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I have followed the thread but some seem to be harping on meaningless short term performance. Markets often tend to overreact both on up and downsides. The drop of Dow from 11,2000 to 8000 today has more meaning in terms of the success of any administration.
I have followed the thread but some seem to he harping on meaningless short term performance. Markets often tend to overreact both on up and downsides. The drop of Dow from 11,2000 to 8000 today has more meaning in terms of the success of any administration.
I understand long term performance the point was over 350 billion has been pumped into the system 350 more about to be and another 825 more after that...unless the numbers have changed and not a single ounce of proof it's done anything to bolster confidence or change lending practices.
The real failure isn't in the the administration alone it was a false attempt to allow GSE's to play on the free market. What investor in the world would look at that and not say wow I can play with sure things backed by the government... The SEC, The Financial oversight, The underwriters, the loan stock pilers, the homeowner allowed to write their own salary and desired payment, lobbyist, the politicians that allowed those lobbyist to guide their choices instead of the people that hired them....the list goes on and on.
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I'm not going to say this is a partisan thing but this give a little idea as to what was going on behind the scenes... Yes it's from Karl Rove so if somehow that automatically disqualifies the information to you then so be it. There is plenty of information on real clear politics along with a few other sources constantly mentioned here and the sources in the story.
The largely unreported story is that to fend off regulation, the GSEs engaged in a lobbying frenzy. They hired high-profile Democrats and Republicans and spent $170 million on lobbying over the past decade. They also constructed an elaborate network of state and local lobbyists to pressure members of Congress.
When Republican Richard Shelby of Alabama, then chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, pushed for comprehensive GSE reform in 2005, Democrat Sen. Chris Dodd of Connecticut successfully threatened a filibuster. Later, after Fannie and Freddie collapsed, Mr. Dodd asked, "Why weren't we doing more?" He then voted for the Bush reforms that he once called "ill-advised."
But Mr. Dodd wasn't the only Democrat to heap abuse on the Bush reforms. Rep. Barney Frank of Massachusetts defended Fannie and Freddie as "fundamentally sound" and labeled the president's proposals as "inane." He later voted for the reforms. Sen. Charles Schumer of New York dismissed Mr. Bush's "safety and soundness concerns" as "a straw man." "If it ain't broke, don't fix it," was the helpful advice of both Sen. Thomas Carper of Delaware and Rep. Maxine Waters of California. Rep. Gregory Meeks of New York berated a Bush official at a hearing, saying, "I am just pissed off" at the administration for raising the issue.
Democrats had ready allies among lenders accustomed to GSEs buying their risky mortgages. For example, Angelo Mozilo, CEO of Countrywide Financial, complained that "an overly cumbersome regulatory process" would "reduce, or even eliminate, the incentives for the GSEs and their primary market partners."
It took Fannie and Freddie over three decades to acquire $2 trillion in mortgages and mortgage-backed securities. Together, they held $2.1 trillion in 2000. By 2005, the two GSEs held $4 trillion, up 92% in just five years. By 2008, they'd grown another 24%, to nearly $5 trillion. They held almost half of all American mortgages.
What is mysteriously left out by Rove or whomever is that all the Republican attempts at so-called reform had nothing to do with financial operations and everything to do with undercutting GSE market share, freeing up more room in which the investment banks could run the big-time profit-making hoaxes that eventually undercut the entire market. This is 100% a crisis manufactured by cowboy capitalism and a bunch of laissez-faire regulators who falsely believed that the free market could not possibly be as dumb as it actually was...
I understand long term performance the point was over 350 billion has been pumped into the system 350 more about to be and another 825 more after that...unless the numbers have changed and not a single ounce of proof it's done anything to bolster confidence or change lending practices.
The real failure isn't in the the administration alone it was a false attempt to allow GSE's to play on the free market. What investor in the world would look at that and not say wow I can play with sure things backed by the government... The SEC, The Financial oversight, The underwriters, the loan stock pilers, the homeowner allowed to write their own salary and desired payment, lobbyist, the politicians that allowed those lobbyist to guide their choices instead of the people that hired them....the list goes on and on.
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _______________________________________________
I'm not going to say this is a partisan thing but this give a little idea as to what was going on behind the scenes... Yes it's from Karl Rove so if somehow that automatically disqualifies the information to you then so be it. There is plenty of information on real clear politics along with a few other sources constantly mentioned here and the sources in the story.
The largely unreported story is that to fend off regulation, the GSEs engaged in a lobbying frenzy. They hired high-profile Democrats and Republicans and spent $170 million on lobbying over the past decade. They also constructed an elaborate network of state and local lobbyists to pressure members of Congress.
When Republican Richard Shelby of Alabama, then chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, pushed for comprehensive GSE reform in 2005, Democrat Sen. Chris Dodd of Connecticut successfully threatened a filibuster. Later, after Fannie and Freddie collapsed, Mr. Dodd asked, "Why weren't we doing more?" He then voted for the Bush reforms that he once called "ill-advised."
But Mr. Dodd wasn't the only Democrat to heap abuse on the Bush reforms. Rep. Barney Frank of Massachusetts defended Fannie and Freddie as "fundamentally sound" and labeled the president's proposals as "inane." He later voted for the reforms. Sen. Charles Schumer of New York dismissed Mr. Bush's "safety and soundness concerns" as "a straw man." "If it ain't broke, don't fix it," was the helpful advice of both Sen. Thomas Carper of Delaware and Rep. Maxine Waters of California. Rep. Gregory Meeks of New York berated a Bush official at a hearing, saying, "I am just pissed off" at the administration for raising the issue.
Democrats had ready allies among lenders accustomed to GSEs buying their risky mortgages. For example, Angelo Mozilo, CEO of Countrywide Financial, complained that "an overly cumbersome regulatory process" would "reduce, or even eliminate, the incentives for the GSEs and their primary market partners."
It took Fannie and Freddie over three decades to acquire $2 trillion in mortgages and mortgage-backed securities. Together, they held $2.1 trillion in 2000. By 2005, the two GSEs held $4 trillion, up 92% in just five years. By 2008, they'd grown another 24%, to nearly $5 trillion. They held almost half of all American mortgages.
This may surprise you but I voted for W in 2000. I had hoped that that he would be fiscally conservative, compassionate leader, but that was my error. Anyway, while I agree that many (including the Dems) are to blame, the buck has to stop somewhere - it usually ends up stopping at the leader's desk. Plus this leader did have the 2 houses with him for a large part of his tenure. I agree that even now, neither party has a good understanding of how the bailout money is being spent. From what I read, much of the promised oversight is not there even now, and we should blame both sides for this. If we muck this up, we are really in for very bad 2-4 years. Let us hope it does not happen.
Up 100 today. Whats gonna happen one of these days, is a 700 point drop, and it will stay down there until the bankrupcies and job losses stop and profits recover - about 2 years, cause its really that bad.
True but a lot of damage was done during the last 1.5 yrs. Most people I know did not have the foresight to pull their money out of 401ks. This includes me . Even most actively managed funds did not sell stocks to park money in cash. Our collective past actions caught up with us. Anway, we need to give Obama some time (2-3 yrs?) to see how he can dig us out of this mess.
Last edited by calmdude; 01-21-2009 at 11:34 AM..
Reason: added last sentence
That's right pumpkin, rich provide jobs, the jobs of minimum wage earners, who will never be able to afford a home to own, and the rich also believe in hiring illegals, to avoid paying minimum wages, taxes and benefits. the rich live off the backs of the poor wage earner. you have a lot to learn too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ttyl1979
If you think stealing from the rich will make the poor richer....you have a lot to learn. The rich provide the jobs. If you want to see a detailed report from a bailout just hang out....because you are getting ready to see a whole lot more bailout headed down the pipeline. Maybe Obama will disclose. You sound bitter. I hope just venting, because if you think wall street is not important then you shouldn't be allowed to vote.
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. Even most actively managed funds did not sell stocks to park money in cash. Our collective past actions caught up with us. Anway, we need to give Obama some time (2-3 yrs?) to see how he can dig us out of this mess.
