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The "usurpation of Palestine" suggests that Israel needs to be destroyed.
And the fact that only "under the wing of Islam" can Islam, Christianity and Judaism "coexist" suggests the same thing.
Therefore, the assertion that "[Hamas] will not act against any of . . . those who are peaceful towards it from among non-Moslems" begs the question of who will and who will not decide the meaning of "peaceful." Clearly, only Hamas leaders, self-appointed representatives of "the wing of Islam."
I am increasingly beginning to believe that, for Hamas, this war is not about the establishment of a safe Palestinian state. For them, it is merely only one more war "under the banner of Jihad."
So I guess it's accurate to assert that they mean only "some Jews," if that refers to the Jews who are willing to surrender Israel and live "under the wing of Islam." How many Jews do you think that will be? How many Jews do you think Hamas thinks will accede to their plan for "peaceful" coexistence?
So I guess it's accurate to assert that they mean only "some Jews," if that refers to the Jews who are willing to surrender Israel and live "under the wing of Islam." How many Jews do you think that will be? How many Jews do you think Hamas thinks will accede to their plan for "peaceful" coexistence?
Not sure. I'm an atheist and I wouldn't accede to their ideas. But supplanting the state of Israel is no more inherently genocidal than supplanting the Union of South Africa. As to how many Jews will fight for Israel--that'll be their choice, just like in any other war, won't it? That's not the same as killing people because they are Jews.
Not sure. I'm an atheist and I wouldn't accede to their ideas. But supplanting the state of Israel is no more inherently genocidal than supplanting the Union of South Africa. As to how many Jews will fight for Israel--that'll be their choice, just like in any other war, won't it? That's not the same as killing people because they are Jews.
Hamas isn't interested in "supplanting" the state of Israel. They want to destroy it. And it's very clear, from their covenant, that if they were to succeed, any Jew who resisted--i.e., wasn't "peaceful"--would be killed "under the banner of Jihad." "Zionists"=Jews of Israel. No point in splitting hairs.
This is typical of these grade school arguments from Israeli apologists....because "someone said it" or "it's written down some document" that means they all follow it like robots. [ I'd imagine Palestinians take direction, orders, and laws as a herd of cats would] ...As if Americans walk around with a copy of the Constitution in their pocket and follow it to the tee. Hateful talk or hateful words having nothing whatsoever to do with "capabilty" or "willingness" to put them into action. There is also no connection whatsover to how many Hamas supporters even agee with the words....let alone know it exists in their charter. The incitful language in their charter may just be in there as a bargaining chip. If it were my homeland and these Israeli thugs did all sorts of murderous crimes against my family and neighborhood..I'd join Hamas too. Do some portion of Hamas members engage in terrorism? Of course they do, and it goes without saying it's wrong. Does the IDF commit war crimes, do they brutalize and humiliate Palestinians...Of course they they do....and it's just as vile as Hamas terrorism..
Last edited by padcrasher; 01-10-2009 at 12:18 AM..
This is typical of these grade school arguments from Israelie apologists....because "someone said it" or "it's written down some document" that means they all follow it like robots. [ I'd imagine Palestinians take direction, orders, and laws as a herd of cats would] ...As if Americans walk around with a copy of the Constitution in their pocket and follow it to the tee. Hateful talk or hateful words having nothing whatsoever to do with "capabilty" or "willingness" to put them into action. There is also no connection whatsover to how many Hamas members even agee with the words....let alone know it exists in their charter. The incitful language in their charter may just be in their as a bargaining chip.
I think you're in deep denial about Hamas. I am not an "Israeli apologist." The situation is complicated. It's infantile to set up one camp as "the good guys" and the other as "the bad guys."
Hamas isn't interested in "supplanting" the state of Israel. They want to destroy it. And it's very clear, from their covenant, that if they were to succeed, any Jew who resisted--i.e., wasn't "peaceful"--would be killed "under the banner of Jihad." "Zionists"=Jews of Israel. No point in splitting hairs.
I don't see anything wrong with them wanting to wipe Israel out as a state. I hope the Palestinians can do it. Lots of states have ended in our own lifetime: Northern and Southern Rhodesia, the Union of South Africa, the Republic of South Vietnam (actually, I missed that one by five weeks), the USSR, Yugoslavia, etc. Sometimes it's been peaceful and sometimes it hasn't. But if there's a country on earth that deserves to have its UN ticket revoked, it's surely Israel.
As to your other point, that Hamas is going to kill the Israelis who resist them--well duhh. How that's different from any other war is unclear.
I think you're in deep denial about Hamas. I am not an "Israeli apologist." The situation is complicated. It's infantile to set up one camp as "the good guys" and the other as "the bad guys."
Saying someone is in deep denial is not an argument against what I wrote.
If you think the Hamas charter is the "smoking gun"...then provide examples of how your average Hamas voter in Gaza, who's trying to do what's best for his family, is led around by this "charter"???
Do you have any evidence whatsover that your average Palestinian gives a crap about the "charter"???
I don't see anything wrong with them wanting to wipe Israel out as a state. I hope the Palestinians can do it. Lots of states have ended in our own lifetime: Northern and Southern Rhodesia, the Union of South Africa, the Republic of South Vietnam (actually, I missed that one by five weeks), the USSR, Yugoslavia, etc. Sometimes it's been peaceful and sometimes it hasn't. But if there's a country on earth that deserves to have its UN ticket revoked, it's surely Israel.
As to your other point, that Hamas is going to kill the Israelis who resist them--well duhh. How that's different from any other war is unclear.
Well, since you are advocating that one group of people "wipe out" another group of people, I think we can end the discussion here.
80% of Palestinians survive on $2.30 per day. They are imprisoned on all sides by the IDF. They are not allowed to leave their country. The IDF limits border crossings to humanitarian supplies ( sometimes) .
What pray tell could a avid fan of Article 7 do on his $2.30 budget?? We know already...put together some make-shift fertilizer rockets that shoot scrap metal...and killed a grand total of 7 Israelis in the course of two years before the invasion. ....LOL
This is my deep denial???????
I should post the video of a Palestinian dad last week who's for small sons had their brains splattered all over his apartment....One small incident that accounted for over half the Israeli rocket causalties in two whole years.
Collective punisment is a war crime...the Nazi's engaged in it. .....I don't give a crap that you found some Koran quotation from hundreds of years ago lodged in some Hamas document.
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