edicts that they have to follow.
But again, good luck. You’ll need it.
Actually what would be common sense is to evaluate each on it's own merits and determine the best course of action. There's no need to presume a better outcome from a bloc than an individual nation, it's all highly specific to your current trade balances, and benefits vs. costs. Indeed a demand that the UK have less favorable terms made on the US by the EU, would need to be backed by something to make it worthwhile for the US to do so, and that would need to be a far greater benefit than any loss the US suffers from reduced UK trade.
While it may be that any nation worth its salt is a member of a trading bloc, it's also important to remember than no trading bloc requires its members to not negotiate it's own trade policies with other trading partners outside that bloc, except one. For example the US isn't limited by NAFTA to not pursue trade interests with China, as the US.
Actually what would be common sense is to evaluate each on it's own merits and determine the best course of action. There's no need to presume a better outcome from a bloc than an individual nation, it's all highly specific to your current trade balances, and benefits vs. costs. Indeed a demand that the UK have less favorable terms made on the US by the EU, would need to be backed by something to make it worthwhile for the US to do so, and that would need to be a far greater benefit than any loss the US suffers from reduced UK trade.
While it may be that any nation worth its salt is a member of a trading bloc, it's also important to remember than no trading bloc requires its members to not negotiate it's own trade policies with other trading partners outside that bloc, except one. For example the US isn't limited by NAFTA to not pursue trade interests with China, as the US
Well, not quite. It didn’t get much publicity, but Canada was forced to accept this clause in NAFTA 2.0:
The new trade agreement between the U.S., Canada and Mexico includes a provision that requires one member to notify the others if it launches trade talks with a non-market economy. If those talks lead to a deal, the signatory could potentially be frozen out of the North American pact. It’s essentially a China clause, with the Trump administration gearing up for trade war with Beijing. It’s also partially symbolic.
I assume the U.S. would require a similar clause in any trade deal with the U.K.
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