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"They have invented a myth that Jews were massacred and place this above God, religions and the prophets."
(etc., etc., etc.)
You could simply have said that you have no intention of reconsidering in the light of any actual evidence what Ahmadinejad has been talking about in referring to the Palestinians and their claims against Israel. You could have said that even if it is a crude and distorted misrepresentation, you are content with with the caricature of his words and intentions that has been developed for you by a biased western media.
The repressive regime that was the Soviet Union has been wiped off the map. So, despite the seeming impossibility of the task at one time, have the brutal regimes of Mohammad Reza Pahlavi and Saddam Hussein. Such, in the view of Ahmadinejad and many others, must be the the fate of the brutal Zionist regime in Jerusalem as the pages of history are turned.
We could also discuss whether Ahmadinejad's complaint is that the Holocaust itself is a myth, or that the myth that has been built up from whatever the events of the Holocaust has been unfairly used by the West to the extreme detriment of Palestinians, a group that was not in any way involved in the Holocaust and can therefore bear no responsibility for any part of it. But we already have a caricature from the western media built up on this account as well, so there is perhaps no need to bother.
No reference either to any pushing of Israel into the sea. I will continue to suspect that this one was pulled from another time and circumstance and attributed to Ahmadinejad simply because you felt like it.
Meanwhile, the current debate over Iran-US relations includes calls from some less acute quarters for military action. The risks of resort to military action on the basis of imagination rather than reality should still be fresh in our minds. If we are not willing to invest in an honest comprehension of reality, then exploitable imagination will be all that is left to us.
I did not serve. My father was in the Air Force and Grandfather and two uncles in the Marine Corps. I grew up in a military family 2 miles from Camp Pendleton. I'm not asking you for war stories or "if you killed anybody." Please.
You made an assertion that you have "inside information" on Israel, the IDF and it's conflict with the Palestinians. Specifically, you have made the claim that you have operated in both Gaza and the West Bank with the IDF. Through my own professional and personal life I have a number of very close friends in the IDF and have worked with members of the IDF in non-combat related matters. Simply put, I don't believe you have the experience you are pretending to have in Israel. That you are so defensive and evasive in an anonymous forum confirms my doubts. If your work was so top secret you wouldn't be posting about it in the first place.
For everything else I honor and thank you for your service to our country.
But back to my point, you demonstrate your ignorance of the situation by asserting that Israel somehow could magically control its terrorism problems through precise "pinprick" operations. My sniper comment was facetious. In the instances where such strikes are possible they are done.
Every dollar the foreign govt. hands out is done so because a lobbyist is whispering in someones ear. Military dollars are no different - how many congressman keep bullsh*t weapons programs alive to keep dollars flowing to their districts. Make no mistake about it, I am a hawk when it comes to our military and think a larger military and a larger military budget is a good thing. I object to your silly assertion that the money given to Israel (or Egypt or any other country) is taking away money that could be channeled towards our troops. Like I said, I grew up near Camp Pendleton and knew young Marine families on welfare and food stamps. That's an outrage that they do not get paid enough but don't blame Israel for it.
You are welcome to your opinions. Thank god this is america and you are allowed them.
I never claimed to have gone into battle with the IDF. My claim is that I have trained with them. Its a claim that happens to be true. As far a classified my training was classified. But it is also common knowledge that we have joint training ops with the IDF. No breach in security at all to admit I trained with the IDF or even to say weather I liked it or not. To give specific details is what would breach security. Evasive answers to your questions are a result of how they were asked. As I have said. Non-vets have not earned the right to question a vets career. By that I mean they have not earned the right to question a vet, harrass a vet, or belittle a vet in referance to their service. A fellow vet if they wish can challenge me on my career. They have earned that right. AS I have said before the IDF personel that I worked with impressed me with their skills and abilities. I learned a great deal from them. This doesn't change the fact that Israel has in the past and still does use over kill to make a point. If we did in Iraq what they do as a norm the american public would crap a biscuit.
Your family sounds much like mine. My great uncle served with Gen Mac in the filipines. LOL he was the generals barber. My father and 2 uncles in the Korean war. 2 other Uncles in Vietnam. Of my generation only 3 of us have served. I left the service because I would not serve under Clinton. How he handled Somalia was enough for me.
My assertion about foreign aid. Its simple really. We are in the hole. We spend more than we have. Quite simply foreign aid is something we can't afford. Foreign aid to anyone... As I said that money would be better spent on our own troops. Not that it would be, because regardless of what flag waving politicians say, our troops mean very little to any of them.
The biggest difference between you and I is that I don't believe Israel are the good guys. I don't believe the Palestinian terrorists are the good guys either. Both seem to target civilian populations for just about the same reasons. Retaliation, intimidation and neither seem to care a whole lot about the innocents that are killed.
You could simply have said that you have no intention of reconsidering in the light of any actual evidence what Ahmadinejad has been talking about in referring to the Palestinians and their claims against Israel. You could have said that even if it is a crude and distorted misrepresentation, you are content with with the caricature of his words and intentions that has been developed for you by a biased western media.
The repressive regime that was the Soviet Union has been wiped off the map. So, despite the seeming impossibility of the task at one time, have the brutal regimes of Mohammad Reza Pahlavi and Saddam Hussein. Such, in the view of Ahmadinejad and many others, must be the the fate of the brutal Zionist regime in Jerusalem as the pages of history are turned.
We could also discuss whether Ahmadinejad's complaint is that the Holocaust itself is a myth, or that the myth that has been built up from whatever the events of the Holocaust has been unfairly used by the West to the extreme detriment of Palestinians, a group that was not in any way involved in the Holocaust and can therefore bear no responsibility for any part of it. But we already have a caricature from the western media built up on this account as well, so there is perhaps no need to bother.
No reference either to any pushing of Israel into the sea. I will continue to suspect that this one was pulled from another time and circumstance and attributed to Ahmadinejad simply because you felt like it.
Meanwhile, the current debate over Iran-US relations includes calls from some less acute quarters for military action. The risks of resort to military action on the basis of imagination rather than reality should still be fresh in our minds. If we are not willing to invest in an honest comprehension of reality, then exploitable imagination will be all that is left to us.
Or, we could just continue to pretend that the guy's actual words and quotes (evidence!) - which we have in spades, are not really what he means. That it is all just a "caricature" by "right wing" circles. Like France.
I suppose all my Persian friends, many either themselves forced to flee after 1979 or children of those folks, all of whom speak fluent Farso, are part of the conspiracy too. After all, they must all be biased right wing members of the media when they confirm what Ahmandinajad is saying.
OK.
Last edited by rb4browns; 07-27-2008 at 09:32 AM..
You are welcome to your opinions. Thank god this is america and you are allowed them.
I never claimed to have gone into battle with the IDF. My claim is that I have trained with them. Its a claim that happens to be true. As far a classified my training was classified. But it is also common knowledge that we have joint training ops with the IDF. No breach in security at all to admit I trained with the IDF or even to say weather I liked it or not. To give specific details is what would breach security. Evasive answers to your questions are a result of how they were asked. As I have said. Non-vets have not earned the right to question a vets career. By that I mean they have not earned the right to question a vet, harrass a vet, or belittle a vet in referance to their service. A fellow vet if they wish can challenge me on my career. They have earned that right. AS I have said before the IDF personel that I worked with impressed me with their skills and abilities. I learned a great deal from them. This doesn't change the fact that Israel has in the past and still does use over kill to make a point. If we did in Iraq what they do as a norm the american public would crap a biscuit.
Your family sounds much like mine. My great uncle served with Gen Mac in the filipines. LOL he was the generals barber. My father and 2 uncles in the Korean war. 2 other Uncles in Vietnam. Of my generation only 3 of us have served. I left the service because I would not serve under Clinton. How he handled Somalia was enough for me.
My assertion about foreign aid. Its simple really. We are in the hole. We spend more than we have. Quite simply foreign aid is something we can't afford. Foreign aid to anyone... As I said that money would be better spent on our own troops. Not that it would be, because regardless of what flag waving politicians say, our troops mean very little to any of them.
The biggest difference between you and I is that I don't believe Israel are the good guys. I don't believe the Palestinian terrorists are the good guys either. Both seem to target civilian populations for just about the same reasons. Retaliation, intimidation and neither seem to care a whole lot about the innocents that are killed.
<shrug> You get a "10" for dancing around my questions (how dare you question me, why, I'm a vet and you are not!). I give you a "2" for style and a "1" for actually making sense. A mediocre showing all around. Better luck next time. Bye bye!
<shrug> You get a "10" for dancing around my questions (how dare you question me, why, I'm a vet and you are not!). I give you a "2" for style and a "1" for actually making sense. A mediocre showing all around. Better luck next time. Bye bye!
Ah now I understand. I was supposed to impress you. LOL sorry not my job.
Mr Brown you may feel that you are owed an explanation of my career, you may also feel that you have the right to know its details. You would be wrong on both counts. By the way how dare you question my career. You never earned that right. LOL I could care less if you do. I just won't give answers to questions your not entitled to.
I am sorry that I disagree with you about Israel. Your experiences with them are different than mine. I stand by my position that we owe them nothing. I stand by my position that just because its good for Israel does not make it good for the USA and in fact quite often the opposite is true.
You see things from only 1 point of view and refuse to look deeper. Thats fine its america and your right to see it as you see fit. I think you will notice that in all my posts I have never made an attempt to insult you. Can you claim the same? I have endeavored to be atleast semi-respectful can you claim the same?
If we met face to face would your approach change? I bet it would. I wonder what that says about you.
Shipmate it never fails to amaze me when people think vets oh them answers to whatever questions they ask. Then if we don't give the expected answer the vet is automatically a liar. LOL to earn the right to question its an easy task. Serve our country and wear the uniform.
Bily you may ask me anything and I'll do my level best to give you what ever detail you ask. Mr.Brown has never made an attempt to be anything but disrespectful and he shall receive no such cooperation.
I found this quite entertaining, a model builder on one of my model websites posted this, and the model builder of the tomcat responded. Guess he made his model too realistic lol
Ah now I understand. I was supposed to impress you. LOL sorry not my job.
Mr Brown you may feel that you are owed an explanation of my career, you may also feel that you have the right to know its details. You would be wrong on both counts. By the way how dare you question my career. You never earned that right. LOL I could care less if you do. I just won't give answers to questions your not entitled to.
I am sorry that I disagree with you about Israel. Your experiences with them are different than mine. I stand by my position that we owe them nothing. I stand by my position that just because its good for Israel does not make it good for the USA and in fact quite often the opposite is true.
You see things from only 1 point of view and refuse to look deeper. Thats fine its america and your right to see it as you see fit. I think you will notice that in all my posts I have never made an attempt to insult you. Can you claim the same? I have endeavored to be atleast semi-respectful can you claim the same?
If we met face to face would your approach change? I bet it would. I wonder what that says about you.
No need for me to be insulting. On that you are correct, my bad.
With regards to your military career, I stand by everything I've posted. Note how my request for you to simply back up your claims that you served in both in Gaza and the West bank with the IDF, and thus have some sort of special insight has been met with an attempt to spin it in to me questioning your entire career. And on top of that claiming your words are beyond question simply because you are a veteran.
Alas, as they say, "the wheels on the bus go round and round" as does this thread.
You are welcome to your opinions. Thank god this is america and you are allowed them.
I never claimed to have gone into battle with the IDF. My claim is that I have trained with them. Its a claim that happens to be true. As far a classified my training was classified. But it is also common knowledge that we have joint training ops with the IDF. No breach in security at all to admit I trained with the IDF or even to say weather I liked it or not. To give specific details is what would breach security. Evasive answers to your questions are a result of how they were asked. As I have said. Non-vets have not earned the right to question a vets career. By that I mean they have not earned the right to question a vet, harrass a vet, or belittle a vet in referance to their service. A fellow vet if they wish can challenge me on my career. They have earned that right. AS I have said before the IDF personel that I worked with impressed me with their skills and abilities. I learned a great deal from them. This doesn't change the fact that Israel has in the past and still does use over kill to make a point. If we did in Iraq what they do as a norm the american public would crap a biscuit.
Your family sounds much like mine. My great uncle served with Gen Mac in the filipines. LOL he was the generals barber. My father and 2 uncles in the Korean war. 2 other Uncles in Vietnam. Of my generation only 3 of us have served. I left the service because I would not serve under Clinton. How he handled Somalia was enough for me.
My assertion about foreign aid. Its simple really. We are in the hole. We spend more than we have. Quite simply foreign aid is something we can't afford. Foreign aid to anyone... As I said that money would be better spent on our own troops. Not that it would be, because regardless of what flag waving politicians say, our troops mean very little to any of them.
The biggest difference between you and I is that I don't believe Israel are the good guys. I don't believe the Palestinian terrorists are the good guys either. Both seem to target civilian populations for just about the same reasons. Retaliation, intimidation and neither seem to care a whole lot about the innocents that are killed.
-----------
" I would not serve under Clinton. How he handled Somalia was enough for me.
My assertion about foreign aid. Its simple really. We are in the hole. We spend more than we have. Quite simply foreign aid is something we can't afford. Foreign aid to anyone"
Yes sadly thats the way it goes elite units always get screwed. Rangers got screwed there but in truth ALL elite units wind up getting screwed real bad by both parties.
I agree NO foreign aid to anyone we need to fix up our country be it dams,bridges,etc but ENOUGH of foreign aid ESP since much winds up in private pockets .
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