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Old 07-28-2020, 04:59 AM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
20,130 posts, read 16,200,022 times
Reputation: 28358

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Quote:
Originally Posted by krichton View Post
two medical professionals gave hydroxy to their daughter and she died from covid.
She had a rare auto-immune disease, was obese, and was a cancer survivor. Sometimes there really is nothing the medical profession could have done differently that would have made a difference, this is probably one of those cases.
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Old 07-28-2020, 07:33 AM
 
4,038 posts, read 1,891,929 times
Reputation: 8696
Eh I dunno. I think alot of people don't understand what "effective drug" means.


Does hydrox.. help some folks? Probably.
Does it do nothing for many folks? Probably.
Does it hurt some folks - or make it worse? Probably.


Is it used to treat OTHER diseases successfully? Certainly. Is that relevant? No.


People - do some math. Only about 1 in 500, maybe fewer, die from COVID. So you have to ask - does Hydrox. exasperate the situation in more than 1 in 500? What if it saved 2 from COVID...but killed 1 that was going to live? Might seem like "math" to you - but it definitely does not to that one poor guy.


It's not just black and white. It's not easy to discern. You have millions - literally - millions upon millions of cases, and we have hydrox data from just a handful - and short term at that. (The years of data showing the benefits outweigh the risks for A DIFFERENT DISEASE do not apply here.)



Ask yourself what data - and in what numbers - would make it PROOF for you that it works. Saying "Just one" doesn't get it - because "just one" somewhere else might have died. Be realistic - what are your numbers? Your criteria? You are probably under what's actually required by a huuuuuuuuge margin.



No one is saying that it doesn't help at least someone. The problem is that it ALSO hurts someone, however rare it is.



There is a known side-effect number - and THAT is from years of research. So what we need now is a known BENEFIT number that outweighs the side-effects...and since so few die anyway, that number is hard to come by.
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Old 07-28-2020, 07:39 AM
 
Location: Long Island
8,840 posts, read 4,815,364 times
Reputation: 6479
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer Time View Post
There was another Doctor that gave a press confrence recently saying the same things. She sounds like she is from Jamica and was very animated.
One of these? Who says sex with demons is to blame for our ills? I might look at other sources...

https://www.thedailybeast.com/stella...oxychloroquine
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Old 07-28-2020, 07:46 AM
 
Location: Long Island
8,840 posts, read 4,815,364 times
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They temporarily disabled features on don Jr's twitter be cause he sent out that crazy trash..
Jeremy Diamond (@JDiamond1) Tweeted:
Twitter has temporarily limited account features on Don Jr’s account (no tweeting, RTing), apparently for tweeting the video of doctors falsely touting hydroxychloroquine as a “cure” and saying there’s no need for masks. https://twitter.com/JDiamond1/status...606891008?s=20
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Old 07-28-2020, 07:52 AM
 
Location: Oklahoma
17,837 posts, read 13,754,245 times
Reputation: 17902
Quote:
Originally Posted by roodd279 View Post
Eh I dunno. I think alot of people don't understand what "effective drug" means.


Does hydrox.. help some folks? Probably.
Does it do nothing for many folks? Probably.
Does it hurt some folks - or make it worse? Probably.


Is it used to treat OTHER diseases successfully? Certainly. Is that relevant? No.


People - do some math. Only about 1 in 500, maybe fewer, die from COVID. So you have to ask - does Hydrox. exasperate the situation in more than 1 in 500? What if it saved 2 from COVID...but killed 1 that was going to live? Might seem like "math" to you - but it definitely does not to that one poor guy.


It's not just black and white. It's not easy to discern. You have millions - literally - millions upon millions of cases, and we have hydrox data from just a handful - and short term at that. (The years of data showing the benefits outweigh the risks for A DIFFERENT DISEASE do not apply here.)



Ask yourself what data - and in what numbers - would make it PROOF for you that it works. Saying "Just one" doesn't get it - because "just one" somewhere else might have died. Be realistic - what are your numbers? Your criteria? You are probably under what's actually required by a huuuuuuuuge margin.



No one is saying that it doesn't help at least someone. The problem is that it ALSO hurts someone, however rare it is.



There is a known side-effect number - and THAT is from years of research. So what we need now is a known BENEFIT number that outweighs the side-effects...and since so few die anyway, that number is hard to come by.
The bottom line IMO is that hydroxychloroquine is to COVID what Tamaflu is to flu.

But the reality is that if you get sick enough it isn't going to help you. Just about all the anecdotal evidence of hydroxy's success comes from people who weren't horribly sick.
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Old 07-28-2020, 08:21 AM
 
4,038 posts, read 1,891,929 times
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Right - and if ya died anyway, it's difficult to say if the Hydroxy contributed.
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Old 07-28-2020, 09:54 AM
 
Location: Chicago area
18,759 posts, read 11,817,815 times
Reputation: 64167
FDA bans use of hydroxychloroquine.

Coronavirus (Covid-19) Update. FDA Revokes Emergency Use Authorization for Chloroquine and Hydroxychloroquine.

FDA cautions against use of hydrocychloroquine or chloroquine for for Covid-19 outside of the hospital setting or a clinical trial due to risk of heart rhythm problems.

Source: www.fda.gov.


I don't care how many fake paid experts say it works. That's for gullible rubes. The bottom line is Trump's FDA says it's a no go. Bottom line. End of story.
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Old 07-28-2020, 10:02 AM
 
26,660 posts, read 13,783,232 times
Reputation: 19118
Quote:
Originally Posted by beb0p View Post
I don't understand this fascination with crack science. I don't get it. Why?

The following research was just published in the New England Journal of Medicine just days ago - it says Hydroxychloroquine has no benefits to sick patients. None. It is administered to patients early in the sickness just as those people said it should.


.
Did the NEJM study use zinc as well? That’s an important part of the treatment with hydroxychloroquine and the antibiotic. You need all three and all three early on.

Edit, I checked the study and no they did not. What a waste of time for them to leave that important component out of their study.
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Old 07-28-2020, 10:05 AM
 
7,245 posts, read 4,568,475 times
Reputation: 11948
Quote:
Originally Posted by PilgrimsProgress View Post
He will probably get fired now, despite impressive professional credentials. Another victim of Cancel Culture.
There was an article on science daily a week ago that had 20 treatments for corona virus likely or proven to work..

My fear is that the Medical Industry won't try them because of their prejudices and inherent self interest in making this "pandemic" all it can be.
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Old 07-28-2020, 10:28 AM
 
4,023 posts, read 1,446,920 times
Reputation: 3543
Here is another recent study by a large hospital network that seems to support Hydroxychlorquines efficacy.


https://www.henryford.com/news/2020/...reatment-study


The dems are just politicizing everything. To the point of harming patients. Just because Trump said something does not make it right or wrong. Where do you think he got the idea? I doubt he came up with it himself, he likely heard doctors talking about it.
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