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They might be spending less but they have less. Canada couldn't produce it's own covid vax good or bad. Some say their vax production issues go back almost 2 decades.
The US might be expensive but as messed up as it is there is still more to work with
First of all, two very different things.
Secondly, do some research on what vaccines Canada has produced, and particularly the science behind how MRNA vaccines are delivered into your system.
Healthcare access and quality have nothing to do with healthcare research.
Lastly, and you really should hang your head down low, is that MAID is NOT a way for a patient to go away forever. It is a decision made by the person with a terminal illness. It's not something to be made into a flippant comment on CD.
I know 2 Canadian citizens with medical conditions:
My Aunt who needed gall bladder removed. She said it cost only $5 out of pocket but she was forced to wait 18 months for the surgery.
A friend of family with a rare non-smokers lung cancer. While her father begged her to come back to the states for treatment, CDN health care model (in lieu of treatment) prescribed her with rest and warm compresses. RIP
^I'm the opposite, an American living in Canada with a Canadian partner who is terminally ill and disabled by a rare condition brought on by the immune system attacking a cancer.
Last year he was sent from a stroke center to a neurology hospital for tests and scans while they tried to figure out what the hell was wrong with him. When they found the cancer, we had a call within a day or two that he was to enter Princess Margaret Cancer Center in Toronto. No waiting.
When he was sent home three weeks later,--which of course there was no bill to pay for--I got a call the day before to let me know that the home care nurse and PSWs (equivalent of aides/CNAs in the US) were set up to start coming to the house to help with bed baths and whatever we might need, as well as an OT to assess the home and see what equipment we might need. A hospital bed arrived and was set up here the day before he got home. All of this is covered under OHIP. There was no need to provide bank statements and financial information to receive the home care as there is in the Medicaid system for the same services in the USA. (I have a BIL with advanced MS, and in order to get any aides at home, my sister had to spend down whatever was in her bank account to show she was broke enough to get help. Then once approved, she had to wait a month for an aide to actually be available.)
Some things are more difficult; for example, in order to get a PET scan, we had to travel from the rural area in which we were living to a choice of Ottawa or Mississauga, both about a three-hour drive, because facilities with that equipment are only found in major cities.
Meanwhile, I had to get some dental work done here in Canada. My insurance covers me here as "out-of-network", meaning that I pay and file a claim and can get reimbursed for 80% of approved costs. The cost was less than I would pay my NJ dentist, even at the fancy Canadian dentist office to which I go for the services.
I agree with those who say look at what works and what doesn't in each system and try to come up with something better than what the US has right now. I personally have excellent health insurance, some of the best in the country. Got it through my employer and was able to take it with me into retirement. However, I know too many people who are paying unbelievable amounts of money for crappy coverage.
Your experience mirror millions of Canadians.
As you may remember, my mother had many health issues, from brain tumours, breast cancer, kidney cancer, hip replacements and some others. Not once did anyone think that " gee, this is more than just a bandaid, we better go to the USA and spend hundreds of thousands or more, for care that we would receive no bill for in Canada" Some seem to believe that Canadians can buy health insurance and have it work in the US. No, we can't. What we can and do buy is TRAVEL health insurance for emergencies only. Everything else would be denied and paid out of pocket. In fact, when I buy travel health insurance the FIRST question they ask, " are you going to the US?" Why? Because then it will cost more because it's the ONLY place the travel insurance companies need to charge more for.
I mention the bandaid, since a poster a while back did say that Canadians needing more care than a bandaid has to leave the country to get good care.
As outrageous and disingenuous that statement may have, been, the sentiment is once again displayed on CD as fact.
Like your experience after her brain surgery when she was released, homecare was provided, with a nurse showing up at her home that day to make sure everything for her home recovery was in place, For several weeks, I think 3, they provided 24 hour care because her 2 children, one of them being me, was working and could not be there for 24 hours.
Over the years here on CD I've read the vast amount of lies, and misinformation about care in Canada. It burns me that these misinformed or people with an agenda, are trying to misguide Americans about UHC and all the various way it can be delivered.
Is it perfect? Is any system perfect? No.
Did our system prevent our family from going bankrupt, or having to pay thousands? Yes. The following is becoming a cliche, but all I paid for was parking.
I have cancer, when I go to my nearest Cancer Center, the waiting room is around 50% Canadians. The Canadian healthcare system lacks specialists. For these patients, that system does not have oncologists. So they must get into doing 'medical tourism'. They come here where we do have oncologists.
When a healthcare system pays all doctors the same amount, there is no incentive to go back to school to get a specialty.
Any doctor can diagnose that you have cancer, and maybe they can give you a rough idea of how much time you have left until your cancer will kill you. When you have 6 months to live and the soonest appointment is only 4 years from now, there is a problem.
Here you go again.
We don't have oncologists? That very statement make the rest of your observations very suspect
.
You might as wells say Canada doesn't have dentists.
You've posted this before.
Cancer patients in Canada do not wait four years to see a specialist if you have cancer, especially if it's urgent. I KNOW SINCE I'VE KNOWN FAMILY AND FRIENDS WHO GET AND GOT IMMEDIATE CARE.
I know of a Prime Minister in Newfounland that chose to have heart surgery in Miami in February. If you can't figure out why he did that -- you mnight need to do some work in geography.
Rand Paul went to Toronto for eye surgery.
Is that indicative of a bad medical system in the USA?
The Premier at the time, of Newfoundland had a second home in Florida, where he wanted to be to recuperate.
The procedure he had done, was actually developed in Canada. It's not like he couldn't have had it done here.
I agree with Moneill, I've been to Canada, and I cannot say I noticed a huge difference in diet or activity. Oklahoma is only 1 state, but obesity is an epidemic nationwide in the USA. Whenever I take domestic flights in the USA, I always see at least 1 to 2 passengers that need seatbelt extensions.
As for this study, overweight + obesity tend to mask the problem. Overweight + obesity in Canada is similar to the USA, but what is not is obesity.
Canadians are out of shape, but not generally very very very fat.
In the USA, I live in Miami Beach. Maybe this is one of the fitter places in the USA. But when I hop on over to my place in France (Cap d'Ail) it's a huge, very noticeable difference still.
I'm curious if there is something else America is doing wrong that can easily be corrected. This kind of obesity is simply not healthy, and to me seems almost unnatural. I'm not sure I could be that fat if I tried.
I think some of it is cultural. I lived in Europe for a few years, and they act very differently than we do here in the U.S. or even in Canada. We also act a little differently than Canadians, overall.
Nonetheless, even Europe has a share of overweight/fat/obese. And I've noticed that it seems to be more people every year.
I can only speak from my personal experiences, but when I lived overseas, yes, they had their fast food joints, but they were never crowded like we see here. I went to the McDonald's in Germany only once. Just because I wanted to say that I went to a McDonald's in Germany and ordered a beer. (I was 18, cut me some slack, and no, I didn't actually order the beer. They only had Pils, and you can forget that.) Hardly anyone was in there, not like we see here, where the drive thru line is wrapped around the restaurant, even at 2am (I do deliveries, I see it all the time), and the dining area is crowded.
They tend to eat more but less. They go 'to eat' a lot, but they don't actually eat that much. They eat normal food, and a lot of times, it's not garbage filled with preservatives. They eat more fruits, cheese, meats that are not processed, and other more 'natural' foods. Their food also tastes different. I can have a steak in Germany and a steak in the U.S. and there is a difference in the taste. Not due to seasonings, but due to how the food was treated before it came out of the ground, off of the tree, or from the animal.
I remember not seeing any restaurants being 24/7 when I lived in Mainz.
I don't remember ever buying food from a gas station in Germany like people do here.
People did go outside a lot more than people here. I was an MP, and we had rotating shifts. Sometimes we would be on the mid shift (over night) and it didn't matter where you parked your car, even when you thought you were in the woods all by yourself, no matter where you thought you were hiding, every. single. time. eventually a German would walk on by with his dog in the wee hours of the morning. Every. Time. Even on field exercises, we would be out in the middle of nowhere woods, it's 3am, we are out there playing fake war games, and there he is, the German out there walking his dog. It never failed, no matter what part of the country we were in during these field exercises.
I paid attention to how the French acted when I was there. I paid attention to how the Spaniards acted when I was there. I paid attention to how those from Luxembourg acted when I was there. Yes, they had cars. They drove them a lot. They drove a lot faster. They had trains that were actually on time, and could take you all over. And a ton of people used them, regularly.
But they still went outside and DID things.
What do we get here? Go to work. After work:
Go to a tavern and drink.
Go to a restaurant and eat greasy, horrible food.
Go home and eat junk in front of the TV.
Then, go to sleep.
On the weekends, chores. Mowing the grass. Pushing was just asking too much, now we sit on a mower.
Leaves/debris clean up: We used to actually sweep. Now, we have loud leaf blowers that do the work while we stand there barely moving. Snow shoveling...too much work. Now we have blowers or machines we push that does the work for us. Hardly anyone hangs their clothes on a line to dry, anymore. Washing dishes was too much. Now we just put them in a machine. Even entertainment - we no longer have to leave the house. Game? Instead of going to the game, it's watched on TV with a bunch of crappy snacks that are eaten for the next 4 hours.
In Europe, they go to the game. They sweep the sidewalks in front of their establishment. They may have dishwashers, but still do a lot of things the old way. They live smaller. There are no HOAs filled with behemoth cookie cutter homes which are filled with junk to keep them entertained and big machines that do everything for them. And as reserved as they are, they are far more welcoming to new people than here - and they go do things with their new friends.
They drink a lot more than we do, but they go DO things.
We seem to sit a lot. We sit in our car, we sit in a chair at the office, we sit in a chair to eat, we then sit in a chair at home in front of a computer or TV, then lie down in bed. I don't see a lot of walkers no matter where I live. We just sit, and sit, and sit.
The European countries are slowly becoming fatter, but nothing like here.
I agree with you that it's not just the poor. It's the middle class, as well. The very wealthy don't seem to be as fat, but it's not just the poor. I was watching a trial last night while trying to go to sleep, and it hit me that every single Bailiff in the court room had a gut spilling over their belt. There wasn't a slim one in that room.
I think the difference comes from these 2 things, mainly:
We sit way too much.
The food we get doesn't taste right - it's not the same as it used to be. There's something going on with our food these days. I don't just mean trash food - that stuff is now so laden with salt it's impossible to eat, even the raw foods don't taste the same. Something is happening at the farms and ranches, because it doesn't taste 'real' anymore. I don't think they are doing the same thing in other countries.
And a lot of nurses move to USA because of the shortage of nurses.
And lots of engineers, architects, designers, laborers, people move to the USA because they are offered more lucrative jobs.
There is nothing worse than reading posts from Americans who have never lived in Canada try to explain what it is like in Canada.
(for the record I have the same argment with family and friends in Canada who tell me what my life is like hre in the USA).
You are aware that I am an American living in Canada...right? And caring for a Canadian partner who is terminally ill, so in the past 18 months I've had quite a bit of exposure to your medical system. Most of which has left me with a positive outlook about it.
I am getting this info about the doctors from the Canadians in whose house I reside. There is also the fact that my boyfriend went for six years with only video doctor visits from a pharmacy clinic when living in his rural retirement home because he was on a wait list for a family doctor all that time. The town closest to his rural home has little signs, similar to political signs, stuck in the dirt along the streets, advertising for doctors to please come work there. That is something I've never seen in the USA, although granted I have lived most of my life in a metro region with world-class health care facilities.
The CBC airs regular segments about the effort to recruit nurses from other countries and accelerate their path to become certified to work in Canada.
As for engineers, architects, etc., well now that was MY world. My last project before retirement was running a solicitation process to identify a developer team for a major redevelopment project in the NYC region. The Canadian team won and has done a kickass job.
Yes medical tourism is a thing....particularily for 'optional surgeries' like plastic surgery.
But many Canadians do not choose to get medical care in the USA for cancer, diabetes, heart ailments, etc......Some may if they have money....and they want to recover in more favorable weather in the winter....but there is not a trend of Canadians opting out of Canadian health care for American care.
It just isn't true.
I did not claim that there was. Just providing factual information for those who do believe that Canadian healthcare is worse than it is.
And hey, as already pointed out, the guy in Maine who has Canadians at his cancer center is probably not lying, although his statement that Canada has no oncologists was odd and obviously not factual. In rural areas near the border, crossing to the US may make sense, especially when time is of the essence.
I also know of another, more specific situation. The bf's BIL is suspected of having Lyme disease, but Canada's only Lyme test is not the more accurate and comprehensive test available in the States, so they had to connect with a doc and a lab in California to get the test done and pay out of pocket (which they can afford). It confirmed that he has Lyme, whereas the only test allowed in Canada was inconclusive.
They are seeking treatment through alternative medicine outside of OHIP.
Apparently, Lyme is considered "emerging" in Canada and the system is not yet in place to deal with it.
As you may remember, my mother had many health issues, from brain tumours, breast cancer, kidney cancer, hip replacements and some others. Not once did anyone think that " gee, this is more than just a bandaid, we better go to the USA and spend hundreds of thousands or more, for care that we would receive no bill for in Canada" Some seem to believe that Canadians can buy health insurance and have it work in the US. No, we can't. What we can and do buy is TRAVEL health insurance for emergencies only. Everything else would be denied and paid out of pocket. In fact, when I buy travel health insurance the FIRST question they ask, " are you going to the US?" Why? Because then it will cost more because it's the ONLY place the travel insurance companies need to charge more for.
I mention the bandaid, since a poster a while back did say that Canadians needing more care than a bandaid has to leave the country to get good care.
As outrageous and disingenuous that statement may have, been, the sentiment is once again displayed on CD as fact.
Like your experience after her brain surgery when she was released, homecare was provided, with a nurse showing up at her home that day to make sure everything for her home recovery was in place, For several weeks, I think 3, they provided 24 hour care because her 2 children, one of them being me, was working and could not be there for 24 hours.
Over the years here on CD I've read the vast amount of lies, and misinformation about care in Canada. It burns me that these misinformed or people with an agenda, are trying to misguide Americans about UHC and all the various way it can be delivered.
Is it perfect? Is any system perfect? No.
Did our system prevent our family from going bankrupt, or having to pay thousands? Yes. The following is becoming a cliche, but all I paid for was parking.
Sidebar story: When my bf was in Princess Margaret for three weeks last year, I took the GO trains to Toronto instead of driving on weekdays because it was easier than driving (and secondarily, as a retired public transportation geek I was interested in the system). But on weekends, it was faster to drive. I was warned, however, that if I drove in, I would have to use the parking garage behind the hospital and that I would have to PAY. I was fine with that, and so I drove in and parked in the garage, prepared to pay whatever was the cost.
When I left that first day, I got to the gate, hit the scanner with my credit card, and laughed. The parking charge for being there all day was $8. In NYC, it would have been $40 or more!
One more thing your personal experience reminded me of about Canada. My bf's sons took leaves of absence to help care for their dad. The older son applied for and received Compassionate Care benefits, a payment from the government to help cover expenses so he could stay home and take care of his father. It is only available to one family member at a time, but it is something that the USA does not do. He was able to receive that financial assistance for six months.
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There is also the fact that my boyfriend went for six years with only video doctor visits from a pharmacy clinic when living in his rural retirement home because he was on a wait list for a family doctor all that time. The town closest to his rural home has little signs, similar to political signs, stuck in the dirt along the streets, advertising for doctors to please come work there. That is something I've never seen in the USA, although granted I have lived most of my life in a metro region with world-class health care facilities.
